Porcelain Tiles in Wisconsin

[bendera]

Hello!

Here is my garage floor, which has has areas of previous repair with concrete patch stuff and that **** NewCrete Concrete Resurfacer, which is porous and makes the garage wet after any rain. I am going to remove the weak surface with a rotary hammer, wash it, etc., to prepare for porcelain tiles.

ChatGPT gave me reasonable instructions, but I would like to double-check them with professionals. I am in Wisconsin. The garage is 420 ft and there are two concrete slabs (cut from the entrance to the back).

Questions:

1. In some areas, the NewCrete Concrete Resurfacer is quite solid, and I cannot remove that thin layer. Is it safe to keep it under the tiles?

2. Do I really need to buy and install a membrane? Cheapest DMX Tile Membrane will immediately add $700 to my budget. Or can I use a liquid solution just for waterproofing? Or something else?

3. If a membrane is required in my area, do I need to make the floor very flat? Currently, there are no cracks, but half of the surface is heavily damaged by salt. I think that if a membrane is required, I can just add more mortar below the membrane to achieve a fairly flat surface for the tiles. I am going to use VersaBond 50 lb White Professional Polymer-Modified Thinset Mortar.

4. Should I start tiling under the door, leaving the tiles exposed to the weather and visible from outside, or should I start just behind the door so the door will touch the old concrete floor as usual?

I will use cheap tiles from HD or Lowes with PEI index 4, , like STAINMASTER Harbor Gray 12-in x 24-in

Thanks!

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[Old tool guy]

Why are you going to all that work, and then install cheap tiles?

 

[Shiftless]

I would not go with 12x24 tiles. Especially “cheap” tiles.
Too much danger of significant lippage due to slightly warped tiles and a slightly irregular floor. Smaller sized tiles will make it easier to avoid variations of height at the edges of the tiles. Even 1/16 inch is noticeable.

 

[bendera]

Cheap = cheapest available, but in specs. Like PEI >= 4. I understand that I have to minimize slippage after snow days.

 

[bendera]

I would not go with 12x24 tiles.

12x12 or smaller?

 

[Shiftless]

12x12 or smaller?

Yes
May I add that epoxy grout is much easier to keep clean but more difficult to install.

 

[drmarkr]

If you haven't done a search, that's the first thing you need to do. There are multiple, extensive threads in the flooring Subform discussing all of the great work that's been done by members here, when installing porcelain tile.

I used a basic 12x24 PEI 4 product from Lowe's and my floor has been outstanding. There are critical techniques on installation that you must follow. Again, I highly recommend you do your homework by researching the threads that have discussed the topic in depth.

 

[OzarkMan]

We used a gray 12x24 tile in the mudroom. You gotta scrub the **** out of it to get the dirt out of the microscopic pores. Tile looks nice otherwise but it certainly is not maintenance free. Just something to think about with tires and dolly wheels going about the garage.

 

[Shiftless]

Search for a tile and grout color to match your local dirt color.

No solid color tile. They show dirt and scratches and scuffs too easily,

 

[bendera]

Thanks for the answers. Any advice regarding my initial questions? I have read many topics and worked with AI to gather information, but these questions are still not clear.

 

[Old tool guy]

and worked with AI to gather information, but these questions are still not clear.

There is no such thing as working with ai. You posit a question, it searches hundreds of data bases and comes back with a response it thinks might be right. If it happens to search 20 databases on garage floor tile and 10 of them are written by salesman or idiots … what kind of answer do you think you will get?

 

[Stuart in MN]

Haven't seen him around in a while but board member jack Olson has porcelain tiles in his garage. He's in Los Angeles, so a different climate, but he may be able to provide some tips if you send him a private message.

 

[Old tool guy]

I don’t think porcelain tiles are the issue, it’s that he plans to use the cheapest available.

 

[mike93lx]

PEI is not what you want to focus on if you need slip resistance. That's COF (coefficient of friction). At least above 0.5, if not above 0.6

Your cheap Lowes tile is probably 0.4 which is fine for interior work, not a garage, IMO

 

[duneslider]

Looks like that tile has a DCOF greater than 0.42, whatever that means. If it's greater than, tell us what it is...
It likely is a bit more slippery than I would want in my garage.

I wouldn't be worried about a 12x24.

Start with this thread for some good reading and good info. Porcelain 2 car garage

1. if the stuff is stuck to the floor it should stay stuck to the floor but your overall finished product is dependent on it staying stuck to the floor. An underlayment will provided some added insurance to the situation.

2.Doing it professionally, I would not do a garage without a membrane. My favorite is Ditra and that is what I would use. Do you have to use a membrane, no. A good underlayment will provide benefits and only you can weigh if it makes sense or not. If you have a failure it isn't really fixable and you will have to tear it all out and start over, how much risk are you willing to take? You can use premium thinsets that will cover a lot of the benefits of the underlayment but those also have a cost. I will be honest, I just don't install tile without ditra anymore, just not worth the risk for me. I don't know anything about DMX, I use ditra because I know the company stands behind its product and I can trust it. That doesn't mean that isn't true with DMX, it's probably fine.

3. No, depending on how bad the floor is, you could skim the bad spots with thinset first then apply over the top. Versabond is NOT a premium product. I have used pallets of it, it isn't bad, but it isn't a premium product that I would use in an exterior application without a membrane. I would probably be fine using it with ditra though, and I have a whole lot. I have been using the schluter brand thinset lately and it is a very good thinset (probably double the cost of versabond). If you aren't using a membrane I would use a better thinset than versabond. I don't shop tile stuff at home depot much but last I looked they didn't carry a lot of the more premium thinsets anymore. This probably varies by location though. If you can tell me what your HD carries I can tell you what I would use. If they have Flexbond, that would be great for a garage floor. It is good stuff and I would think you could be pretty safe with it without a membrane.

4. I wouldn't go under the door. I would use the schluter Reno-ramp that starts right at the door and go from there.

Pretty much ALL porcelain tile will be PEI 4, it doesn't mean a whole lot. Like mentioned look for a DCOF of .5 or more.

Tile is a premium product, expect to pay a premium price to do it right. That doesn't mean you can't look for and find good deals on things, just don't buy inferior products and expect premium results. I have bought a lot of tile on sale, or on clearance, and gotten great deals but I don't skimp on the install.

 

[bendera]

Looks like that tile has a DCOF greater than 0.42, whatever that means. If it's greater than, tell us what it is...

Thank you! Your answers are really helpful. Probably I need to invest into Ditra.

You meant this thinset? https://www.lowes.com/pd/Schluter-Systems-All-Set-50-Pound-s-White-Powder-Thinset-mortar/5000281363. Probably will triple the cost, Ditra membrane is not looking so expensive now. So, Versabond + Ditra should be safe for Wisconsin?

Now I need to find a proper tile.

 

[mike93lx]

Thank you! Your answers are really helpful. Probably I need to invest into Ditra.

You meant this thinset? https://www.lowes.com/pd/Schluter-Systems-All-Set-50-Pound-s-White-Powder-Thinset-mortar/5000281363. Probably will triple the cost, Ditra membrane is not looking so expensive now. So, Versabond + Ditra should be safe for Wisconsin?

Now I need to find a proper tile.

Schluter has a fantastic installation guide. I'd download and read the relevant sections

 

[drmarkr]

Haven't seen him around in a while but board member jack Olson has porcelain tiles in his garage. He's in Los Angeles, so a different climate, but he may be able to provide some tips if you send him a private message.

Near certain Jack's is ceramic.

 

[duneslider]

Thank you! Your answers are really helpful. Probably I need to invest into Ditra.

You meant this thinset? https://www.lowes.com/pd/Schluter-Systems-All-Set-50-Pound-s-White-Powder-Thinset-mortar/5000281363. Probably will triple the cost, Ditra membrane is not looking so expensive now. So, Versabond + Ditra should be safe for Wisconsin?

Now I need to find a proper tile.

I have used a lot of versabond with ditra. I will say the Schluter All-set is a better thinset. It also wouldn't triple your cost. It would maybe add $100-150 bucks to the overall cost. You probably need 8-10 bags of thinset for this job. I would be comfortable using versabond though. I do like versabond

 

[Old tool guy]

You meant this thinset? https://www.lowes.com/pd/Schluter-Systems-All-Set-50-Pound-s-White-Powder-Thinset-mortar/5000281363.

Thinset is available in white and grey, grey being most common. You need to use white with natural marble tiles because the grey will bleed through and discolor the marble. If you are using porcelain tiles you can use the less expensive grey thinset.