Ponding water question...

[Lou N]

All,

We have a pond that develops on our property after a big snow melt or a strong rain. Due to the poor forethought of the builder this water can sit for months on the property because it has no where to drain to.

We have considered landscaping it a a seasonal pond of sorts, but given that it consists of rainwater runoff from the roof and road the water quality is not the greatest. We haven't ruled that out, and plan to extend our fence to minimize the nuisance hazard to kids.

The pond is approximately 20' x 20' and 15" deep when it's at its largest. We have been considering installing a pump to push some of the water into storage tanks to be used for landscape watering. Northern tool sells some poly tanks that hold up to 500 gallons.

Does anyone have experience with something like this or perhaps a reference to find out more info?

We have been fighting with the county and the builder for several years and frankly I'm tired of their BS (we're second owners and were not aware of the problem until after we purchased - hindsight being 20/20 I guess I should have seen the potential problem). They aren't going to do anything to help resolve the issue so we're trying to turn lemons into lemonade (in an eco friendly manner!)

Any help will be great - this has been really stressful and frustrating.

Thanks,
Lou

PS - I also posted on the self help forum, since this isn't technically a garage question, but the experience here is worth a shot.

 

[ridgwel]

Short of filling in the low spot (approx. 19 cy with the dimension given), can you just cut a drainage swale/ditch or is it land locked? If you fill, I would put 12 cy of clean fill and 6 cy of topsoil (do as much compaction of the fill as you can to prevent further ponding down the line). Make sure to contour the topsoil to drain where you want the water to go, then get it covered with grass to prevent erosion as soon as you can. If you can't drain or fill, then your idea of some kind of pond might be your answer. Just some idle thoughts......

 

[justanengineer]

If the surrounding land allows for it, you could always put in some drain tile. Its a bit labor intensive if you have to go very far, but isnt very difficult to do.

 

[WhiteTrash]

I would go the pump and storage route. You could then use the water for irrigation during the rest of the year. Also, if it is in tanks, less breeding ground for mosquitoes.

 

[59 wagon man]

you can build an underground storage tank to hold this water for either irrigation or just until you can pump it somewhere .the water could filter into the ground and fill then tank. if your really interested in rain water harvesting pm me and i will give you more info and can help arrange for the install if your interested

 

[GirlnAgarage]

Before tearing into anything give your local USDA-NRCS office a call and chat with the District Conservationist there. They may be able to point you in the right direction.

 

[treasureseeker]

We have half an acre of land which was heavy clay and the back yard used to flood. The yard was graded to the middle and water was supposed to flow across the neighbors lot but just pooled in the center. The grade at the house and back fence were the same height. Our solution was to remove lots of the clay, bring in hundreds of yards of sharp sand, rototille it in, and grade the yard to flow to the back then added top soil and last drain tiles along the fence line exiting out to the back ditch. The front yard we just added and mixed in the sharp sand then added top soil. We now have too good of drainage and have to water the lawn often to keep it from drying out in summer.

If you have heavy clay soil the water has nowhere to go.

 

[Kevin54]

No larger than what it is, have you considered putting a liner in it and making it a fulltime pond? Landscape around it, add some stone, then introduce some fish to it. Put a pump in to keep the water moving to prevent it from becoming stagnant.

Or you could advertise that you want some fill. Given the depth of 15' you could go around to guys that does concrete work and ask them if they need a place to dump their concrete for a while. Then once it is a few feet from the top, add some good topsoil to level it off. It may take a season to get it done.

I'm doing the same thing with mine. I started out with a 3/4 acre pond in the backyard, asked a few guys if they wanted to dump their concrete and or topsoil and fill dirt. Within one summer I had 1/3 filled in. The next yrear we regraded the property and filled in another 1/3 at the other end. Now I am down to approximately a 50'x50' hole that is partially filled with old concrete. So hopefully this summer it will be done. I've had three different concrete contractor dumping concrete into it. I welcome the fill and they don't have to go out of town or don't have to pay to get rid of it.

 

[egdede]

That is a vernal pool, probably providing important breeding habitat for some protected insect, you should call the EPA before you do anything.

 

[Lou N]

All,

Thank you for the quick replies.

The area is somewhat landlocked, because of issues with pushing the water onto the neighbors property with natural flow. We could mechanically pump it down the hill, but we have had some outrageous estimates from an engineer as to a permanent cost for that ($50K or more). We have considered the pond option, but since we have no way to control the runoff when it rains I don't think that will work.

I think rainwater harvesting will probably be the best solution combined with some landscaping to make the area look decent when the water level is low or non existent.

I'll look into the local USDA contact, but I must admit I'm somewhat hesitant because who knows what type of silly regulations they may have. I know the comment about the vernal pool was tongue in cheek (I think), but nothing would surprise me.

59 Wagon Man - I will send you a PM for additional info.

Thanks again everyone.

Lou

 

[5lima30]

At my last house I had a similar problem. Our soil is mostly rock and clay. I used a "middlebuster" or potato plow (depending on where you are from) 3 point attachment on my tractor to make furrows to channel the water off into lower wooded area. It worked great although I had to redo them about every 6 months. YMMV.

 

[GirlnAgarage]

I'll look into the local USDA contact, but I must admit I'm somewhat hesitant because who knows what type of silly regulations they may have. I know the comment about the vernal pool was tongue in cheek (I think), but nothing would surprise me.

Lou

My Dad has worked for the NRCS for the last 34yrs and I have during my summers in high school and college. Have no fear, they are good guys. They are there specifically for farmers and landowners. If you don't called the NRCS office, call the FSA office.

Tell them the problem you have, bring photos, they help and tell them what you're thinking about doing. They'll let you know what you can and can't do before you get into trouble or waste money doing it.

Remember you haven't started working on anything, you're just chatting about ideas

 

[kbs2244]

Before you go to the Fed level, check at the county level.
Most have a "Surface Water" department of some kind.
Most often they desl with new construction but and surface drainage comes under their watch.
What with all the "wet lands" intrest you may be what is concidered a "seasonal wet land."
Not good.
But you may also be in line for them to do some ditching and draining for you.
They will often follow lot lines to avoid neighbor problems.

 

[Lou N]

Girl/kbs,

I'll give the NRCS at try. The county here has been useless, it sounds like the NRCS might be a good resource.

Thanks,
Lou

 

[ZRX61]

That is a vernal pool, probably providing important breeding habitat for some protected insect, you should call the EPA before you do anything.

BWUHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

 

[Ohio Auto]

I had similar problems on my 7 acre property in places. I put catch basins in that connect to field tile. Best decision I ever made. Had a tile place come in and do it...probably spent $500.00 on it.

 

[bmfenn]

I live in a neighborhood that was built as summer bungalows back in the 1920's. My house has had a few additions, but is still where it was originally build almost 80 years ago. There were originally dirt roads, and when they paved them many years ago, the asphalt is above the gradeing on every original lot. Hence, most every yard floods when it rains. I used to have a picture of ducks swimming in my front yard after a rainy week. The storm drains are above the grade level of my house. When I built my garage, new requirements require raising the grade above the storm drain levels, but that doesn't help the existing low grade levels.

I'm also 2 blocks from the water, so I hit ground water if I dig down more than 2.5ft. Because of that you cant use typical french drains and drywells. A solution that many in my neighborhood have had was to dig a 12x5 hole until you hit ground water. Fill hole with connected layers of drain tile and trap rock. It gives the rainwater a place to collect, until it can soak into the ground. I think I have 20 10ft pieces of drain pipe in there, all connected, suspended in 3/4" trap. I havent had a flooding problem since.

 

[nissan_crawler]

Before you go to the Fed level, check at the county level.
Most have a "Surface Water" department of some kind.
Most often they desl with new construction but and surface drainage comes under their watch.
What with all the "wet lands" intrest you may be what is concidered a "seasonal wet land."
Not good.
But you may also be in line for them to do some ditching and draining for you.
They will often follow lot lines to avoid neighbor problems.

Good advice. They get funny about that stuff. We had a deep washout that started about 60' into a field. We wanted to move it to the edge of the field, and put a culvert in. DENIED. It was along a waterfowl migration path. Apparently, the ******* birds can fly a thousand miles back to the same field, but they can't figure out the water moved 50 feet!

We were told we were lucky we asked, because if we started, we would have been fined out the ****.