Prepping for Epoxy - Will Acid Etching Work in My Case?

[boba7523]

Hi Everyone,

I'm going to be applying epoxy flooring to my concrete flooring that is 10 years old. I live in Southern California and it is very dry here.

I've done the following tests to determine if epoxy would work:

1. I've taped up a few squares over different sections of the floor and detected no moisture within the plastic bags after 3 days.

2. I poured water onto the concrete and found water beading up. Water did not get absorbed into the concrete.

Allgaragefloors indicate that acid etching will not work if my concrete has coating or sealer.

Based on #2, does this mean my concrete has a layer of coating or sealer on it that acid etching won't be able to remove?

 

[MagicMarker]

Agreed.. Acid etching won't help you.

 

[trentonmakes]

Could mean simply it is not porous.

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[boba7523]

Could mean simply it is not porous.

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Any additional test i can do to test whether there's sealant on my concrete besides the water absorb test?

 

[trentonmakes]

That was pretty much the extent of my knowledge with concrete, Lol
Sorry, I'm sure someone here has an answer for you.

Maybe sand a small area?? Purely guessing on this

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[Shea]

It sounds like you do have some sort of sealer on the concrete. Beading of the water is not a good sign. A second test you can do is apply some acid etch to the floor in a small spot. If it fizzes and bubbles angrily then you don't have a sealer. However if it just sits there with mild or no fizzing and bubbling then you do have a sealer for sure.

Acid etching is a reactive process in which the acid reacts with the free lime in the concrete. Sealers prevent the acid from reaching the free lime and don't react.

 

[LegacyIndustrial]

Yes, look for the fizz.

 

[boba7523]

Thanks guys!

I did the water bead test again today. I poured a little onto the concrete, it stays beaded. After about 15 minutes, I wiped it down with dry cloth and find water stain on the concrete (as shown in the photos).

If it had sealer on the concrete, would there be water stains at all?

This was at about 87F and low humidity weather.

Even when I did the test under concrete area with sun exposure, there was water stain after the sun dried the water beads.

Here are photos of several spots where the water beaded after I initially poured it onto the concrete, and about 15 mins after I wiped it with rag.

 

[boobag]

why does your floor have so many cracks?

 

[ddewey78]

why does your floor have so many cracks?

My guess is because its southern california, earthquake country

 

[boba7523]

why does your floor have so many cracks?

My guess is because its southern california, earthquake country

I think earthquakes... What happens if I put epoxy on? Will epoxy crack too?

Going back on topic... Is my concrete sealed?

If it's not sealed, and based on the condition of my concrete, should I be good with just acid etching?

The concrete looks kind of old or "dirty" in the pics...

 

[Armorpoxy]

If it beads up at all it's generally sealed. Best precaution is to grind it well, then use an epixy primer, 100% solids epoxy, and topcoat.

 

[boba7523]

THanks!

Regarding the hairline cracks everywhere in the concrete.....

Should I use concrete resurfacer to fill it in or just grind it?

 

[LegacyIndustrial]

Grind your floor. Those hairlines may only be on the very surface.
If they are evident post grinding than yes fill with a gel filler as they could telegraph through the coating.

 

[boba7523]

Grind your floor. Those hairlines may only be on the very surface.
If they are evident post grinding than yes fill with a gel filler as they could telegraph through the coating.

Since hairline cracks are prominent, what happens if the garage develops further hairline cracks after epoxy? Would the underlying concrete crack extend to the epoxy coating too?

And for the gel filler, do you mean something like

?

Could I use concrete resurfacer from Rustoleum?

 

[LegacyIndustrial]

Boba:
Coatings are not structural and therefore if the slab "moves" coatings are not going to stop it. That said it is common to have shrinkage cracks from a new slab and it this is generally the end of it as long as the concrete was placed correctly.

Here is a link and I don't like anything with Rust in the name, my opinion.

http://www.legacyindustrial.net/products/crack-joint-products/legacys-gel-crack-filler.html

 

[boba7523]

Grind your floor. Those hairlines may only be on the very surface.
If they are evident post grinding than yes fill with a gel filler as they could telegraph through the coating.

Boba:
Coatings are not structural and therefore if the slab "moves" coatings are not going to stop it. That said it is common to have shrinkage cracks from a new slab and it this is generally the end of it as long as the concrete was placed correctly.

Here is a link and I don't like anything with Rust in the name, my opinion.

http://www.legacyindustrial.net/products/crack-joint-products/legacys-gel-crack-filler.html

Any instructional vid?

So basically fill up crack with putty, try to make it as flat as possible.

Then when dry, use grinder to finalize the smoothness?

 

[LegacyIndustrial]

Any instructional vid?

So basically fill up crack with putty, try to make it as flat as possible.

Then when dry, use grinder to finalize the smoothness?

There is an old video:

Yes, best to smooth with a grinder once cured.

 

[boba7523]

^^ Thanks I'll look into it.

By the way, is it common for people to also epoxy the concrete "baseboard" of their garage floors as well? My baseball is concrete, but it's extremely rough and crackily. Cracks and chips of 0.5" deep is common..

If I want to epoxy that, what tool could I use to sand it? ... Diamond grinder would be way too big.

 

[boobag]

^^ Thanks I'll look into it.

By the way, is it common for people to also epoxy the concrete "baseboard" of their garage floors as well? My baseball is concrete, but it's extremely rough and crackily. Cracks and chips of 0.5" deep is common..

If I want to epoxy that, what tool could I use to sand it? ... Diamond grinder would be way too big.

i would epoxy it. you could use a grout or or mortar to fill in the voids and wipe surface clean with a moist sponge.

 

[benwah]

My baseball is concrete, but it's extremely rough and crackily. .

Sounds like a heavy baseball!

But on a more serious note, yes you can go ahead and coat the baseboard or "footing" if you'd like. The best way to prep it IMO, is to use a hand grinder with a diamond wheel. If you want to repair, a cementitious epoxy mortar or a 100% solids epoxy with fumed silica mixed in would work great for vertical surfaces.

If you don't care about the chips and cracks just go ahead and coat it. It's not going to see any foot traffic and is just for aesthetics. Thin your first coat 15-20%, apply your second coat unthinned. Shouldn't have any issues.

 

[boba7523]

Sounds like a heavy baseball!

But on a more serious note, yes you can go ahead and coat the baseboard or "footing" if you'd like. The best way to prep it IMO, is to use a hand grinder with a diamond wheel. If you want to repair, a cementitious epoxy mortar or a 100% solids epoxy with fumed silica mixed in would work great for vertical surfaces.

If you don't care about the chips and cracks just go ahead and coat it. It's not going to see any foot traffic and is just for aesthetics. Thin your first coat 15-20%, apply your second coat unthinned. Shouldn't have any issues.

Lol thanks for "catching" the baseball

I have an angle grinder from Harbor Freight... Would diamond attachment work on them? I'll have to take pics of the cracks.

If the cracks so happen to be in the top corner of the footing on the outside, would I still be able to fill it up with mortar/grout and still form that 90 degree angle?

 

[benwah]

Can you post some pics?

 

[boba7523]

Can you post some pics?

Will do tomorrow!

Thanks!

 

[boba7523]

Can you post some pics?

Here it is, you see how rough it is.

 

[boobag]

get some tile thinset and trowel it on, then sponge it smooth with a damp sponge after it sets a bit. then epoxy it.

 

[Armorpoxy]

Agree with above this stem area of the floor seems pretty rough and probably the most efficient way to fix it is just use a standard mortar that you can get at a home center. Attempting to fix this with epoxy could be very expensive and difficult unless you use our epoxy mortar and really not worth it using epoxy in this area since it's not going to see any traffic.

We also suggest using any epoxy that you purchase to do the floor first then see how much you have left over if you want to do this area. It's a good idea to take some epoxy while you're doing the floor and painting on a piece of cardboard or wood so that if you just want to coat this area you can take the sample to a local paint store and have them tint to match with an inexpensive enamel since this is just for appearance.

 

[boba7523]

get some tile thinset and trowel it on, then sponge it smooth with a damp sponge after it sets a bit. then epoxy it.

Thank you sir! After I apply thinset:

1.) Would i have to sand it down to prep for paint?

2.) Wait a certain # of days before I can apply paint to it?


Edit:

By the way guys, any way to hand mix the thinset together with water by using some kind of spatchula tool instead of "beater bar"? Don't have beater bar at home...

Agree with above this stem area of the floor seems pretty rough and probably the most efficient way to fix it is just use a standard mortar that you can get at a home center. Attempting to fix this with epoxy could be very expensive and difficult unless you use our epoxy mortar and really not worth it using epoxy in this area since it's not going to see any traffic.

We also suggest using any epoxy that you purchase to do the floor first then see how much you have left over if you want to do this area. It's a good idea to take some epoxy while you're doing the floor and painting on a piece of cardboard or wood so that if you just want to coat this area you can take the sample to a local paint store and have them tint to match with an inexpensive enamel since this is just for appearance.

Such a brilliant idea! I didn't think of this! This would save me some money as it'd just be for appearance. Thanks so much for this!

 

[boba7523]

get some tile thinset and trowel it on, then sponge it smooth with a damp sponge after it sets a bit. then epoxy it.

Like use an actual "kitchen sponge" to smooth it?

 

[boba7523]

^^^ Any help appreciated!

 

[LegacyIndustrial]

Boba:

Thin-set that curb. Let it dry well. Tape off the floor, coat it with epoxy first, flake it, pull the tape and finish the floor.

Just make sure you get extra epoxy in smaller quantities for this.

Always top down when doing a floor project, last portion is the floor.

 

[Armorpoxy]

We always recommend completing your floor first since curbs and stem walls can be super porous and we have seen many customers mis judge the amount of coating needed for these areas and then you could run out for the floor and have to wait a week or so to complete your project to get it delivered unless it was a locally purchased product and having to have a seam possibly.

Our standard procedure is do the floor. Then work on walls and curbs and such. Also paint some epoxy on a piece of cardboard and if you need coating for the walls just get some enamel tinted to match. Less expensive and faster and these area see zero traffic and really don't need epoxy in most cases. Protecting the floor is easy.

We hate to see our customers need more product because of curb and wall issues.


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[boba7523]

Thanks guys.

Any particular thinset for the curb (paint it later on vs epoxy) or just the most inexpensive ones would do? I see there's fortified, etc...

I heard something about using thinset with bonding agent so it'll bond better ?