Placing a Disconnect between meter bas and breaker box?

[tlmartin84]

Our local power company gives out FREE meter base boxes. They are plain janes though with no disconnect.

Once I come out of the back of the meter base can I run the leads into some type of disconnect box directly behind it, and then up into the breaker panel? Making everything accessible on the inside.

So that if I want to work in the panel, I can hit the disconnect and have a dead panel? (My electrical inspector said as long as everything from the base to the panel was within six feet I am ok).

If so, what type of disconnect switch/box should I be looking at (200 AMP service)? Any links would be appreciated.

 

[RunninOnEmpty]

Yes, you can do this no problem. Simply Google for a "safety switch" and enclosure rated for your service capacity or higher. You can probably also find them at your local hardware store.

If you're not sure of what brand to go with, I suggest Square D.

For example: http://static.schneider-electric.us/docs/Electrical Distribution/Safety Switches/3100CT0901.pdf

Electricians can disconnect a panel easily by simply pulling the meter, though your power company may have a lock on the meter to prevent the homeowner from removing it, and it may be illegal for the homeowner to do so depending on the area (mainly because some people would remove it to try to bypass it and get "free" electricity).

Some towns/cities require all buildings to have an exterior disconnect switch that could be used by emergency crews like firefighters, but as far as I know this rule is not that common these days.

 

[sberry]

You don't always need another disconnect, the service main may be the only one. A lot more doesn't always make it a little better, extra cost, extra fitting, extra connections and exra ground requirements. If you need to locate the panel elsewhere in the building other than near the entrance then a disconnect makes sense. A disconnect like a QO 200 8 space with feed thru is great for powering aux buildings, well but simply adding a disc isn't good for much. That's what the main in the main is for.

 

[tlmartin84]

WOW, those things are $200.00. Probably be better off to just buy a base with a built in disconnect and some extra breaker slots. Just have to walk my lazy **** around the building to kill the power..........

 

[tlmartin84]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cutlet-Hamm...017?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e8db63731

How about a used one?

I notice a lot of these say 600V.......Are they still used for residential 200 AMP 240V services?

 

[ishiboo]

I did this. My service entrance cable failed, when the PoCo disconnected me so I could replace it, I installed a 100A outdoor panel with a single two-pole 100A breaker in it, directly under the meter.

Since then it's come in handy several times... I replaced the main panel in my house, installed a generator interlock, installed current transducers which involved removing the hot feeds, etc... all much safer tasks (doable at all) with the disconnect ahead of my panel!

No, 100A service is not a lot... but this summer I will be feeding my house with 200A from the barn, so that I will only be paying for one meter and a new backup generator will handle everything and not be next to the house. Though I've never run out of power.

 

[RunninOnEmpty]

How about a used one?

I notice a lot of these say 600V.......Are they still used for residential 200 AMP 240V services?

It's fine for the disconnect to be rated higher than your service both in voltage and in current (as long as you're not relying on the disconnect's breaker if you get one that has a breaker and since your distribution panel already has its own main breaker, that's fine).

 

[Mustang51js]

If you do it then that will be your main breaker, and your panel will have to be set up as a sub panel. If you don't need the disconnect then don't bother with it.

 

[ishiboo]

If you do it then that will be your main breaker, and your panel will have to be set up as a sub panel. If you don't need the disconnect then don't bother with it.

Which involves... screwing one additional wire down and removing one or two bonding screws, and moving the ground rod connection over. Adds an additional 3 seconds.

 

[Cmreschke]

Plus the proper sized cable. Once you leave your disconnect your 4/0 alum (assumed cable) is no longer good for the 200 amps.

 

[Norcal]

Plus the proper sized cable. Once you leave your disconnect your 4/0 alum (assumed cable) is no longer good for the 200 amps.

If it's just a disco/circuit breaker then 4/0 AL is just fine.

 

[Mustang51js]

Which involves... screwing one additional wire down and removing one or two bonding screws, and moving the ground rod connection over. Adds an additional 3 seconds.

And another $200 plus dollars spent for no reason, but hey it's just money

 

[ishiboo]

And another $200 plus dollars spent for no reason, but hey it's just money

I found a lot of reasons for mine... I love it!

 

[Aceman]

moving the ground rod connection over. Adds an additional 3 seconds.

Moving the wire to the rods over to the new disconnect doesn't usually take just 3 seconds. Especially if it's short and you have to rerun the wire continuous to the first rod.

Then you have to separate neutrals/grounds since they're all most likely landed on the same bar(s). A lot of older panels don't have a separate ground bar which means you have to add one. But then the grounds on one side of the panel are too short to reach the ground bar, so you either add a second on the other side(if you have room) or you have to splice a bunch of them together and then pigtail a longer one to reach the only ground bar.

None of this takes just 3 seconds.

 

[ishiboo]

Moving the wire to the rods over to the new disconnect doesn't usually take just 3 seconds. Especially if it's short and you have to rerun the wire continuous to the first rod.

Then you have to separate neutrals/grounds since they're all most likely landed on the same bar(s). A lot of older panels don't have a separate ground bar which means you have to add one. But then the grounds on one side of the panel are too short to reach the ground bar, so you either add a second on the other side(if you have room) or you have to splice a bunch of them together and then pigtail a longer one to reach the only ground bar.

None of this takes just 3 seconds.

Obviously an exaggeration, mr. literal. IMO it's worth it. I'd probably cheat and leave the 3-wire service/ground rods/etc. between the two if it wasn't inspected.

 

[Aceman]

Obviously an exaggeration, mr. literal. IMO it's worth it. I'd probably cheat and leave the 3-wire service/ground rods/etc. between the two if it wasn't inspected.

I couldn't add a disconnect without it being inspected. The power companies over here won't turn the power back on without a permit number. And I don't pull meters myself.

I had PP&L kill an ag service once so I could replace a wire and burned lug on the line side of a fused disconnect. The power company asked me for a permit number before I could schedule the shutdown. So I pulled a permit. When the inspector showed up a couple days later for inspection he asked me what he was looking at. When I told him I'd simply replaced a wire he gave me the look like I was wasting his time.

I couldn't blame him, it's a racket.

The power companies over here are something else....

 

[Mustang51js]

I found a lot of reasons for mine... I love it!

The only reason I can see having if if you don't need it,is if you are afraid to work in panel with the power on and shut it off anytime you add a wire

 

[tlmartin84]

The only reason I can see having if if you don't need it,is if you are afraid to work in panel with the power on and shut it off anytime you add a wire

THIS IS MY MAIN REASON......

I am not an electrician, and this being something I do not do everyday I like knowing that the box is DEAD while I have my hands in it.

I will have this inspected prior to the power company hooking up, it is required. Once I have the breaker panel installed, I can handle everything else from there.

 

[sberry]

I agree that ishboo can find a use for it but the home brew type does not need extra equipment. Its not for everyone. Great for Norcal, ok for me as I can and understand the additional issues as well as cost.
But in common residential setting you cant beat simple code requirements, all the bonding and ground in one local etc, cant miss.

 

[sberry]

If I was going to bother with an another disconnect would likely be looking for additional lugs or spaces along with it. The second reason might be I had it for free and was intending on a genset in between.

 

[Mustang51js]

If your doing it for that reason only,pick up a 200 amp service rated transfer switch this way you have half the job done if you decide to do a whole house gen. Your normal main panel will only have a small spot on front of two lugs that would be hot if you turned off main

 

[nick2010tundra]

I did this with my house, I did it because I wanted to place my panel in my utility room a good 25 feet from the meter mount, So what I did was put a fused Disconnect ( which I think you must use a fused one, or else the cable going from the disconnect to panel is not protected.)

 

[Norcal]

If you want to have a disco outside use a meter can w/ a 200A circuit breaker, it will make for a nice clean install. B-Line/Circle AW, & Milbank both offer them, just that the Milbank may have a Zinsco knockoff main breaker.

 

[sberry]

I did this with my house, I did it because I wanted to place my panel in my utility room a good 25 feet from the meter mount, So what I did was put a fused Disconnect ( which I think you must use a fused one, or else the cable going from the disconnect to panel is not protected.)

Yes you would need a disc to place the panel in another room away from where it entered the building. The basic idea has some to do with wire protection but also emergency location. They don't want it in a mystery location.

 

[tlmartin84]

OK, some you guys have already mentioned the grounding issue. My inspector said that I needed to select a disconnect/safety switch that would have lugs for ALL of the grounds.

How many grounds would that be?

Ground rod wire
Ground rod wire
meter base ground
panel ground

4 total??

 

[tlmartin84]

As of right now I want to use the switch, it wll save me $100 over buying an base/disconnect combo. Plus it saves me walking all the way around the building to shut power off if I need to.

So I just need to get all of my ducks in a row on the wiring.

 

[Mustang51js]

Not sure how your state does it,but one #6 for ground rods,one #4 for water meter,then you will have the ground going to your panel from whatever wire you choose. In your sub panel you will need to separate the bonding screw and remove all the ground wires of that bar,then add a separate ground bar in sub panel and attach all the grounds. You will prob have to buy a lug for that ground bar to fit at least a #2al. Most disconnects will have enough lugs for what you need, just most of the work for you would be in the new subpanel