Please recommend me an indoor cable locator

[misterdobalina]

I have four or five (low voltage/speaker) wires in my old house and I can only find one end. The other ends are almost certainly behind plaster or (perhaps) drywall (some went in a walls and a ceiling, I think, and were later plastered over). I can trace some of them through the crawlspace but once they go through the subfloor they are lost to me.

I gather plenty of companies make these devices. I don't need live circuit ability, I don't need a device that works outdoors. I *do* need a locator that works through plaster and lath walls and exhibits a high degree of sensitivity-- ideally I could pinpoint the cable end with a high degree of accuracy and confidence.

Can anyone recommend an appropriate device that is a good value?

Thank you.

 

[jonathan75]

You do need a good fox and hound tone generator. I picked up one from Northern Tool years ago that still works well. You can adjust the sensitivity and I don't always have to be right on the wire to detect it. Just not sure how thick the surface would be before it won't see it.

Here is a updated version of the one I use.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00279JLBQ/?tag=atomicindus08-20

But one review of the one above says mine is better. Which you can still get.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000GAUXN8/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[kaffine]

I like the Tempo/Greenlee ones. I have seen the same unit with other brands on it Home Depot used to carry it with the Ideal brand on it but I'm not sure if they still have the same model.

This is what most of the telecom guys I knew used and what have. I have used a few other brands / styles and prefer this one. It seems that it has better sensitivity were it can detect the wire from farther away and with the metal tip on it the sensitivity can be turned down fairly low so you can go through and touch the bare wire to make positive ID of the wire in a crowded patch bay.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000NGVRH6/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[2ManyProjects]

I have four or five (low voltage/speaker) wires in my old house and I can only find one end. The other ends are almost certainly behind plaster or (perhaps) drywall (some went in a walls and a ceiling, I think, and were later plastered over). I can trace some of them through the crawlspace but once they go through the subfloor they are lost to me.

Allow me to present the contrarian viewpoint...

If those old "speaker wires" are so old that they've gotten THAT thoroughly lost, odds are they aren't worth salvaging in the first place. For that matter, given the "uber-hack" work many folks do when running such "speaker wires", the odds are also pretty good that they were neither "the right stuff" nor properly installed the day they went in. Do yourself a favor and start over, with some high-quality jacketed cable, such as:

http://www.defender.com/product3.jsp?id=127820
http://www.defender.com/product3.jsp?id=105874

 

[ishiboo]

Wow. Again in the "going overboard" department 2ManyProjects quotes Ancor wire, which is tinned for marine use and some of the most expensive regular wire on the planet (Ancor is GREAT wire but very expensive and designed specifically for marine environments.)

In addition, it's not CL2 rated.

Try Monoprice's CL2-rated wire for a proper wire at a normal price.

 

[jeffmoss26]

I just got 500 feet of 18/2 wire at ADI for 40 bucks.
I love the Progressive/Tempo toners, they are all I use.

 

[bry@n]

I love the Progressive/Tempo toners, they are all I use.

Same here. I have several. My favorite flashes switch ports and you can tone a specific pin.

I may have a spare set of toner/ probe I can lend you. It may be in my tool box at the house.

 

[jonathan75]

I like the Tempo/Greenlee ones. I have seen the same unit with other brands on it Home Depot used to carry it with the Ideal brand on it but I'm not sure if they still have the same model.

This is what most of the telecom guys I knew used and what have. I have used a few other brands / styles and prefer this one. It seems that it has better sensitivity were it can detect the wire from farther away and with the metal tip on it the sensitivity can be turned down fairly low so you can go through and touch the bare wire to make positive ID of the wire in a crowded patch bay.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000NGVRH6/?tag=atomicindus08-20

I have seen a lot of guys use this one in the field. Good to hear some feedback on it. One day my cheap one may break but so far it still works. Thanks for the tip.

 

[MFortie]

Backhoe.

Oh, wait, you said indoor...

 

[Mr_fixit]

I have four or five (low voltage/speaker) wires in my old house and I can only find one end. The other ends are almost certainly behind plaster or (perhaps) drywall (some went in a walls and a ceiling, I think, and were later plastered over). I can trace some of them through the crawlspace but once they go through the subfloor they are lost to me.

I gather plenty of companies make these devices. I don't need live circuit ability, I don't need a device that works outdoors. I *do* need a locator that works through plaster and lath walls and exhibits a high degree of sensitivity-- ideally I could pinpoint the cable end with a high degree of accuracy and confidence.

Can anyone recommend an appropriate device that is a good value?

Thank you.

The only one I know isn't all that accurate, is used to locate underground wires/cables to within a few inches, takes some skill, but I would never use it for what you're trying to do. And it's probably 1-2 k. I'd run new wires. Then you know what you have.

 

[misterdobalina]

Thanks for all the replies, folks. And thanks, Bry@n, please do let me know!

2ManyProjects, the wires were professionally installed about a decade ago in a house where the walls are mostly lath and plaster. There were a few bits left behind, such as some Parasound speakers (they are falling apart but it looks like they were once a pretty expensive piece of kit) in the ceiling. What I think happened was that--when the previous family couldn't sell the house--they decided to take out and plaster over some of the integrated-into-the-wall controls (preamps, volume knobs, whatever). Here in Snootyville (I work for a living, we bought our first house around our fortieth birthdays-- we don't really "belong" here but anyway) that sort of thing can be a hindrance to a sale. So as I trace some of these wires (nice, thick four-conductor jobs, affixed with care to floor joists in the basement and crawlspace) I can *sometimes* see where they begin and end, but the kicker is that there's no continuity. At first this was a giant mystery! But then I looked at the foot markings on the cable-- 396, 397, 398, and then it disappears into the wall ... okay I should expect something like 418, 419, 420 at the speaker, right? Wrong. 496. And the numbers are increasing as I move away from the speaker, not decreasing! But there's only one four-conductor speaker wire anywhere close to the specified room. So maybe I am wrong but the hypothesis is that something used to intermediate the speaker and the wire.

I would be happy to replace the wires and run new-- especially because I would know what goes where (I still haven't figured out the drain system, sprinkler system, or alarm system-- and it's been a year), but unless I can find a pot of gold with which to pay the plasterer and painter, naganna happen. Incidentally, if anyone needs a plasterer in CT, I have a great referral.

More than anyone wanted to know, I suppose.

 

[MixManSC]

Going to need a fox/hound type as mentioned. The old one I use has basically a phone jack that different adapters can plug into as well as a set of alligator clip leads for the tone generator then an inductive amp to find the other end. Your wiring sounds like it was part of an overall control system and mostly likely the majority of the wiring all came to one single point for connection to a large multichannel amp. That being said, if it was an older system it is very possible that each room had manual in-line independent volume controls. Generally these would be next to or close to where you would expect to find a light switch. My bet is the other ends of the wires go there and the wall box has been plastered over. I'd also bet the wires are probably fine and if you can find the wall box where the volume control for the particular room was installed then you could reuse the wires either installing an in-line volume control or simply tying the home run wires to the wires that go to the actual speaker locations.

I have a similar setup here at my graphics shop using a Crestron Adagio system. Basically it is a 12 channel amp with built in tuners, relays, and serial ports but uses panels or small program on a computer to control the volume and source for each room. The speaker wires are all home runs directly from the amplifier to the speaker. You just have to find where those volume controls were originally installed - that is where your break in the lines are. Both left/right channels (4 wires) would have gone to the volume control and from there broke away as individual channels to each speaker. Oh and yes, Parasound speakers were and still are pricey and top notch stuff although I do not think they still have a line of speakers. Their in-wall speakers I had years ago had gold colored Kevlar cones.

 

[justsam]

What is your final objective here? Restoring a whole home audio system, or restoring a home theater install?

If you are looking at whole home audio, you might consider going to something like SONOS. Initial cost is a little high, but you can add incrementally. All controlled from smart phone app, very slick user interface, it becomes audio source as well as distribution. Interconnect is all wireless to devices using their proprietary protocol and is quite robust from my experience. Control is via your smart phone app and WiFi.

Normally I am not a fan of wireless if there is a wired alternative but the system is so flexible and user friendly it is hard not to like it.

I think you will find that whole home wired audio, unless very high end, is becoming a thing of the past.

 

[misterdobalina]

MixManSC-- Your volume control hypothesis makes sense.
Justsam-- We are heavy Airplay users. I know that Sonos has a bit more functionality but given my collection of old speakers, amps, and hardware, Airplay was just easier and significantly cheaper for us. To be honest, finding some of the wires will be just for curiosity but finding the kitchen and outdoor wires (and tracing a lonely copper pair that I *think* probably fed a subwoofer at one point) is important because I already have holes in the kitchen ceiling, we'll want appropriate outdoor speakers when that day comes, and maybe a subwoofer would be nice.