Pole Barn with Gothic Arch Roof

[cmz115]

First time poster...

I've been lurking on this site for the last year while I put my thoughts together on a new garage/woodshop/office. Right now, I'm thinking 24' or 28' wide by 40' long. I'm very interested in the possibility of doing a pole barn/post frame walls and second floor with a gothic arched roof. Am I crazy?

Thanks.
Craig

 

[lakeroadster]

Am I crazy?
Thanks.
Craig

Not at all. What one man can do, another can do.

 

[bczygan]

WHat are your height restrictions based on your zoning?

 

[CNGsaves]

What country are you in ?? Location in particular ??
Update GJ Profile with Country / State / City.

If you're anywhere near Amish builders, I'd imagine they can build you ANYthing!!

 

[Stuart in MN]

I've always liked that style barn. They may not be applicable today, but you can look at vintage plans from 1948 for gothic arch barns here: https://www.ag.ndsu.edu/extension-aben/buildingplans/construction

 

[NUTTSGT]

I'd like to follow a build on that.

 

[James-W]

First time poster...

I've been lurking on this site for the last year while I put my thoughts together on a new garage/woodshop/office. Right now, I'm thinking 24' or 28' wide by 40' long. I'm very interested in the possibility of doing a pole barn/post frame walls and second floor with a gothic arched roof. Am I crazy?

Thanks.
Craig

I don't think you are crazy, but I am not so sure what you want is very practical from a heating standpoint. You mentioned that the building is to be a garage, a wood working shop and office space. I am assuming it will be heated, at least the wood shop and the office space will be heated. Heating a space with a ceiling that high will be a challenge at best, and a nightmare at worst. But if that is what you want then I would say you should do it. Just be aware of the possible problem areas before you start the project.

 

[Thumper68]

I had a line on a barn just like that one, all I would have had to do is disassemble it and move it to my location about 20 miles, in the end I decided that it was going to cost way to much. Would have loved the space though 60x80 2 floors (The guy had 20+ old tractors stored on the upper level and no sag)

 

[matt_i]

I think the trusses are "wood intensive" meaning they use a lot of straight pieces, laminated, to make the arch. One part of that is a system to manufacture the trusses so they all come out the same, within reason. You'd need to build up some kind of a large jig to do so. I would have to use CAD to make it come out right.

My guess is that standard plywood could not be used to bend to the curve unless using 3/8" or less...that would be part of the design process. Probably it was sheathed with 1x6, also some extra cost these days.

 

[bczygan]

The arches in this kind of barn structure aren't laminated in the typical way. If you take a close look at the photo, you can see they use very wide boards placed on edge with a few of them making up each segment of the arch.

This is a very light weight method of creating a roof structure, and it encloses a large volume of space. Perfect for hay storage.

Labor intensive to replicate.

Regular pole barn would be much cheaper.

I really like it too, very delicate. Construction is much like a boat, but inverted. And it fits it's intended use perfectly. But difficult to disassemble and move to another location.

The OP might look at a gambrel roof for what he wants to do. Similar shape and usefulness to this, but easier to do.

Bill

 

[homebuilt burner]

A friend of mine is retirement age and grew up on the farm he owns. He has a number of these structures on his land and has built them all himself with one or two helpers so not labor intensive. I asked him how they were built and he told me there were traveling guys that had a jig that cut the 1 x 4's for the curve and you assemble the arches on the ground on one end and pull them up with ropes. According to this gentlemen they were very easy to build and move( just pull the roofing boards off and let the arches down with ropes. The basic design lends itself to scale adjustments very easily. I would imagine if you find the right "plans/information" this is very doable, but I do agree that It is very lumber intensive. Most of this guys buildings were built in the 50s and 60s but he said that he moved some of them in the 70s from other farms as they were upgrading to larger structures.

 

[cmz115]

WHat are your height restrictions based on your zoning?

I live in a fairly rural area so no zoning, no restrictions. It would not be as tall as my house - see photo.

I don't think you are crazy, but I am not so sure what you want is very practical from a heating standpoint. You mentioned that the building is to be a garage, a wood working shop and office space. I am assuming it will be heated, at least the wood shop and the office space will be heated. Heating a space with a ceiling that high will be a challenge at best, and a nightmare at worst. But if that is what you want then I would say you should do it. Just be aware of the possible problem areas before you start the project.

I've had the same thoughts, but could use some ceiling fans to help with this.

The arches in this kind of barn structure aren't laminated in the typical way. If you take a close look at the photo, you can see they use very wide boards placed on edge with a few of them making up each segment of the arch.

This is a very light weight method of creating a roof structure, and it encloses a large volume of space. Perfect for hay storage.

Labor intensive to replicate.

Regular pole barn would be much cheaper.

I really like it too, very delicate. Construction is much like a boat, but inverted. And it fits it's intended use perfectly. But difficult to disassemble and move to another location.

The OP might look at a gambrel roof for what he wants to do. Similar shape and usefulness to this, but easier to do.

Bill

I've looked at a gambrel, but it's much too traditional barn-like for me. I'm an architect and I tend to like things that are a different. I want the space for the office and woodshop to be inspiring, but since I do have to pay for it, I'm always trying to balance form, function, and cost.

I'd like to hear people's opinion on building the first floor walls and second floor - post frame or stick frame?

Craig

 

[Tarnished]

One of my favorite barn types. Quite common around here. I once tried to buy a farm that had a barn just like you posted. Wanted to convert the barn to house, but EX nixed that idea. Haven't seen any of these built since the early 50's, but farming has changed so much they are no longer practical as ag barn. Too bad!
Looking forward to see how this comes out.

 

[Kaizen]

cmz I have a love affair with the arch as well. some buildings in boston have full vaulted ceilings of brick using arches to support it.
I'd go post and beam on the first floor if you want inspiration. but I'm not liking the second floor roof idea. the problem will be the work you are putting into it vs the affect it will have after. like said the pic you posted can only be done with laminations to be any where near cost affective. you could use real timber and scarf joints or locking joints but I think that would be very expensive. so you're left with most likely plywood laminated ribs which would be fine structurally and cost wise but would you want those exposed? add the fact you need to insulate it and most of the detail will be lost. I think I'd keep the height but make a gothic church like post and beam center section out of timber and keep it all exposed.

 

[MagKarl]

Do it!

 

[kbs2244]

The post at:

https://www.ag.ndsu.edu/extension-ab...s/construction

shows how the jig is measured out and then built on the floor of the loft.
Long before the days of CAD.

Construction is a lot of short pieces.
It could be a one man job, but having a material handler would speed things up.

The lofts are high for their width, but they were meant for hay storage, so that was a plus.

Radiant heating would make all that open space comfortable.

The end result look would be hard to match.

 

[cmz115]

Thanks to everyone for some very insightful comments.

I got two budget prices for true laminated arches - one was recommending 2' o.c. and the other 8' o.c. and both were between $9,000 and $10,000! I feel fairly confident in my abilities to build and raise the curved rafters. I've found several old agricultural publications that provide some pretty detailed drawings and explanations on how to construction the rafter. One example is found here: http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/fpltn/fpltn-261.pdf .

As for insulation, my plan was to run 2x8's (or 10's?) above and perpendicular to the rafters to provide room for insulation and may even add a 2x4 (flat) on top for an extra wide nailer for the roof sheathing or metal.

I really just need to convince myself that the extra effort and potential drawbacks are worth it. Another benefit in my mind is the ability to start the roof essentially at the second floor level, thus reducing the height of the side walls and overall appearance of the building. Doing a more traditional gable would mean have at least 18' side walls instead of 10' or 11'.

I'm still hung up on the best way to build the walls and second floor. Thoughts???

 

[NUTTSGT]

Convince yourself, it might be hard to do, but once it's done, you'll know it was worth it.

 

[matt_i]

Interesting! I looked at plan 5220, a big pile of 1x4s. And some way to fasten the wedge blocks on a radius...Could probably use tapcons on a driveway or maybe even temporary cement pads laid out on a flat yard and then demo'd later on...

Is the second floor intended to be shop space or is it just typical attic storage that's essentially uncontrolled temp?

If shop space, I'd be very tempted to design & fabricate a tube steel structure with two similar but straighter trusses, hiding inside of the roof, intent would be to have an I-beam monorail, like an S4 going just under the actual roof ridge and outside by a few feet. This way you could lift all of your stuff up and down (within reason, probably 1000 lbs working load) with a chainfall and not sweat about what was going on. Otherwise, its going to be moving stuff up a stairway...

 

[cmz115]

Interesting! I looked at plan 5220, a big pile of 1x4s. And some way to fasten the wedge blocks on a radius...Could probably use tapcons on a driveway or maybe even temporary cement pads laid out on a flat yard and then demo'd later on...

Is the second floor intended to be shop space or is it just typical attic storage that's essentially uncontrolled temp?

If shop space, I'd be very tempted to design & fabricate a tube steel structure with two similar but straighter trusses, hiding inside of the roof, intent would be to have an I-beam monorail, like an S4 going just under the actual roof ridge and outside by a few feet. This way you could lift all of your stuff up and down (within reason, probably 1000 lbs working load) with a chainfall and not sweat about what was going on. Otherwise, its going to be moving stuff up a stairway...

You are correct. The first floor would be typical garage with the woodshop and office on the second floor. For the lift, I'm thinking of putting an open stair in the corner with a hoist beam up above. I've looked at some examples on this forum and some others. I feel this is better than a loft door on the exterior or a trap door in the floor. Just a thought...

 

[theoldwizard1]

Very cool.

Looks very expensive.

 

[airsanford]

www.starwoodrafters.com

lam-ply gothic trusses

 

[jwhcars]

I would check with the Amish barn builders to see how much they would charge to build a barn.

 

[Allgonquin]

And you can always store your blimp or other airship in the second story...

 

[cmz115]

www.starwoodrafters.com

lam-ply gothic trusses

This was one place I got a quote from. The cost for laminated rafters at 2' o.c. was $9,800 plus $2,000 delivery...