Porcelain wood grain!

[the draft]

Been all over the map like most of you trying to pick the best covering for your garage floor.
I picked Porcelain tile! At the start of this research (best part) I had know idea Tile was a good surface for a garage floor. My project is a 3- car garage about 750+ SF with some salt damage in two bays. Im planning on grinding for step one very soon. Im going for a wood grain look (link below) and found these tiles and wondering if anyone has exsperance with them or if you think they are the correct grade Porcelain.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/MARAZZI-...-Tile-14-53-sq-ft-case-ULRW624HD1PR/205473903

 

[Shea]

If I'm reading the info correctly, it has a PEI rating of 4 and a wet COF rating of .6 which is great. It would work just fine for a garage and looks awesome as well!

 

[Cave Creek Ray]

Yeah, that stuff should look great when done. That format will create more grout lines but that only adds to the "wood" character of the floor. Can't wait to see this project underway!

Because of the long-narrow shape, I would probably use the crack preventative mortar for sure. And definitely honor those expansion joints. Smaller format tile is not quite as strong. But, with those two caveats, you'll be fine.

Ray

 

[mhejl]

I put that in my shop (different color) and the biggest issue is they have a lengthwise bow in them and are more difficult to lay evenly vs smaller format tile. My son, a pro tile installer, confirms this. Note also that they are laser printed and not through color so when you drop a wrench and ding the tile, you'll see the base color.

These are considered "large format" (>12" on one edge) and need the appropriate thinset with admix. Do NOT try to use premixed (which is really mastic, not thinset).

 

[Gerald O]

I put that in my shop (different color) and the biggest issue is they have a lengthwise bow in them and are more difficult to lay evenly vs smaller format tile. My son, a pro tile installer, confirms this. Note also that they are laser printed and not through color so when you drop a wrench and ding the tile, you'll see the base color.

These are considered "large format" (>12" on one edge) and need the appropriate thinset with admix. Do NOT try to use premixed (which is really mastic, not thinset).

Yep. I agree with all those comments. I used these same tiles in the mudroom off the garage. Most of them have a bit of lengthwise bow (crown) which causes lippage between tiles. It's disguised a little by the rough sawn look. They are also thin. You do have to install them in a staggered 1/3, 2/3 pattern to minimize the lippage effect. Base color is white, so if you chip the surface it will stand out against a darker wood pattern.

 

[the draft]

I put that in my shop (different color) and the biggest issue is they have a lengthwise bow in them and are more difficult to lay evenly vs smaller format tile. My son, a pro tile installer, confirms this. Note also that they are laser printed and not through color so when you drop a wrench and ding the tile, you'll see the base color.

These are considered "large format" (>12" on one edge) and need the appropriate thinset with admix. Do NOT try to use premixed (which is really mastic, not thinset).

and this is the reason these forms are great! I did not thinck of the bow in the tile! This is slightly concerning along with the Cave Creek Ray comments.
Ill see whats out there for 8" wide tile.

After reading a lot of posts again, maybe grind is not necessary and just power wash and a little oil spill clean up would be sufficient. I could use the mercuric acid I have?

 

[rlitman]

Yep. I agree with all those comments....

As do I. I think those would look AMAZING, but the 24" pieces are not friendly for an amateur to install, bow or no.

 

[Onesip]

Like yourself, when I began researching flooring I never considered porcelain tile until coming across this forum. I'm now about midway through the install. I can't speak to the logistics of installing the tile you have picked out, as others have, but I think it would look awesome! I'm looking forward to seeing pics if you move forward, Good luck!

 

[Cave Creek Ray]

While the chip potential wouldn't be that big of a deal with the variations in colors of the tile pattern, the bowing would be a hassle.

I had a very slight bowing on some of my 12x24 tiles. It was only on certain tiles but not apparent unless you put a straight edge on them and at that, it was an RCH* at either end while the center 75% of the tile was flat.

Ray

For those of you not familiar, and RCH is a technical term denoting a very small unit of measurement.

 

[Gerald O]

I still have a box of these left so went out and measured the bow. They run about 1mm higher in the center than the ends. I wouldn't let that stop me from using them. This tile has a very irregular surface, looks like old rough hewn barn wood. So the bow just blends in with the natural look. It's just something I noticed while setting them. If they were smooth tiles I'd not consider it acceptible but with these I think it's ok.

 

[Cave Creek Ray]

Sounds like a great system. I have seen a video of its use online...

 

[the draft]

As do I. I think those would look AMAZING, but the 24" pieces are not friendly for an amateur to install, bow or no.

Yea I'm a little concerned! Today I was working in the garage for a few hours and my mind was working over time again on all the flooring coatings I could use (AGAIN)

 

[the draft]

While the chip potential wouldn't be that big of a deal with the variations in colors of the tile pattern, the bowing would be a hassle.

I had a very slight bowing on some of my 12x24 tiles. It was only on certain tiles but not apparent unless you put a straight edge on them and at that, it was an RCH* at either end while the center 75% of the tile was flat.


Ray

For those of you not familiar, and RCH is a technical term denoting a very small unit of measurement.

12x24 Does sound better with a lot less grout!
RCH (Got it)

I still have a box of these left so went out and measured the bow. They run about 1mm higher in the center than the ends. I wouldn't let that stop me from using them. This tile has a very irregular surface, looks like old rough hewn barn wood. So the bow just blends in with the natural look. It's just something I noticed while setting them. If they were smooth tiles I'd not consider it acceptible but with these I think it's ok.

Wow 1mm seems like a lot! Thank you for taking the time!

 

[the draft]

My tile wood slabs are 6x36 and 6x48.
Special(to me,I hadn't seen them before) spacers were used to space the grout lines.
The spacers hooked under the tile and locked on top(like panel spacers for welding.
Once the tile set they knocked the tops off of the clamps using a rubber hammer.
It allowed such long pieces to be perfectly butted. It eliminated the crowing problem by forcing the tiles to align with each others edge.

I little glimpse of light! Ill look into it, sounds very helpful.

 

[Cave Creek Ray]

TD brings up a good point. Long porcelain, especially long and narrow porcelain, can bend slightly. The tab-loc system might make that issue go away or at least resolve it enough until its negligible.

Homey 'Po ALWAYS takes stuff back! Buy a box of tile and a box of the clips (online) and just dry set them together on your garage floor. Clip a dozen together and see what the result is. If it doesn't pass muster, take the tiles back and use the clips for your next tile.

Ray

 

[theoldwizard1]

I like the wood grain "look" porcelain, but I hope it is not a "working" garage. I would be totally paranoid about dropping a hammer/wrench on it and cracking one of the tiles.

 

[Angelfire]

I like the wood grain "look" porcelain, but I hope it is not a "working" garage. I would be totally paranoid about dropping a hammer/wrench on it and cracking one of the tiles.

Do we have to dredge up this incorrect paradigm again? This is becoming like the "use PVC for airlines" discussion that seems to occur every few months. Porcelain, when installed properly will give a surface that is harder than your concrete floor. Guys have come on here to describe dropping transmissions/etc on it without a scratch. If not installed properly, you are correct, you'll have cracks. But let's say you do crack one, it's a lot easier to replace one tile vs. say epoxy where you'll be grinding the whole floor to fix. Will it chip, yeah it can (as can any other floor coating), which is the point made above about the advantage of a through body tile.

Here's a quick link to one of our vendors that summarizes the benefits of porcelain (notice the vid towards the end where Jack Olsen is pounding his CERAMIC floor with a sledge with no damage whatsoever):

http://allgaragefloors.com/porcelain-garage-floor-questions/


To the OP, sorry for the hijack....it just bugs me that people seem to think porcelain will crack in a "working" garage. I suppose it's based on seeing how it's usually installed in homes (ie. poorly). Many auto shops have used the stuff for years, parking garages (particularly in Europe), etc.....
Cheers.

 

[the draft]

Do we have to dredge up this incorrect paradigm again? This is becoming like the "use PVC for airlines" discussion that seems to occur every few months. Porcelain, when installed properly will give a surface that is harder than your concrete floor. Guys have come on here to describe dropping transmissions/etc on it without a scratch. If not installed properly, you are correct, you'll have cracks. But let's say you do crack one, it's a lot easier to replace one tile vs. say epoxy where you'll be grinding the whole floor to fix. Will it chip, yeah it can (as can any other floor coating), which is the point made above about the advantage of a through body tile.

Here's a quick link to one of our vendors that summarizes the benefits of porcelain (notice the vid towards the end where Jack Olsen is pounding his CERAMIC floor with a sledge with no damage whatsoever):

http://allgaragefloors.com/porcelain-garage-floor-questions/


To the OP, sorry for the hijack....it just bugs me that people seem to think porcelain will crack in a "working" garage. I suppose it's based on seeing how it's usually installed in homes (ie. poorly). Many auto shops have used the stuff for years, parking garages (particularly in Europe), etc.....
Cheers.

Anglefire if a wood grain tile 6' by 24' is properly installed even if there is a bow in them should not be any differant or a problem from other size tile.

 

[stage20]

Planks are very difficult to lay. Need to do small runs lengthwise as you go. The proper thinset needs to be used and must be layed with the proper trowel. Back buttering them is preferred as well. Some type of clip system or wedges are a good idea to prevent lippage. The tile planks are not for beginners

 

[Angelfire]

Anglefire if a wood grain tile 6' by 24' is properly installed even if there is a bow in them should not be any differant or a problem from other size tile.

Not sure I follow, I made no mention of sizing of tiles or such....just that Porcelain is viewed as inferior because it will crack and this view has been shown to be false time and time again. Oh, and that's one huge tile you're trying to install
Cheers.

 

[Gerald O]

Oh, and that's one huge tile you're trying to install
Cheers.

But at least he only needs 6 of them to do the whole garage!

 

[the draft]

I'm done looking at tile. There are to many to pick from. I'm stuck on the look of wood. I'll pass the tile up to you!��

 

[James-W]

I like the looks of porcelain tile, but in doing a large area I would think it is difficult to get the floor perfectly flat and level. Well, maybe not perfectly flat and level, but close to it. I tend to think it would take someone who has been doing this for many years to get it right. My guess is that a DIY person would screw it up and end up with a bigger mess that before the floor was started.

 

[stage20]

I like the looks of porcelain tile, but in doing a large area I would think it is difficult to get the floor perfectly flat and level. Well, maybe not perfectly flat and level, but close to it. I tend to think it would take someone who has been doing this for many years to get it right. My guess is that a DIY person would screw it up and end up with a bigger mess that before the floor was started.

self leveler and using a clip system is the only way to lay the tile planks. it needs to be SMOOOTH or you will have lippage.

 

[Cave Creek Ray]

The clip system appears to be a simple solution and takes a lot of the guesswork out of the process for new tilers. Perhaps one of the folks wanting to install will use this system and give us a review.

I could have used more help on my 12x24 planks but came up with solutions. I am happy with the result but it would have been great to try another alternative.

Ray

 

[Gerald O]

The leveling clips absolutely don't work well with these 6x24 planks. I know from trying them. Because of the way you stagger the ends and due to the bow in the middle, the clips will make aligning the edges worse. You have to split the difference between the high and the low points to get a relatively flat installation.

 

[Cave Creek Ray]

There you go... the voice of experience. Thanks Gerald.

Question: If the tiles were flat, would the clips be a help for a new tile setter? Are they a hassle or easy to install?

Ray

 

[the draft]

If I'm reading the info correctly, it has a PEI rating of 4 and a wet COF rating of .6 which is great. It would work just fine for a garage and looks awesome as well!

Yeah, that stuff should look great when done. That format will create more grout lines but that only adds to the "wood" character of the floor. Can't wait to see this project underway!

Because of the long-narrow shape, I would probably use the crack preventative mortar for sure. And definitely honor those expansion joints. Smaller format tile is not quite as strong. But, with those two caveats, you'll be fine.

Ray

I put that in my shop (different color) and the biggest issue is they have a lengthwise bow in them and are more difficult to lay evenly vs smaller format tile. My son, a pro tile installer, confirms this. Note also that they are laser printed and not through color so when you drop a wrench and ding the tile, you'll see the base color.

These are considered "large format" (>12" on one edge) and need the appropriate thinset with admix. Do NOT try to use premixed (which is really mastic, not thinset).

Yep. I agree with all those comments. I used these same tiles in the mudroom off the garage. Most of them have a bit of lengthwise bow (crown) which causes lippage between tiles. It's disguised a little by the rough sawn look. They are also thin. You do have to install them in a staggered 1/3, 2/3 pattern to minimize the lippage effect. Base color is white, so if you chip the surface it will stand out against a darker wood pattern.

Well the above statements make it sound like if properly installed there should not be any problem with strength of the tile.

Maybe a better question would be, what size or thickness of tile does the bow go away? does a 8x24 tile bow less?

 

[Radix2]

The leveling clips absolutely don't work well with these 6x24 planks. I know from trying them. Because of the way you stagger the ends and due to the bow in the middle, the clips will make aligning the edges worse. You have to split the difference between the high and the low points to get a relatively flat installation.

There you go... the voice of experience. Thanks Gerald.

Question: If the tiles were flat, would the clips be a help for a new tile setter? Are they a hassle or easy to install?

Ray

Gerald, if using a clip system on a tile with some bow, you have to decide if the clip can take the bow out or not. If not ( as was your experience here) then you need to use them as you say to split the difference by applying the clips not to the corners, but to the middles where they aid in splitting the differences.

In any case, you make a good point, clips are not a cure all, they add another element that can help or hinder. Clip systems still require getting correct the basics for setting large format tile - you need to have enough mortar depth, you need the proper mortar constancy, you need to understand the lay of you substrate so you can float over high spots. Big tiles are tough to lay well.

The draft -
There is no rule you can find on which tiles will have more or less bow - it has to do with the manufacturing process. Another critical factor to consider is how rectified (sharp/square the corners/edges of ) the tiles are. A tile with eased edges will have much less perceived lippage and be easier to set than a very sharp edged tile. Even though most rectified tiles will be flatter overall.

 

[Dakota00]

Absolutely DO NOT use these tile leveling clips in a garage floor application!
You are asking for problems, as these clip leveling systems are designed to lift the tile(s) from the thinset bond to make it flat with the neighboring tiles. Resulting in tiles not having enough thinset underneath especially at the edges. Which in turn means tiles could crack or break from heavy loads or impact blows to the surface in a working garage environment.

 

[the draft]

Absolutely DO NOT use these tile leveling clips in a garage floor application!
You are asking for problems, as these clip leveling systems are designed to lift the tile(s) from the thinset bond to make it flat with the neighboring tiles. Resulting in tiles not having enough thinset underneath especially at the edges. Which in turn means tiles could crack or break from heavy loads or impact blows to the surface in a working garage environment.

Im glad some one else said it!

Dakota00 What took you so long! Your post started all of this,

 

[scoutkid]

Thank god i'm not the only crazy person. I put these in my master bath on a herringbone pattern and my wife thought i was a crappy tile setter - least flat floor I've ever put in, but like you say, the grain hides the lips, but your toes still feel it...

 

[rick carpenter]

We had this tile installed in our house last summer by a HD contractor. I probably could have done it myself but I've never tiled with this tile or such big area and I also knew how long it would have taken me. Combining all that with no warranty were the main things for us going with a contractor in the first place. We asked for as thin a grout line as possible and black grout. It looked great but the install was bad with uneven tile to tile butting, etc. After living with it almost a year, we decided to use the warranty. A specialist HD contractor came out in late spring and yes it was a bad install and yes they'd make it right. The husband and wife team the contractor uses for problem/high grade installs tore out the old and a week later had the new in. The looks and install quality are great with the same reddish brown tile but slightly wider black grout joints.

We're very happy with it inside the house but I wouldn't put this in my garage. With something this nice I'd want to keep my garage floor super clean. With the surface of the wood grain tiles we have and the square tile edges/sunken grout, as a garage floor I'd think it would be too hard to keep even moderately clean. As far as durability in a garage, I dunno.

 

[Dakota00]

Im glad some one else said it!

Dakota00 What took you so long! Your post started all of this,

LOL! Been too busy with the family, we just had our second child 5 weeks ago. Plus I picked up another car to work on... So free time is very limited, but whatever little time I do have I'll still drop in and see how this forum is doing.

 

[Hartwell]

While not in my garage, I can see the benefits. I laid this about a year ago, and am very happy with it. I saw the clip method, but decided against it, just to avoid the added expense and headache. I had no problem laying these and feel they came out fine. There is no lip issue whatsoever. Go with the medium sized rubber crosses and things will go smooth. I've dropped a few things on them, dishes and such, but the dishes break before the floor (and then I have to hide from my wife.)

Would I put this in my garage? Well, I like the antique wood finish, so maybe.

 

[the draft]

While not in my garage, I can see the benefits. I laid this about a year ago, and am very happy with it. I saw the clip method, but decided against it, just to avoid the added expense and headache. I had no problem laying these and feel they came out fine. There is no lip issue whatsoever. Go with the medium sized rubber crosses and things will go smooth. I've dropped a few things on them, dishes and such, but the dishes break before the floor (and then I have to hide from my wife.)

Would I put this in my garage? Well, I like the antique wood finish, so maybe.

I really like that look and think a garage floor awesome with that tile.

 

[383]

While not in my garage, I can see the benefits. I laid this about a year ago, and am very happy with it. I saw the clip method, but decided against it, just to avoid the added expense and headache. I had no problem laying these and feel they came out fine. There is no lip issue whatsoever. Go with the medium sized rubber crosses and things will go smooth. I've dropped a few things on them, dishes and such, but the dishes break before the floor (and then I have to hide from my wife.)

Would I put this in my garage? Well, I like the antique wood finish, so maybe.

Sorry for the hijack, but what tile did you use? I'm looking for something similar in my rustic barn style basement (build thread here http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=329978&page=2)

 

[krcoomer]

Yep. I agree with all those comments. I used these same tiles in the mudroom off the garage. Most of them have a bit of lengthwise bow (crown) which causes lippage between tiles. It's disguised a little by the rough sawn look. They are also thin. You do have to install them in a staggered 1/3, 2/3 pattern to minimize the lippage effect. Base color is white, so if you chip the surface it will stand out against a darker wood pattern.

Base color being white, I believe I would keep a Sharpie around to cover up the chips if I were using these.

 

[rcass]

Sorry for the hijack, but what tile did you use? I'm looking for something similar in my rustic barn style basement (build thread here http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=329978&page=2)

looks like timber ash from lowes, 8"X48" tiles, I have it installed in a laundry room and it is fantastic tile.