Pole barn framing

[casper36092]

Hey guys. First post. It told me to say hi so figured I would.

About to frame up my pole barn shop. The roof is done and the concrete and about to put up walls. What are the benefits of running 2x6 horizontal Flat on the inside In between the poles vs running the horizontal upright on the outside of the poles.

A buddy said put them in between so you can use them to nail plywood to the inside also

 

[Marctrees]

You are asking about "Bookshelf Girts"

Google that.

Marc

 

[GMCGarage]

Can they span between the poles vertical, or do they need to be flat for strength? Will they sag if flat?

 

[Mattlt]

I built mine with bookshelf girts. I finished the inside of mine with plywood on the walls and it worked really well.

Pros: Less material if you're going to finish the inside.

Cons: Need to be more precise when fastening the metal on the outside. 1.5" area to hit instead of a flat purlin. (Probably not a big issue)
Framing window and door openings can get tricky.
No vertical studs for mounting anything, need to plan appropriately. This is why I used 3/4" plywood on the inside of mine.

 

[383]

It depends on how the truss supports are attached to the top of the posts. Are they notched in flush with the post, or are they fastened to the outside of the post?

If it's something like a 2x12 fastened to the outside of the post, a 2x horizontal girt attached to the outside of the post will be flush with the support.

 

[casper36092]

It depends on how the truss supports are attached to the top of the posts. Are they notched in flush with the post, or are they fastened to the outside of the post?

If it's something like a 2x12 fastened to the outside of the post, a 2x horizontal girt attached to the outside of the post will be flush with the support.

the truss is a metal chicken house truss that sits on top of a 6x6

 

[casper36092]

Can they span between the poles vertical, or do they need to be flat for strength? Will they sag if flat?

they can span vertical easier i would asume. if i do the bookshelf girts i will add a little bit of blacking.

on bay is 12 ft the other is 14

 

[Gaius]

Are there any girts on the outside of the poles yet? If you only use flush-mount, commercial style girts your building had to be designed for it. If you are wanting to add these in addition to the outer "banding" girts, feel free.

 

[astroracer]

The girts should be installed on the outside of the poles, if 2 x 4's, with the 4" section flat against the pole. This will give you better support with the fasteners in shear rather then in tension as they would be if you fastened them to the inside of the posts.
Wrap the building with house wrap before attaching the siding material. You would be amazed at how much tighter the final build will be...
Framing the inside walls can be done with anything. 2 x 3's will work as the "walls" are not load bearing and all you need them for is to carry the wiring, insulation and interior sheeting. Vertical or horizontal, doesn't matter either. I don't see any benefit in using 2 x 6's over a smaller stick for this so save yourself some cash.
Mark

 

[casper36092]

The girts should be installed on the outside of the poles, if 2 x 4's, with the 4" section flat against the pole. This will give you better support with the fasteners in shear rather then in tension as they would be if you fastened them to the inside of the posts.
Wrap the building with house wrap before attaching the siding material. You would be amazed at how much tighter the final build will be...
Framing the inside walls can be done with anything. 2 x 3's will work as the "walls" are not load bearing and all you need them for is to carry the wiring, insulation and interior sheeting. Vertical or horizontal, doesn't matter either. I don't see any benefit in using 2 x 6's over a smaller stick for this so save yourself some cash.
Mark

there wont be any inside walls. there are no girts what so ever right now. and only 6x6 post and 2x6 perlins for the roof. the girts will be used to put the outside metal on. so you think running them on the outside will make the building stronger?

 

[astroracer]

there wont be any inside walls. there are no girts what so ever right now. and only 6x6 post and 2x6 perlins for the roof. the girts will be used to put the outside metal on. so you think running them on the outside will make the building stronger?

You have to take wind load into account. Nailing the girts on the outside will help to prevent the building from racking under high wind load. This ties one post to another with a good mechanical joint. Installing the girts between the posts will let the posts move individually with nothing tying them together.
Staggering the end joints so the joints aren't all on the same post will help as well.
Also adding angle bracing at all four corners will help with racking, more then the banding will, but the banding ties the whole building together.
Mark

And I would still recommend the house wrap before your siding goes on. it will really cut down on the draftiness of a steel building.

 

[Natty Bumppo]

there wont be any inside walls. there are no girts what so ever right now. and only 6x6 post and 2x6 perlins for the roof. the girts will be used to put the outside metal on. so you think running them on the outside will make the building stronger?

If you are not doing inside walls then I would run 2x4's laid flat on the outside of your building as opposed to the bookshelf girts. This is exactly what I did. I didn't sheath it with metal, but IMO it's the way to go. As astroracer mentioned, I would add some house wrap. Few pics attached.

 

[casper36092]

You have to take wind load into account. Nailing the girts on the outside will help to prevent the building from racking under high wind load. This ties one post to another with a good mechanical joint. Installing the girts between the posts will let the posts move individually with nothing tying them together.
Staggering the end joints so the joints aren't all on the same post will help as well.
Also adding angle bracing at all four corners will help with racking, more then the banding will, but the banding ties the whole building together.
Mark

And I would still recommend the house wrap before your siding goes on. it will really cut down on the draftiness of a steel building.

i was also told that the standard girts might allow for the board to flex enough from wind for the metal to bend? what is you opinion on that. just trying to get all the info i can cause the way you are saying to do it will be easier for me faster and cheaper

 

[casper36092]

If you are not doing inside walls then I would run 2x4's laid flat on the outside of your building as opposed to the bookshelf girts. This is exactly what I did. I didn't sheath it with metal, but IMO it's the way to go. As astroracer mentioned, I would add some house wrap. Few pics attached.

That looks real nice

 

[astroracer]

i was also told that the standard girts might allow for the board to flex enough from wind for the metal to bend? what is you opinion on that. just trying to get all the info i can cause the way you are saying to do it will be easier for me faster and cheaper

This is standard construction practices for 99% of the pole barns that are built... It's not my opinion, it is just how things are done to build a strong & safe structure.
Mark

 

[Natty Bumppo]

That looks real nice

Thanks casper.

I suppose 2x4's laid flat have some flex as you mentioned. I personally did not observe any significant flex that would cause concern about the metal bending.

And again, as astroracer commented, this is the way it's been done on pole barns for years without issue.

 

[casper36092]

thanks for all the help guys.