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Phase 2 environmental

Majorttk1

New member
Joined
Apr 9, 2021
Messages
1
Location
Charlotte NC
Hello, new to the site. I've been in the business for 19 years. Currently in the process of selling my shop. It had an in-ground two-leg lift that concrete over several years ago before I purchase the building. The buyer's bank is requiring Phase 2 because of the potential leaking problem. I was hoping to see if anyone may have gone through this process and if they had to remove the lift approximately how much had they had to pay someone to remove per bay. Tks for your help.
 
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ps2cho

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Mar 19, 2013
Messages
197
Environmentals are incredibly difficult these days, the bank will always eer on the side of ensuring they are not stuck with a lien that requires costly remediation...basically when a huge remediation is discovered, a lot of owners just hand the keys and say goodluck because its beyond the cost of what the buildings worth less their loan amount, then the bank is on the hook. Most times it ends up the bank never repossesses it because then they are required by law to remediate. So the property sits for decades unaddressed.

Best bet would be asking if they can take soil samples by drilling some holes without removing the equipment.

Not an expert, but from what I've seen in other environmental reports I have viewed.
 

kd3pc

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Joined
Aug 10, 2013
Messages
3,630
Location
Northern Neck
When you bought the building, did you get any paperwork on that mitigation that had been done.

Difficult to say what the costs will be, a lot depends on surface contamination vs. cylinder leakage over the years and more, deeper contamination.

Here in VA we had to pay a premium to have the soil removed, contained (55 gallon drums) and that sent off to one of two facilities in the state to burn off the contaminants. You can imagine what that cost and how many drums at $55 to $75 per drum, plus transport.

We then had to line the margins of the excavation and install test wells and bring in fresh "fill" from an EPA approved supplier. Local fill dirt was not allowed. Nor were local operators or contractors.

As a seller, I don't envy your position, that is where we were (it was well over $100K in mitigation on a $250K sale.) I would not be a buyer of ANY property with buried tanks, cylinders, lifts for fear of stringent regs and the Fed EPA forcing mitigation.
 

justanengineer

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Joined
Apr 5, 2011
Messages
7,722
Location
Motor City
My wife did hazmat remediation for awhile so I can attest that cost and pain varies greatly by locale. In some areas you pay a remediation company to do everything. In others you pay one company to remove the lift, another to remove soil and concrete, and a third to test and certify to the AHJ (City/county/state that everything was done and disposed of correctly. The more folks involved the more cost and pain. Good luck.


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SamuraiJack

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Joined
Sep 16, 2020
Messages
131
Location
Nashville, TN
Not sure about Charlotte but in WI there are required disclosures of any phase 2 findings to the state, whether the sales go through or not. Which would make sale to anyone much harder.
 

DuluthMachineWorks

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Joined
Mar 7, 2019
Messages
152
Location
Duluth, GA
So I do Phase I and Phase II environmental assessments for a living- I’ll add my two cents here. If you’re lucky, their bank is just looking to assess the in-ground lifts and not the whole site.

Typically for a site with hydraulic lifts, we would collect several soil samples from the vicinity of the lift either via hand augers, or via a small tracked drilling rig if we anticipate more than a couple of samples. These samples will then be sent off for laboratory analysis of various compounds, for hydraulics and vehicle maintenance, typically volatile organic compounds (gasoline and solvent constituents), polynuclear aromatic hydrocarbons (typically heavy petroleum constituents), and polychlorinated biphenyls (PCBs, used to be used as a hydraulic oil additive). Depending on the state they may have additional standards and methods used here.

It’s possible/likely that they will want to sample groundwater. Typically this is several temporary PVC monitoring wells installed via small drilling rig in to the surficial aquifer.

To get through the slab, they will probably want to core the concrete or use a hydraulic hammer on the rig. You as the seller should specify that all concrete holes are cored and patched following drilling- we’ve broken many slabs via hammering.

So if they find anything, this is then going to get compared to the applicable thresholds for whatever state you’re in, or to EPA thresholds. If you’re below the thresholds, the buyer will then have to decide whether they want to take on the liability for a site with low-level impacts. If you’re above, most buyers will walk away unless they are familiar with brownfields (former contaminated site) redevelopment.

All of this assessment, even though it is invasive, should be able to be completed without removing any equipment, although they will need access to the property and may make a hell of a mess if they set monitoring wells via rotary drilling. We usually try to use clean methods in environmental drilling though. In my area, costs for something like this range from 8k-15k depending on scope of work.

Feel free to hit me up for any more questions about the process if you want to know more. I should be able to answer questions about most steps of the process, as we provide turnkey service from Phase I all the way through redevelopment, with everything in between.

**Edit to add:** If you do want to allow the buyer to move forward with a Phase II ESA, I highly recommend finding a local environmental attorney or real estate attorney familiar with the state regulations, and heed their advice as to whether to move forward. We typically try to ensure that our assessments would not get a seller in to hot water even if the buyer walks away, but not all consultants/buyers extend this courtesy if they feel they can bully you in to selling for a much lower price.
 
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sweetk30

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Joined
Jan 2, 2011
Messages
2,306
Location
finger lakes area upstate ,ny
in my area or state i have heard first hand story's of the state going back on the original installer or who covered it over and did not remove it as per rules .

one guy had over 75k bucks for just a 250gal oil tank in the ground . he was the original family left and had sold it and it was resold and then found out .
 
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