Pressure Switch and Regulations

[sourdough]

I have a propane domestic water heater in use for 7 years since new.

A couple of times the standing pilot has gone out, I'm guessing due to high winds.

I relit it using the procedure on the burner cover. No problem.

If I was a homeowner with no knowledge of said device, I probably would have called a mechanical service company to relight it. Even though thermocouples do not fail intermittently, I'll bet that the tech would have suggested a replacement of the thermocouple for CYA and charged twice the amount that anyone could buy it at HD, Lowe's, or your local hardware store.

I know contractors have to charge large amounts to stay in business, but some of it is over the top.

 

[mygarageone]

I have a propane domestic water heater in use for 7 years since new.

A couple of times the standing pilot has gone out, I'm guessing due to high winds.

I relit it using the procedure on the burner cover. No problem.

If I was a homeowner with no knowledge of said device, I probably would have called a mechanical service company to relight it. Even though thermocouples do not fail intermittently, I'll bet that the tech would have suggested a replacement of the thermocouple for CYA and charged twice the amount that anyone could buy it at HD, Lowe's, or your local hardware store.

I know contractors have to charge large amounts to stay in business, but some of it is over the top.

Yes a tech may very have suggested to replace it or tested it and determined it needed replacement . We are not parts changers , that's way they call us tech's .
And I would guess you have no idea about what it even costs to show up at your home and return to the shop. Most haven't a clue

 

[sms1974]

As an expert contractor, please explain why. You throw out all replies while never delineating the reasons. Point in case: you not addressing a bad heat exchanger while claiming that could cause a combustion air fan failure/pressure switch failure.

I am sure you have procedures in place for all of your techs to comply with your business practices. I seriously believe that your viewpoint has to do with CYA as a contractor.

Seriously awaiting why my diagnoses for combustion air switch failure won't work other than that your junior tech would find it laughable.

If, as you have stated, you don't want to respond to idiot folks such as myself, I'll just treat it as such.

Carry on, sir.

Jim

I've not denied any of the answers as possible reasons for a pressure switch failure, or for a integrated control to show a pressure switch fault. I have from the start implied or intended to imply that often a pressure switch fault does not indicate a bad switch, yes it can be just a bad switch.

As for your question of how a bad heat exchanger can cause the control to show a pressure switch fault let's talk about what the pressure switch is there for... Your remark that it is only there to prove that the combustion air fan is working is incorrect. Yes a working combustion venter is necessary, and yes some lower end equipment does use the venter housing as place to attach the hose that is then attached to the switch as a source of negative pressure. This alone does not mean it's only there to prove the fan is working.

Sequence of operation for your typical modern furnace is as follows:
1. Thermostat calls for heat
2. Integrated control will initiate a check of limits and safeties. This includes the pressure switch.
3. Combustion venter is turned on.
4. The pressure switch closes.
5. The ignition process begins.
6. Burners are lit
7. Flame sensor indicates there is flame
8. After a given time the blower is turned on
9. The furnace runs until the thermostat is satisfied.

Ok so what does the combustion venter do as it runs ??? Yes it moves air... If you have looked at the required negative pressure on the switches you know it is a very low and specific pressure. If you have a restricted exhaust it will not move enough air to create that negative pressure. If you have a badly cracked, rusted out, or plugged up heat exchanger it will not move the correct amount of air and in turn will not create the required specific negative pressure...

As it's been said there are several reasons a control may indicate a pressure switch fault, sometimes it's a bad switch often times it's not...

I just left a no heat call, control indicated pressure switch. There was a spiders nest in the tube to the switch... Had one over the weekend furnace was a 90% on propane, the homeowner has a wood shop in his basement with a big belt sander right next to the furnace. The burners plugged up with sawdust which causes the flame pattern to be very dirty sooty it completly plugged the secondary heat exchanger. The fault on the control was a 3 flash = pressure switch...

I checked back just to see if Bigwil ever posted about his furnace and if replacing the switch cured his problems.

My intention is Not to stir the pot up...

 

[sms1974]

I have a propane domestic water heater in use for 7 years since new.

A couple of times the standing pilot has gone out, I'm guessing due to high winds.

I relit it using the procedure on the burner cover. No problem.

If I was a homeowner with no knowledge of said device, I probably would have called a mechanical service company to relight it. Even though thermocouples do not fail intermittently, I'll bet that the tech would have suggested a replacement of the thermocouple for CYA and charged twice the amount that anyone could buy it at HD, Lowe's, or your local hardware store.

I know contractors have to charge large amounts to stay in business, but some of it is over the top.

7 years old and the pilot drops out, the first thing a tech would do is pull and clean the pilot assembly and yes if it were me I would have automatically put a new thermocouple in it. Part of the reason for calling a service company is piece of mind that your water heater is going to work properly after the tech leaves that's why I would replace the thermocouple not to make the 3 bucks of mark up on it and so I didn't have to get a nasty call and go back to put a thermocouple in it on my time a month later...

 

[sms1974]

Yeah I remember Ge and fedders /knock off trane stuff also,so whats your point?Goodman has no more problems than any other brand out there if its installed right.

If you've been in the industry that long you should know the liniage of equipment brands...

Tappan became GE which then became Trane, while all along the line being owned by American Standard Co. And now owned by Ingersol Rand.

Interesting that you defend Goodman... Well known for being one of the cheapest poorly made products in the industry... Bet you like Janitrol equipment too... York used to be good equipment, but today's product is not so good...

Yes most all manufactures use the same 3rd party controls in there equipment, and I'll agree the control failure rate is relatively even across the board of brands but the fit finish and build quality and quality of materials is tremendously different. I can pull burners, flame sensor, and ignitor clean inspect and reassemble them in a Trane / American Standard piece of equipment in less than 5 min. Try that in some of the other brands out there...

No doubt you have some knowledge and experience in the industry but your not the all knowing wiz, nor am I..

Point is there are 100 different ways to get to the same place, and they can all be the right way so long as you get there in the end.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

If you've been in the industry that long you should know the liniage of equipment brands...

Tappan became GE which then became Trane, while all along the line being owned by American Standard Co. And now owned by Ingersol Rand.

Interesting that you defend Goodman... Well known for being one of the cheapest poorly made products in the industry... Bet you like Janitrol equipment too... York used to be good equipment, but today's product is not so good...

Yes most all manufactures use the same 3rd party controls in there equipment, and I'll agree the control failure rate is relatively even across the board of brands but the fit finish and build quality and quality of materials is tremendously different. I can pull burners, flame sensor, and ignitor clean inspect and reassemble them in a Trane / American Standard piece of equipment in less than 5 min. Try that in some of the other brands out there...

No doubt you have some knowledge and experience in the industry but your not the all knowing wiz, nor am I..

Point is there are 100 different ways to get to the same place, and they can all be the right way so long as you get there in the end.

Goodman has come a long ways since the jani-junk/junki-trol days!
I sold a whole lot of ducane stuff back in the 90s also,they were a manufacturer for a lot of other co's back in the day before lennox bought them out and broke a lot of peoples hearts!
Coleman/evcon has also been a manufacturer for many other co's over the years.
Im far from being the all knowing wiz of anything,I do too many different things to be able to remember it all.
But like we've both said,theres more than one way to do anything.