Plug&Play Mini-Split, hand tools only required

[CWO4GUNNER]

Some of you will probubly speak up and tell me you already knew this. But it was news to me when I stumbled upon this installation video. Not only has this company used no-loss quick connect fittings on a pre-vacuumed line-set, but their line-Set (except the end connectors) are made of flexible stainless braided lines. In another video they show the guy bending the line-set like a garden hose (non-kink) then letting it drop limp to the ground totally flexible. Too bad the big name brands like Fujitsu and Mitsubishi haven't figured this out. But I suspect the entire HVAC residential industry is headed in the Plug&Play direction.

 

[JimL]

I doubt it… Ran a 70' line set on a mitsubishi last week. Like to see that rolled up in the box with the indoor unit. What do you do with the excess? Wad it up and make it look like ***?

This is what a mini split install should look like.

 

[CWO4GUNNER]

What do you do with the excess? Wad it up and make it look like ***?

No..I think it would provide allot more application options like for instance an option to noisy window units, the lineset slipped thorough a portable window channel DIY. How about being able to order your lineset to custom lengths so they will fit a 70ft run DIY. How about being able to remove the system and take it with you with DIY. I mean come on JimL you must admit that while the application now seems crude, the concept once perfected will be what cell phones did to phone booths. At least the manufacturing side is headed in the right direction. Give it a chance it will get there, maybe not today but in a few years this should be standard Fujitsu/ Mitsubishi for sure.

 

[walrus]

I doubt it… Ran a 70' line set on a mitsubishi last week. Like to see that rolled up in the box with the indoor unit. What do you do with the excess? Wad it up and make it look like ***?

This is what a mini split install should look like.

What the wiring method inside the gutter? Is it UF?

 

[JimL]

Just your standard romex. That is line hide. A plastic product, not gutter…

 

[yeldogt]

That is a nice install -- Like that.

The quick connect Mini-Splits are all over the place in the third world ....

I also see them installed and never pumped down .. I have no idea if something else is used .. or how long they last ... Typical split A/C is a North American animal

 

[Mike007]

That is a nice install -- Like that.

The quick connect Mini-Splits are all over the place in the third world ....

I also see them installed and never pumped down .. I have no idea if something else is used .. or how long they last ... Typical split A/C is a North American animal

The key being "Third World". I just don't see mini splits ever being plug and play. What about the electric and condensate drain?

 

[CWO4GUNNER]

Obviously I'm bringing attention to the obstacles the DIY "home owner" faces lineset installation. The residential electrical and drain are are elementary, at least for anyone who can turn wrench and crack a book. My unit arrives today between noon and 4pm, I'm hoping the delivery inspection goes well and there are no parts missing.

It occurred to me for the DIYer's who have invested in the HVAC installation tools and having successfully installed a mini split, will be able to replace their worn out central split. Especially since all the plumbing, electrical, and lineset are already run.

Which reminds me I need to study to pass the compass algebra prerequisites for electrician classes staring up this spring. Got to have that cert to do more complex handymen work.

 

[CWO4GUNNER]

PS JimL, excellent looking install. Recommend however that you go back and bolt down the OD unit to that platform, as even slight vibration will move it off and cause an imbalance or tip over. Funny there is always something uh..8^D

 

[walrus]

Just your standard romex. That is line hide. A plastic product, not gutter…

They let you get away with using romex outdoors?

 

[Mike007]

Obviously I'm bringing attention to the obstacles the DIY "home owner" faces lineset installation. The residential electrical and drain are are elementary, at least for anyone who can turn wrench and crack a book.

It occurred to me for the DIYer's who have invested in the HVAC installation tools and having successfully installed a mini split, will be able to replace their worn out central split. Especially since all the plumbing, electrical, and lineset are already run.

That's not what you say here:

No..I think it would provide allot more application options like for instance an option to noisy window units, the lineset slipped thorough a portable window channel DIY. How about being able to order your lineset to custom lengths so they will fit a 70ft run DIY. How about being able to remove the system and take it with you with DIY.

You are talking about making mini splits portable and people taking them with them.

Regardless, I don't see any of this happening on a big scale in the near future. The major manufactures don't want their equipment DIY installed. And even if they did, what percentage of the market is DIY? The vast majority of the population lacks the skills and time to learn the required skills and will pay a professional because their time is valuable.

I don't claim to be an auto mechanic, but I'm capable of doing most of the work I need done. But I still pay my mechanic to do it. Basically the same thing.

 

[pseudorealityx]

Yeah, I really don't get the fascination with portable DIY HVAC. I just don't see the market for it.

And it keeps coming up that this portable ductless split can "replace" the central system. No.... it cannot. It is NOT an apples to apples comparison.

 

[CWO4GUNNER]

Well yes I am trying to share those DIY options I listed for those that have an need to know. You obviously don't and have no interest. In fact from your perspective you may see it as a conflict of interest, and that's your misfortune. But for those that think outside the industry box "DIY hackers" ( a complementary term), this is the kind of options we like to hear about so we can free ourselves from the "groupthink" folks who insist on what can't be done.

Besides your wrong, mini splits and central splits fundamentally have everything in common except the duct work. Meaning the more hackers that learn how easy it is to install a mini split, the more hackers will be DIY replacing there central AC and heat pumps. Scary to some, but freedom to me and other proud DIY hacker out there.

Incidentally I thought you'd like to know my unit arrived surprisingly with no visible signs of dents, tares or damage. The truck driver was shocked that I just picked up the OD unit and set it on the ground. I inspected all the areas previously mentioned in threads about delivery damage. But not even the blower was damaged. What did surpriseme is that there are additional knockouts on the
ID unit so that if desired or nnecessity you could run your lineset/controls/condensate strait down then out at the bottom instead of perpendicular. This having both benefits and drawbacks.

 

[Mike007]

Well yes I am trying to share those DIY options I listed for those that have an need to know. You obviously don't and have no interest.........

Oh.....I guess you didn't get the memo. This is an internet forum, when you post your opinion there is no guarantee others will agree with you.

 

[CWO4GUNNER]

I spent a career conditioned to embrace objectively criticism. Its the industry groupthink that is unproductive and someone has to address it right.

**I think Im going to install a simple Duplex Recepticale Surge Supressor to protect my mini split equipment.

 

[C96]

I doubt it… Ran a 70' line set on a mitsubishi last week. Like to see that rolled up in the box with the indoor unit. What do you do with the excess? Wad it up and make it look like ***?

This is what a mini split install should look like.

If you wouldn’t have made the comment: “This is what a mini split install should look like.” I wouldn’t have made my comment below, but since you did, well…

Sorry, but this is not necessarily a good install, just looks nice.

You’ve got multiple NEC code violations going on here.

walrus has already picked-up on one of them.

The most obvious is the location of the disconnecting means.

There are others too, can anybody else spot them?

Don’t let the guys in the Lighting & Electrical forum see what’s been done; some of them would have a field day with this.

Obviously being code compliant was not of concern here, but that’s your prerogative.

I will say though, you’ve done a very nice and neat job of doing it wrong.

 

[JimL]

LOL!
I am not worried about it meeting code, I am sure if it were to be inspected here, it would pass. It will last however many years the unit does and be working just fine. This isn't a union job, just an install in a small town.

What the heck is wrong with the disconnect? I usually find them behind an ac where I can't get to it or where I can't open the door. Mounted up out of the way and easy to get to. If code wants it 5 feet off the ground they can eat it.

If code said you had to shave a little skin off your pecker and stick it in every wirenut you used for dna identification, would you do it? no. About half the codes you read are asinine.


Romex isn't outside, it is in a plastic tube out of the elements. I am sure thats a code violation but no different than running it in a piece of plastic conduit thru brick or such to a plug outside….

 

[pseudorealityx]

In fact from your perspective you may see it as a conflict of interest, and that's your misfortune.

Residential applications are NOT a conflict of interest for me. My work is entirely commercial, industrial, institutional, and critical medical and clean-room environments.

Of particular note to your fascination with VRF technology, here's the most recent VRF project I worked on; LEED certified 8 story mixed use mid-rise. Completely Mitsubishi VRF except for the data center.

And a current project my company is working on; I believe this one is going LG VRF:

But for those that think outside the industry box "DIY hackers" ( a complementary term), this is the kind of options we like to hear about so we can free ourselves from the "groupthink" folks who insist on what can't be done.

Those who think "out of the box" actually understand the process, the advantages and disadvantages.

Besides your wrong, mini splits and central splits fundamentally have everything in common except the duct work. Meaning the more hackers that learn how easy it is to install a mini split, the more hackers will be DIY replacing there central AC and heat pumps. Scary to some, but freedom to me and other proud DIY hacker out there.

Latent capacity, static pressure, filtration, and air distribution. Again, you're talking about a wall mount cassette vs. a "central AC/Heat pump". Those 2 things are different. It's like comparing an economy car to a pickup truck. They're both transportation, but with very different capabilities.

What did surpriseme is that there are additional knockouts on the
ID unit so that if desired or nnecessity you could run your lineset/controls/condensate strait down then out at the bottom instead of perpendicular. This having both benefits and drawbacks.

Yes, many times they are mounted to a wall you do not want to penetrate, like a block CMU wall, or one something like an IMP. Surface routing is sometimes preferred.

 

[CWO4GUNNER]

Look I was polite enough not to get involved in the family feud between $$ contractors even though I could have been rude and mentioned the liquid-tight in jimL's photo wasn't taking its familiar path between the building, disconnect, and unit. But what would that prove in, his business not mine. Now you want to turn back and turn your OZ wand back at DIY home owners who can clearly see the wizard hiding behind the curtain.

No one is complaint about your right to contract work on who will hire you "IF" they chose to. Just accept that you will have to comprimise with DIY property owners or not get hired. You want to point out a few flaws in my install before returning to do a proper system refrigerant release for a nominal price say $300, no probemo- amego! If not then expect the DIY movement in all areas of home building and improvement to continue and for manufacturers to continue to gear there products toward DIY end customer installation and away from residential contracting.

So don't blame me I'm not killing OZ, the cat has been out of the wizards bag for a long time. Go picket HD, Lowes, This Old House, BobVila, ACE, and the entire DIY movement in this country. But most of all get used to it because its going to get far better for the DIYer before it better for the status quo.

 

[sands35]

LOL!
I am not worried about it meeting code, I am sure if it were to be inspected here, it would pass. It will last however many years the unit does and be working just fine. This isn't a union job, just an install in a small town.

What the heck is wrong with the disconnect? I usually find them behind an ac where I can't get to it or where I can't open the door. Mounted up out of the way and easy to get to. If code wants it 5 feet off the ground they can eat it.

If code said you had to shave a little skin off your pecker and stick it in every wirenut you used for dna identification, would you do it? no. About half the codes you read are asinine.

Romex isn't outside, it is in a plastic tube out of the elements. I am sure thats a code violation but no different than running it in a piece of plastic conduit thru brick or such to a plug outside….

Just be aware that if you ever sell your house, you may need to fix the issues.

The chase for the hose set isn't (likely) rated for electrical. The electrical should be in a different conduit. The wire inside it should be rated for a wet location since it is outside. So THWN wire. The armored flex should have a drip loop between the unit and the wall so water doesn't run down into the condenser. (You should check the install instructions for a possible requirement on the refrigerant lines.) The disconnect needs to be easier to get to without reaching over or around the two condenser units.

It's actually easy to fix. Use an LB PVC fitting coming out of the wall to go left ~3 feet where (not in photo) there may be clear access, then run either flex armored or PVC down to about where you have it leaving the wall now, but not inside the hose chase. Then loop it down a bit then back up to the condenser unit. You'll want flex armored between the wall and the unit. Pull THWN wire from the disconnect to the unit. This is probably $40-50 in parts to make it right.

If there isn't clear access to the left, then you should think about putting the disconect on a post in front of the the unit. $10 for a 4x4, $6 for 2 bags of concrete and the conduit to work it out.

 

[walrus]

LOL!
I am not worried about it meeting code, I am sure if it were to be inspected here, it would pass. It will last however many years the unit does and be working just fine. This isn't a union job, just an install in a small town.

What the heck is wrong with the disconnect? I usually find them behind an ac where I can't get to it or where I can't open the door. Mounted up out of the way and easy to get to. If code wants it 5 feet off the ground they can eat it.

If code said you had to shave a little skin off your pecker and stick it in every wirenut you used for dna identification, would you do it? no. About half the codes you read are asinine.


Romex isn't outside, it is in a plastic tube out of the elements. I am sure thats a code violation but no different than running it in a piece of plastic conduit thru brick or such to a plug outside….

I don't doubt where you are it would pass inspection, in Maine it wouldn't.

Is that disconnect the style with the GFCI built in to it?