Pits

[stinky]

Are these things still being built? lots of talk about lifts but no pits. I dont think
anyone puts them in anymore, anyone have one ?

 

[rdnkjeeper]

I know in my area they are illegal...getting too much polution from them.

 

[DynoDave]

Also, heavier fumes can settle into them, making them dangerous to work in.

 

[shopking68]

Plus you could probably buy a nice lift for the cost of putting one of those in.

 

[dink]

I would hate to drive over a pit....what if you werent parellel to the pit when driving over it? That would really really ****

 

[staylor]

I just finished one in my 30x36 shop. Zoning ordinance would not let me go any higher than 15 feet total height, so I had to settle for 9' walls. Thus, no lift. I grew up with a pit in my dads shop, so i built mine just like his. It is built with 8" block, but the top course is 4" block left about 3" higher than the floor so there is no chance of driving into the pit because of the 3" lip.

 

[W-Cummins]

If your subject to inspection ( need a building permit) You will find that a pit is a Class 1 division 1 hazardous location (by the NEC) and any electricial stuff has to be explosion proof can you say cha-ching $$$$$$$!

 

[Brian]

I believe insurance companys don't like pits either. Probably to many payouts from people falling in and getting hurt.

 

[Roadster]

If your subject to inspection ( need a building permit) You will find that a pit is a Class 1 division 1 hazardous location (by the NEC) and any electricial stuff has to be explosion proof can you say cha-ching $$$$$$$!

You hit the nail on the head. Flamable vapors like gasoline tend to settle in low spots, making a pit in the garage a real explosion and fire hazard.

 

[Stuart in MN]

Strictly speaking, the section in the Code book that defines a pit as a Class 1, Division 1 rating is in the section about commercial garages...it doesn't say anything about residential garages as far as I can tell. My guess is that's because the people who wrote the Code never expected anyone to put a pit in their garage at home. That said, in practice I think a residential pit should fall under the same rules.

If you provide continuous ventilation in the pit (at six air exchanges per hour) it will reduce the hazardous rating to Class 1, Division 2. That's better but still requires special wiring techniques and safety precautions, besides the additional cost and complexity of a ventilation system.

 

[W-Cummins]

Strictly speaking, the section in the Code book that defines a pit as a Class 1, Division 1 rating is in the section about commercial garages...it doesn't say anything about residential garages as far as I can tell. My guess is that's because the people who wrote the Code never expected anyone to put a pit in their garage at home. That said, in practice I think a residential pit should fall under the same rules.

Well if the AHJ is going to allow it at all, what section of the code do you think they would use

 

[krooser]

Virtually every truckstop, heavy truck dealer and truck quiklube joint has at least one pit for performing oil changes and grease jobs...in every state in the union...common practice.

The next time you're traveling stop into a Flying J, T/A, Petro, Pilot, etc...take a look...both quik lube joints in my hometown also have pits...

And no ventilation systems that I've seen...

 

[W-Cummins]

Virtually every truckstop, heavy truck dealer and truck quiklube joint has at least one pit for performing oil changes and grease jobs...in every state in the union...common practice.

The next time you're traveling stop into a Flying J, T/A, Petro, Pilot, etc...take a look...both quik lube joints in my hometown also have pits...

And no ventilation systems that I've seen...

The code dosn't require the ventilation system, but it allows you to install one. If installed it changes the requirements for the area in and around the pit as far as the required equipment you have to use. This also effects the construction of the whole building. Also note that this is the current requirements per the NEC. The older installed stuff is not normally required to update to the latest code, unless changes are made to the building or the pit

 

[oldgoat]

Where I live they are illegal, but I know of 2 guys that put them in anyway. I don't like them in one respect because they are a open pit when you are trying to work around the vehicle from the bottom and the top. Guess I should say that the one guys pit is about 6 ft or 7ft wide so he has ramps you drive across which leaves the sides open and if you don't think it is easy to almost fall in.

 

[MetalMangler]

I've heard in NYS that the new QuickLube joints can't do pits, but the definition of a pit doesn't exclude what amounts to a basement. One guy explained that since the pit had a seperate entrance/exit from the pit rather than straight up, it wasn't a pit.

On the other hand, my gfather had one, and apparently hated it, for all the work he did in it. Between worrying about his kids or their kids (me and my sister/cousins) falling in, worrying about himself falling in, or the time he had a gas tank leak while welding under the car, he just never missed it when he built his retirement home and workshop.

MM

 

[krooser]

Where I live they are illegal, but I know of 2 guys that put them in anyway. I don't like them in one respect because they are a open pit when you are trying to work around the vehicle from the bottom and the top. Guess I should say that the one guys pit is about 6 ft or 7ft wide so he has ramps you drive across which leaves the sides open and if you don't think it is easy to almost fall in.

What set-up do the quick-lube joints have in Wichita?

 

[stimpy]

the quick lube joints here in Illinois use flexicore floors with access holes over a basement but all the fixtures are explosion proof ,, heck if I had the money and the house thats what I would do, for the extra storage/work room and put a winch in above to bring up the heavy stuff (engines ,snowmobiles , lawn tractors ) , and put plates over the hole when not in use .

 

[ddjjeep]

If you ask me, they **** to work in and are a saftey hazard. The only real use for one is oil changes, who wants to pull a trany out while down in there?

 

[the intimidator]

If you ask me, they **** to work in and are a saftey hazard. The only real use for one is oil changes, who wants to pull a trany out while down in there?

if i had the mony to put a pit in i would have one i think they are great for doing oil changes exaust work ect i think you would only need a good size explosion proof exaust fan to keep gas fumes and carbon monoxide out and you would be good to go for what it's worth you could always reccess the top to fit in a steel cover/grate that would sit flush with the garage floor then you wont have to worry abought falling in in the middle of the night lol plus they are alot cheaper then lifts to install and you dont need really tall ceilings to make use of them for us guys with out the mony or space for a lift but are always crawling under are trucks for something or the other they would be great to

and i would rather pull a ****** standing up with a proper jack then in the drive with the truck on jack stands and me on my back

 

[GarageHonky]

I think a pit would be fine, provided it is in the right place! Obviously, if you have a one car garage you don't need a pit.

Just for arguments sake, in a big enough garage (or should I say "shop") I think it could be useful, especially if you don't have the allowable headroom for a "lift". Frankly, those two legged style lifts scare the **** out of me! But a lot of people like them, have them, and use them with no problems.

Valvoline Oil changers around here have the "basement type" version of a pit. I always thought that would be really cool to have a set up like that. I could store all the "undercarriage" type equipment in the basement and also use it for supplies, etc. And with proper ventilation it would be no different than a basement on the house as far as I'm
concerned.
As for falling into a pit...well, anybody anytime should be careful in any garage. If it were your garage you'd know the pit was there and anybody not being careful or so small as to need suppervision shouldn't be in there anyway.

I'm old school..."pits" don't scare me. I've used them lots of times and never had a problem. As a matter of fact, I think one would be really cool if a person were fixing their garage up in an "early classic style."

And as for ventilation and the pit, how many of you guys store gasoline in your garage?

If you want a pit, "and" it is legal where you live, treat it like any other tool in the garage...with respect and safety.

Like I said, I'm old school...shoot, I'd love to have a "Steam" rack!

JMHO
Dave

 

[oldgoat]

I think the quick lube places have the pits, but for residental use the pits aren't legal and insurance companies frown on them.

 

[W-Cummins]

And as for ventilation and the pit, how many of you guys store gasoline in your garage?
Dave

That would be every one that parks their car/truck/motorcycle in their garage ( unless they are a diesel

 

[EBodiesRule]

I just moved from a home that had a pit...with a root cellar on one end separated by a door. It wasn't a pit anymore but my access to my root cellar! The fella we bought the place from was a HUGE gardener and used the cellar extensively. In 15 years, I never did. But I DID use the pit and loved it. I had 2x8 planks installed cross-wise and could drive right on top of it. I jacked up the rear end of my Cuda by putting the floor jack right on the pumpkin and, you guessed it, on a plank over the pit. Never even creaked or cracked. I did major work on my car from that pit and it was fabulous. The only thing to ever fall in in 15 years was our dim-witted Fox Terrier...she shot out through the open basement door, into the garage and instantly disappeared into the pit. She never yelped or anything; probably didn't have time! She was fine, but I wish I had been home to see my wife and daughter crawl done the access ladder on one end to fetch the dog in their heels and pantyhose!!

 

[kartracer55]

A lift will be much more benificial than would a bit, plus, I have heard insurance companies flip when it comes to pits... liability and all that fun stuff. Think abotu how much it woudl cost to install the Pit VS just buying a 2 post lift, which will enable you to do even more!

Jim

 

[mark_w]

my brother put a pit in his shop on the ranch. works good for him. he puts some 2x12 planks over it when he isn't using it. He plumbed it for air and water too.

 

[krooser]

My neighbor when I was a kid, Joe Nieth, had a pit in an old carriage house behind his place.

I have great memories of his kid Tom working on his '40 Ford...or the time Tom's buddy re-painted his two-week old '59 Chevy with the exhaust-end of an Eletrolux vacuum cleaner with the insecticide spray attachment. I guess the guy's dad wasn't too impressed that the kid pretty much ruined his high school graduation present!

 

[fireman]

Not only are pits illegal in my area, if you put one in, your insurance co. will deny any claim that is attributed to one (fire, personal injury etc.). I've been doing fire inspections of business' in my area for almost 30 years and have never seen one.
Seems to me that they would be a pain in the **** to use.

 

[Uncle Buck]

I have seen several, and used several in my area. I am sure the insurance companies frown on them, and I would not even want to go in the direction of codes and enforcement. With all that said, I would not for a moment hesitate to put a pit in my personal home shop, if I had the room for a pit + access stairs, but alas I do not have enough room.

 

[vintagegto]

They remind me more of a grave than a place to work. In fact a lot of people died or got hurt pretty bad because of the limited space so what ever happens when your down there could be a problem. Some problems I remember were the fumes that collect down there when working with a gas tanks. I wouldn't get into one.

 

[sberry]

Well you still have to jack it up to get the wheels off which is about half the work on a car. I wouldnt want a nasty ole pit, have to walk around the hole all the time, bah climbing under , in and out, rig a floor jack or sherry picker around. Very few places would have legit use for a real pit and a hoist is cheap. dial 1 888 hoist and you have one delivered in a couple days. General service work nothing beats a 2 post hoist.

 

[rodm1]

Anyone have ideal Width and depth dimensions?

 

[bazzateer]

Obviously, if you have a one car garage you don't need a pit.

Why not? A 1 car garage is less likely to have enough height/room for a lift making a pit even more desirable.

 

[bazzateer]

Regarding the legality/insurance issues in the USA (the home of litigation?). Are garden fish-ponds also illegal? It's just that an unguarded pond in your garden is more likely to have someone fall into it than a properly secured pit in your properly secured garage. If you're using the pit then you supervise it. If you're not using it you secure the opening with planks, grates or whatever. If you're not even using the garage then surely you lock it?
A pond in your garden is much harder to make safe.

Just a thought, maybe ponds aren't allowed?

 

[galwaytt]

....fwiw, I worked in the UK in the early '90's, and two young mechanics were killed in a pit, whilst welding and exhaust. Petrol fumes had collected in the pit and.........you can guess the rest.

Nope, not doing it - life's too short. Literally.

A local garage has one, and I've forgotten how many times I've nearly walked into the frickin' thing - it's like flying, takes a while to think in that extra...'axis'........which is fine when you do. Your visitor's, oth, won't.........


I've seen a commercial one, years ago, which was a complete basement, c/w benches, and the 'floor' was a metal grid system, so you could actually see into it, and it was bright, was well as being the full width of the 'shop. Big $$ build, though.

 

[Stuart in MN]

Man, there sure is a lot of old threads being dredged up from the dead these days...

Garage pits may or may not be against local codes, depending on where you live. However, they can be dangerous since gas and/or exhaust fumes can settle in them. As mentioned above, it can be lethal. Per the national electric code, a pit in a commercial garage is a hazardous area - the electrical wiring (including lights and outlets) needs to be explosion proof. I would personally also recommend including a ventilation fan. I haven't found anything in the code that refers to residential garage pits, but common sense says the same hazards could exist there as well.

 

[ihredo4]

We have a backhoe and a couple tracked pieces of equipment. Would you rather crawl under a dozer that weighs 20K when you have it blocked up? I don't. How about working on the boom of the backhoe? I dont like ladders. And it makes working on the top of the trencher boom a breeze when you can set it down in a hole and work on it at chest level. When we build the next building it will have a pit in it. We will probaly put it into its own confined room but it makes life much easier to work on any of them.

 

[c39er]

Regarding the legality/insurance issues in the USA (the home of litigation?). Are garden fish-ponds also illegal? It's just that an unguarded pond in your garden is more likely to have someone fall into it than a properly secured pit in your properly secured garage. If you're using the pit then you supervise it. If you're not using it you secure the opening with planks, grates or whatever. If you're not even using the garage then surely you lock it?
A pond in your garden is much harder to make safe.

Just a thought, maybe ponds aren't allowed?

I'm going to fill in my fish pond now. I don't want my insurance company to have pay any claims on it! Our insurance companys are having a rough go as it is.
Oh my.....