Please! Need Help Identifying/Restoring Wilton Vise :).

[ishmaela]

Hey Guys. New to bench vises and the restoration of them. Bought this vise today for $60. It's 71 lbs and approx. 18" long. The clamps are 5" wide and the screw extends 9+ inches. It has been painted a few times, so some of the details are hard to read right now...at first I thought it was from Chicago...but I chipped off some paint, and it looks like there is an S before the CHI . The "Wilton" name reads straight across (not arched...not sure if that matters or helps). And the cap on the back end of the screw seems to be missing. It isn't perfect, but it seems pretty sturdy and stable. Anyway, any help or guidance would be much appreciated. Happy Holidays!

 

[bluebolt]

Some more pictures would help. Looks like a 9500. If it does say Chicago it is earlier but it does have the newer design with the taller jaws. Is the jaw support ledge broken off on the static jaw?

 

[ishmaela]

I'm thinking Schiller is more likely based on what I've scrapped off.

Not completely sure what a support ledge is...though there are a few busted pieces. I tried to capture them in a few of the pics. Honestly, I was originally just looking for a good old vise, and stumbled on this one. I think the price was OK even considering the damage...but that's why I'm asking the experts . Thank you for your help.

 

[BFBOB]

Welcome to garage Journal!
And, let me be the first to belabor the obvious: 5" Wilton bullet swivel base for $60 = You ****!

 

[bluebolt]

Schiller Ppark makes more sense, it looked a little later. On your rear jaw insert there should be a ledge running underneath it. What little I can see of yours looks like it may be broken. Remove your front jaw and take a picture of just the rear jaw. Some more cleanup would help LOL.

 

[drivesitfar]

are you able to use www.Photobucket.com for a free account to store your pictures and then bring over the links to post on this thread. a lot of us have old eyes and can help you more if your pictures are bigger.

also if you can brush off more of the paint so the flaws if any will show up so we can comment. at worst case you should get your money back just selling the parts to members that need some for their Wilton. best case you will have a 60 year old US made vise sitting on your bench.

once you pull out the front part of the vise (don't drop it) there is a slide that fits in a channel on the bottom of it. if you wipe that clean there might be a date on it and maybe an exp. let us know what that says and we should be able to tell you how old your vise is.

 

[ishmaela]

Thanks, everyone. I really appreciate the help!

Sorry about the pics. This should help some. They are the only pics I have in there right now, so I'll just do the one link. Click on one, and it should blow up.
http://s794.photobucket.com/user/ishmaela/library/?view=recent&page=1

Yes, a portion of the slide is broken off towards the front...not sure if that is replaceable? And there is a small portion of the collar on the static jaw side that is chipped off on top (something tells me these two "injuries" happened at the same time from someone being...dumb...). Also, the dust cap and one of the swivel base rods are missing.

While I don't think it is collector quality, I think I may still restore it, because it is just too cool to let rot. And it will do everything I need it to do in it's current condition (very secure and stable jaws). The action is butter smooth the full length of travel, so I consider myself fortunate considering it's other issues.

I'll try to do some more work on it and get more pics, but it will be difficult the next few days due to the holidays.

What is the best way to get the paint off? I was able to find a sandblaster in my small town, but we won't be able to do anything with it until we get above freezing (it is -1f right now...). Also, I can't seem to get the swivel base loose. Any thoughts? It doesn't look particularly corroded, but I've been soaking it in WD-40 with no luck yet...but I'll keep working on it!

Thanks again, and be safe out there!

Anthony

 

[drivesitfar]

Anthony,
good luck on your Wilton restoration. I looked at all your pictures and besides the piece missing on the slide area I couldn't see anything else that wouldn't make it work correctly. it has had a tough life, but sounds like it is in good hands now. did you take out the slide all the way yet to check and see if there is a production date on the slide? also in case you want to just remove the screw all you have to do is remove the 3 screws on the horseshoe looking piece and the screw will come out by just unscrewing it while the jaws should be staying in the same position. then the dynamic jaw will just slide out (fairly heavy so don't drop it). take a very close look around the area where the cast has a piece broken off so you don't have a crack started that will eventually cause a major problem. most of the guys restoring these Wiltons also take the removable jaws out, but it looks like the screws have had some abuse so you might want to leave the jaws on in your case unless you are capable of the repairs needed if a screw breaks or is stripped.

check the Vise thread because we have talking about de rusting vises with molasses and electrolysis. WD 40 works on some things that is for sure but there are also other products that are made for rust. Kano has a product that I use that is $17 a can at my local Nuts and Bolts super stores. also a few gallons of diesel in a 5 gallon bucket and dropping your vise in it for a few days is another option. hammering it should be more of a tapping motion with maybe a 2 x 4 protecting it or tapping it with a rubber type hammer because you don't want to add to the tough life it already has had.

be careful not too spend too much money on some of these vises to repair them if you are not going to be the one using it for years because they do have a limit on what a buyer will pay for them. of course you'll spend more on the first one to start the learning process that should help you with other vises and tools in the future. good luck

Merry Christmas

 

[bluebolt]

I don't see any support ledge under your static jaw. If true that means if you have something clamped in there and are bending or hitting on the part all the stress is on the screws.

Also the swivel plate on the bottom looks homemade, never seen one like that before.

 

[EDGAR]

The two Wilton 500 shown below do not have a support ledge under the tube, or body, that houses the slide tube like the one shown in picture 3, in the Wilton NO. 4. The OP vise could be an older model 500 series vise. Picture 6 shows another NO. 4, in red, without the support ledge, maybe an earlier model than the No. 4 shown in pic 3?

 

[ishmaela]

Thank you everyone for your help. I really appreciate all the input.

Special thanks go drivesitfar. I appreciate that guidance. Honestly, this will hopefully be the "last vise I ever buy". There is a lot of gunk around the replaceable jaw screws, so I need to dig those out to see for sure...but my bet is they are more stuck than I care to deal with from a functional standpoint. I haven't had a chance to tear it completely down yet, but maybe tomorrow night I'll get some time. Then maybe we'll have some more production info. I'll keep everyone posted.

Perhaps "restore" is a bit stronger of a word than I mean, as it will still be very much a working vise not a show piece. I'm not necessarily looking to replace the dust cover or dump a bunch of money into it (I like that it was a $60 vise ), but I feel like the old girl at least deserves a good sandblasting and powder coat. It looks like I can get it sandblasted for about 10$...still working on the paint portion of it. Before I get it sandblasted, should I degrease the entire vise (every single part)? If so, what do I re-grease with?

Is there anything else you all see I should really focus on repairing from a purely "this vise will last" standpoint? Are we still thinking this is a "newer" 9500?

Thank you all, and I hope you had a very Merry Christmas! Stay safe out there.

Anthony

 

[drivesitfar]

glad I can help you with your Wilton. post more pictures as you take it apart further and we'll see if there is anything to be concerned about. as I mentioned once you take the screw all the way out and check both sides for cracks that is a good start to see if you have a good vise.

with a piece missing on top of where the slide goes in could be a bigger problem or some past user just missed hitting his project with a hammer and knocked it off. hopefully it wasn't dropped and that is the beginning of a crack.

also when you pull out the front (dynamic) part of the vise and rub off the grease from the bottom of the slide the production date or the expiration date will maybe appear. EXP means it was made 5 years prior to that date.

go ahead and use any degreaser if you want to before sandblasting and wipe as much of the grease off with paper towels. or if sandblasting person doesn't care that his material gets greasy then have him blast it off.

do you have a 5 gallon empty bucket that you can buy a gallon or two of diesel to put in and drop the Wilton in it for a couple days to try and free up the swivel? or have you already used a spray to free it up?

best of luck and i'm crossing my fingers that there are not any issues other than what you already know about.

Merry Christmas

 

[EDGAR]

Looks more like a Wilton 500 than a Wilton 9500. Why do you think it is a 9500?

The first vise was identified by the GJ member who posted it as a Wilton 500. See that under the jaws the tower goes down in a straight line. Also, if you check post # 10, the newer Wilton 500, in black, also has a straight line under the jaws.

The second vise is a 9500. See that under the jaws, the tower has a curve going down.

Your vise looks like the first one.

 

[ishmaela]

Welp...I know I said tomorrow, but I got a wild hair...so here we are . I've added 5 shots.

http://s794.photobucket.com/user/ishmaela/library/?sort=3&page=1

I think I'm OK on the cracking front. It looks clean through and through. I didn't see any date stamped on the slide, though. Just a 117. I think the picture of that portion is pretty well. How long is the threaded portion of the body supposed to be? It looks like it goes about 3-4" deep on this...and then it looks spiraled but much wider...but I think it might just be dried grease build up. I just don't know enough about these things to say for sure, though.

As for diesel...I can get some...but I don't have a pick up truck or anything to transport it in. I would just hate to throw some of that in the back of my car if it leaked. Are there any alternatives? I've been using some WD-40 to loosen it up...but I've had limited success (AKA: none). I'm hesitant to take a hammer to it of any sort...but that concern may need to pass. I will also need to find something to put in the other locking bolt to twist it.

Also, I scraped some of the gunk out of the jaw screws...and I'm not completely sure how these are held on anymore . I really don't see any fasteners...but they seem to be rock solid. Any thoughts on that?

Thanks again.

 

[ishmaela]

Gotcha, EDGAR. I see what you're saying. Someone else suggested a 9500, so I wasn't sure. Based on your sample pic, I tend to think you're right. Thanks!

 

[drivesitfar]

you are doing great. I think the date on your slide is 177 which could be January of 1977 when it was made in the US and others correct me if my eyes are not seeing this correctly.

now you are at a stage that is a little trickier and takes a little more skill and a nice tool. to remove the piece that the screw goes into their is either one pin going under that piece that holds it in that you need to drive through with a small thin punch or maybe a nail if you don't have a punch. or it could be 2 small pins that push into the middle so you can push the screw insert out and then remove the pins. since you want to sandblast it would be nice to get this out but not necessary if you want to just leave it for another day.

there doesn't appear to have much grease on the main screw so maybe not a lot of cleaning before sandblasting. I personally would leave the jaw on and not touch them other than to shine them up with a wire wheel for now because they look to be working correctly and have been hammered pretty good in the past.

do you have a gallon or 2 gallon gas can to get some diesel and then dump it in a 5 gallon bucket when you get home? another option is to go to the local hardware store and buy a can of their best de rusting spray that might break the swivel nut loose. there are other methods like molasses or alcohol instead of diesel. best option would be to make an electrolysis tank and you can not only de rust this vise, but any other rusty tool or piece of metal you like. not sure you are ready for that but there are a couple links posted on the vise thread that might help you see how hard it is.

maybe at this point go to the sandblaster and spend $10 to make sure you have a good solid vise after he takes off years of old paint and stuff. the sandblasting won't be able to get all your Wilton perfectly clean, but you can tape the slide, screw insert, and maybe the jaws, put a coat or two of paint on it, grease it and then put it back together and use it. and a $1 freeze plug at the auto store to cover that back opening and you'll have a vise you can use.

I don't mind helping you and I hope I'm explaining these steps so you can understand them. also there are many Wilton restorations threads and pictures in them to show you some of these steps that you might take a look at.

Good Luck

PS You can just clean it up now without sandblasting it, grease it and bolt it to your bench to use. the swivel might free itself up later or with a few weeks of spraying some magic juice in it or use it as a non swivel vise.

 

[bluebolt]

The two Wilton 500 shown below do not have a support ledge under the tube, or body, that houses the slide tube like the one shown in picture 3, in the Wilton NO. 4. The OP vise could be an older model 500 series vise. Picture 6 shows another NO. 4, in red, without the support ledge, maybe an earlier model than the No. 4 shown in pic 3?

Sorry Edgar I guess I was not clear about the support ledge. I am talking about the one that holds the jaw insert. If you look at this picture I do not see any sign of the support ledge on the static jaw. http://s794.photobucket.com/user/is...rt=3&o=7&_suid=138808126746905909876339141588
That means if it is all broken off only the screws are supporting the insert. This is a very common break on Wiltons I have seen lately.

I appreciate all the knowledge you have about Wilton's thanks for sharing!

 

[drivesitfar]

one thing I wanted to add if you are going to take the pin(s) out to remove the part that has the female threads for your screw. not everybody has a small punch that will work so if you are going to use a nail you'll get better results if you flatten the point off (grinder or clip it off if you don't own a grinder). that way you'll have a bigger surface to hit the pin and you also won't slip and shove the point into the vise body next to the pin.

like I said you can just clean as much as possible and grease the screw and put it back together and use the vise until you want to do a full restore later.

Good luck

 

[ishmaela]

I was actually able to push the pins last night. I used the end of a bolt since it was flat, and it worked pretty well. I was also able to pull the screws from the teeth on both sides. There was just a bunch of gunk built up in/around them, and I was able to dig them out. They were actually in perfect shape and easy to remove. The dynamic jaw plate came off without a hitch, but the static one...I think it was welded into place and grinded smooth...but the bolts still came out free and easy. I think the plate may be a permanent fixture, which works for me . I'll just get it cleaned and painted so it looks like it could come off . But otherwise, I got it completely disassembled with your guidance. I'll try to post pics as soon as I can, but haven't really uncovered anything exciting we can't see in the regular pics (IE: the welded jaw plate). Thanks!

Honestly, I don't have an immediate use for the vise, so it's fun to tinker with between projects. I'm still getting my garage arranged, and have a few other little things I'm waiting on before I can get it all worked out. That and I fear that, once I mount it...it will never get done . I want to get it cleaned up and lookin' nice like the rest of my garage. All of the flaking/raised paint really bothers me.

Quick question. What do I do with the diesel after I'm done breaking the swivel free? I haven't figured out my transportation of it yet...but I got to thinking about my limited use of diesel fuel once I get it home .

Thanks again. Have a good weekend!

 

[drivesitfar]

AWESOME!!!! glad you got it all apart except for the jaw that might be welded on. you might want to clean the screws for that jaw and put a couple drops of loc tite on them and screw them back in to keep that jaw from falling or getting knocked off during the rest of the restore. sounds like it might be time for a $10 sandblaster treatment??

you will need a can of some good rust remover to spray on other bolts and things in the future so why not invest in a can. shoot the swivel a few times and maybe let it soak for a day at a time before shooting it again and it might break loose.

it sounds like the diesel is a one time deal for you so put the $10-15 you would pay for that and buy a can of Kano or other rust spray. hazardous waste can take old diesel or i'm sure you can find other options if you go that route. TriFlow has great lubricants that I use and they might also have a rust spray. http://www.triflowlubricants.com/

good luck and add pictures when you are able.

 

[bluebolt]

The dynamic jaw plate came off without a hitch, but the static one...I think it was welded into place and grinded smooth...but the bolts still came out free and easy. I think the plate may be a permanent fixture, which works for me . I'll just get it cleaned and painted so it looks like it could come off .

If it's welded on there I would just leave it alone too LOL. If the ledge underneath the jaw plate is broken off like I suspect the welds will give the jaw some more strength. Sometimes the hardest thing to do is to NOT go to far on some things.