Privacy Fence

[Todd.Brock]

Only 50% garage related, but I am installing a 6 foot privacy fence across the back of my yard. I am using 4x4 posts on 8' centers, 2x4 cross braces and 5/8" thick 6ft PT pickets. What is the best air nailer to use? I have a Paslode 16 GA Nailer , which would probably hold, but probably isn't the best choice either. should I go to a 2 inch framing nail?I would have to purchase or rent a framing nailer because I do not have one. Thanks for all the help. And since the boards are only 6 inches wide, screwing them in is not my first choice

 

[nehog]

If this is pressure treated wood, use the correct nails. Standard (galvanized) nails will rot out and fail. Stainless nails are the recommendation.

 

[Todd.Brock]

It is pressure treated. Is stainless readily avail for a framing nailer?

 

[LB-1911]

Paslode's Hot Dipped Galvanized Plus nails offer premium corrosion resistance in all pressure treated lumber such as ACQ and MCQ
http://www.paslode.com/nails/galvanized-framing/


Additional information - May / June 2008
Corrosion-resistant fasteners
http://www.paslode.com/uploadedFile...Nails_Contractor-Tools-and-Supplies_May08.pdf

 

[theoldwizard1]

Those picket are pretty thin. It will be hard to find the "proper" nail to attach them to the 2x4. What you really want is a ring shank, "box nail". A box nail is fairly thin and short (2 - 2½") and with a full head (the head is disproportionately large for the diameter of the nail)

Hot dipped galvanized is the way to go ... if you can find them. I used "flash" galvanized nails on my wood fence over 25 years ago. None of the nails have rotted. Ring shank or twisted is a must !

 

[dclassical]

I can't remember the thickness of the pickets, but I think they were 3/4".

I used SS screws for the 2x4 to the 4x4 posts:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000I68CII/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Then used these SS nails:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00937XB0C/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Nail gun:
Bostitch N75C-1

 

[Todd.Brock]

Well, the pickets are thin. I ordered as 1" thick from the lumber yard. When they were delivered it was 5/8. Not too happy about it. Delivery guy was like what do you want to do? He said that was what they had. I could have bought them from HOme Depot if I wanted paper thin , and saved some money. I have a call into the sales guy to see what they can do. Either way, I bought a box of 2" ring shank stainless steel nails .113 full round head and a NuMax 21 degree Framing nailer. It's a HF equivalent and was 69 bucks. I'm not making a living with it , but 199 reviews and a rating of 4.5 out of five on Amazon gives me enough confidence it can drive 1000 nails.

 

[67carl]

How long is the fence? I did a shorter section and used deck screws. Wasn't as cheap and definitely took longer than a nail gun, but those pickets are not going anywhere and there is no staining.

 

[Todd.Brock]

I have 175 pickets to install (80 ft) and not a lot of time. I splurged on stainless nails so I hope to not have staining. In fact 1000 nails was only 2 bucks less than the nailer!

 

[kv501]

How long is the fence? I did a shorter section and used deck screws. Wasn't as cheap and definitely took longer than a nail gun, but those pickets are not going anywhere and there is no staining.

^^^ This. Don't cheap out on your fence, use screws even if it's a long stretch. I've built a lot of feet of privacy fence and screws are by far and away the right choice. Way sturdier, no staining, and you can disassemble it so much easier. You don't think so now, but you'll appreciate being able to easily remove a picket/panel when you need to.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Well, the pickets are thin. I ordered as 1" thick from the lumber yard. When they were delivered it was 5/8.

A 1" "nominal" board should be about 3/4" thick.

My fence is a non-standard 5'. We bought 10' PT 1x6, cut them in half and dog eared them ourselves.

Either way, I bought a box of 2" ring shank stainless steel nails .113 full round head and a NuMax 21 degree Framing nailer.

Sounds good !

Screws are nice, but not worth the cost.

Make yourself some kind of jig for spacing your pickets and setting the height. It will make things MUCH faster.

 

[Zeke]

I wouldn't be happy if the supplier took an order for 1" pickets and delivered 5/8" pickets and then asked, "What do you want to do?"

That's a rhetorical question. I'd demand what I paid for, or a 100% refund.

That's lumber speak for nominal size. You think a 2 x 4 is 2" thick? I suspect the fence boards are fence boards and not 1 x 6 lumber. Fence boards are most often T & G or Hill and Dale and resawn on one side. There's where the eighth goes. The are able to take 2 x 6 S2S lumber and split it with the saw and mill the edges all in one operation.

 

[dclassical]

I installed 500 pickets last year and there is no staining with the SS nails or screws. I decided to use screws for the 2x4s to the 4x4 posts, so it would be "easy" to remove a whole section. In the 13 years that the fence was there I never had a picket come loose with the nails, this is why I used nails for the pickets.

 

[kv501]

I wouldn't be happy if the supplier took an order for 1" pickets and delivered 5/8" pickets and then asked, "What do you want to do?"

That's a rhetorical question. I'd demand what I paid for, or a 100% refund.

There's no such thing as a 1" (nominal) fence board. Standard fence boards are 5/8". To get a 1" board you're going to have to either buy dimensional lumber or make it yourself.

 

[JerryB]

I'm currently rebuilding a very similar fence:

Original was built by a fence contractor around 20+ years ago: 4x4 posts, 2x4 stringers, 2x6 ground board, 1x6 vertical boards. All lumber was FULL DIMENSION redwood!

First mistake was letting them set the posts in concrete. It took over 15 years, but about 1/3 of the posts eventually rotted off at ground level and allowed sections of the fence to blow over.

Next mistake was letting them use galvanized common nails along with a significant amount of toe nailing to hold the fence together. This resulted in lots of failed fasteners over time.

The replacement is all (green, not HD's brown stuff) treated lumber. Nominal 4x4 posts (actual 3 1/2 x 3 1/2") are being set in native soil. No concrete.

2x4 stringers and 2x6 ground board (actual 1 1/2 x 3 1/2" & 1 1/2 x 5 1/2") framing is being installed using Simpson Brand fence brackets and hex head SD Structural-Connector Screws.

The original 1 x 6" x 6' full dimension redwood boards will be reused, only cutting off about 1" on each end to eliminate the place where they were originally toe nailed. These boards will be installed on the new framing using Deckmate Brand Star Drive Coated Screws. Note that both the Simpson and the Deckmate products are rated for use in treated wood.

Bottom line is that the replacement fence will be assembled using only a post hole digger and an impact driver. Then when a component (say a post or stringer) fails in the future, I can easily remove that component and replace it without damaging the rest of a nailed structure, or tearing out large sections of the fence.

 

[Hawk]

Some places will accept an order of 5/4 " which will be 1 inch after production.

 

[kv501]

Some places will accept an order of 5/4 " which will be 1 inch after production.

And more than double the price. At that point you could just as well cut up deck boards and dog ear them.

 

[In2toys]

I use a Hitachi siding nailer for pickets, 2" hot dipped,

 

[Hornman]

I'm currently rebuilding a very similar fence:

Original was built by a fence contractor around 20+ years ago: 4x4 posts, 2x4 stringers, 2x6 ground board, 1x6 vertical boards. All lumber was FULL DIMENSION redwood!

First mistake was letting them set the posts in concrete. It took over 15 years, but about 1/3 of the posts eventually rotted off at ground level and allowed sections of the fence to blow over.

Next mistake was letting them use galvanized common nails along with a significant amount of toe nailing to hold the fence together. This resulted in lots of failed fasteners over time.

The replacement is all (green, not HD's brown stuff) treated lumber. Nominal 4x4 posts (actual 3 1/2 x 3 1/2") are being set in native soil. No concrete.

2x4 stringers and 2x6 ground board (actual 1 1/2 x 3 1/2" & 1 1/2 x 5 1/2") framing is being installed using Simpson Brand fence brackets and hex head SD Structural-Connector Screws.

The original 1 x 6" x 6' full dimension redwood boards will be reused, only cutting off about 1" on each end to eliminate the place where they were originally toe nailed. These boards will be installed on the new framing using Deckmate Brand Star Drive Coated Screws. Note that both the Simpson and the Deckmate products are rated for use in treated wood.

Bottom line is that the replacement fence will be assembled using only a post hole digger and an impact driver. Then when a component (say a post or stringer) fails in the future, I can easily remove that component and replace it without damaging the rest of a nailed structure, or tearing out large sections of the fence.

Interesting. My city just implemented a new fence ordinance. All NEW or REPLACEMENT fences, MUST have tubular metal fence posts set in concrete. The size of the tube and the depth of set and the diameter of the concrete surround are specified by the ordinance depending on height. The ordinance does not specifically state that fences must be built by commercial fence companies, but they make it difficult for the DIY'er. Yes, you must get a permit, yes, they do inspect the finished fence. This ordinance was implimented with enforcement fangs: if you put up a noncomplying fence, they can make you bring it into compliance, OR they can tear it down and bill you for the demolition. This is Texas for crying out loud, how did this happen. Must be nice to be able to build a fence the way you want to.

Last fence I built was pressure treated 4x4's set in concrete (three 80 lb bags per post), treated 2x4 stringers (3 for a six foot fence), and pressure treated fence boards held on with bugle head beaver bite ss screws (square drive). Made the last two sections removable, even the 4x4 upright, so the poco could get to the transformer on the pole in the opposite corner of the yard.

 

[Hawk]

And more than double the price. At that point you could just as well cut up deck boards and dog ear them.

Yes I agree, but he was upset that a 1 x was less than one inch. Personally I would prefer using deck boards to make a fence.

 

[soob]

Do they actually advertise 5/8 boards as 1" fence boards? I have never heard 5/8 fence boards called 1" (but then I don't put up fences or work in a lumber yard). If 1" is not common industry jargon for a 5/8" fence board then the supplier is in the fault here.

Lowes got dinged not too long ago by some state's attorney general for advertising various non-dimensional lumber things as if they were dimensional lumber.

 

[Todd.Brock]

They are listed as 1"x5.5" x 6 ' fence pickets. It's not dimensional lumber cut down. I was just annoyed I paid a premium for the same material as Home Depot. I thought I was getting a thicker board which was worth the premium . He said that if I hired them out to do the fence, it would have been the same material. It would have been a weekend event just getting 50 4x4x8 posts, eighty 16ft poplar rails, 50 bags of concrete , 175 pickets and 30 2x4x8 boards. Borrowing a trailer , multiple trips across town, etc. time was worth more than running over town saving some bucks.

Either way, I'm using 3 in deck mates for the 2x4 cross rails to the posts. I will use screws for a couple of the pickets so I can get to the 4x4 posts and take down a whole section at a time. I'm not 100% sure we will be in the house in 15 years so I will have to deal with posts then.

 

[Zeke]

Some places will accept an order of 5/4 " which will be 1 inch after production.

That would be very expensive for a fence.

On the posts, native soil ain't so good either. What I do is dig the hole, pour in some crushed rock, insert the post and then pour in some dry sackcrete to set the post plumb. At that point I'm not quite half full. Then I'll mix up some sackcrete on the dry side and pack that in not paying too much attention to voids. Stuff it with a stick a few times, check plumb and walk away. This gives a nice heavy post base for wind load and kids climbing while offering lots of drainage. I bell out the top a little and leave the thing below grade sloping up to the base of the post just about grade.

 

[Falcon67]

FWIW - you'd be way better off using heavy galvanized 2 1/2" x 8' chain link end posts rather than 4x4s. Set on 8' intervals, use the board brackets and run three 2x4x16' across to mount your pickets. Your material costs may be the same or less and you'll have a way stronger fence and poles that will still be there in 20 years. I used 2" hot dipped ring shank nails in my refurbed Porter-Cable framing nailer. You can't pull those nails out, you cut them off when you change a picket LOL.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Interesting. My city just implemented a new fence ordinance. All NEW or REPLACEMENT fences, MUST have tubular metal fence posts set in concrete.

I just got done helping my son replacing a 4x4 cedar post at his house. Over the past 7-8 years we have replaced about 9-10.

We have also pulled an additional 30-40 concrete post bases from other fences and decks he has removed. We finally have the "system" down. About 5-10 minutes of digging to get a chain around the base, hook up the "patent pending post puller" and a truck and yank.

That was a 4x6 post and we estimate the concrete ball on the end weighted more than 200 lbs !

 

[theoldwizard1]

There's no such thing as a 1" (nominal) fence board. Standard fence boards are 5/8". To get a 1" board you're going to have to either buy dimensional lumber or make it yourself.

Which is what I did. Not for the thickness, but for the desired height. 25+ years and I have only lost a couple of boards.

 

[Todd.Brock]

I just got done helping my son replacing a 4x4 cedar post at his house. Over the past 7-8 years we have replaced about 9-10.



We have also pulled an additional 30-40 concrete post bases from other fences and decks he has removed. We finally have the "system" down. About 5-10 minutes of digging to get a chain around the base, hook up the "patent pending post puller" and a truck and yank.



That was a 4x6 post and we estimate the concrete ball on the end weighted more than 200 lbs !

Is there a link that works for your post puller? I couldn't seem to click on it or copy/paste. Thanks!

 

[CNGsaves]

OP . . . you've already compromised to substandard fence with 3 things . . .
1) pressure treated pickets (those won't last at all unless you stain/paint often)
I'd have complained and got those for a song if you ordered 1" and got 5/8" instead. Best pickets would have been CEDAR.
2) 4x4 wooden posts . . . . . should have used steel
3) nails versus screws . . . . should have used screws

Hoping there is not a 4th compromise . . . . hope you didn't use just 2 stringers ?? Or also didn't put any of the stringers horizontal ??

Best fence has STEEL posts, 3 or 4 stringers on edge, and cedar pickets.

 

[Falcon67]

It depends on the climate for sure, but the pickets on our fence are cheap *** white wood and are going on 15 years. Sure, a handful are getting ratty but 99% of the fence is intact. Not ideal, but not worth worrying about for us.

 

[rippered]

Is there a link that works for your post puller? I couldn't seem to click on it or copy/paste. Thanks!

I use 2 8' 4x4s with 1 large bolt through the top to make an A. Then hang a come along off the top of your A. Hook the other end of the come along to the post and easily pull it out. If the ground is dry, saturate it with a hose. I pulled a dozen post set in concrete by myself.

 

[Todd.Brock]

OP . . . you've already compromised to substandard fence with 3 things . . .

1) pressure treated pickets (those won't last at all unless you stain/paint often)

I'd have complained and got those for a song if you ordered 1" and got 5/8" instead. Best pickets would have been CEDAR.

2) 4x4 wooden posts . . . . . should have used steel

3) nails versus screws . . . . should have used screws



Hoping there is not a 4th compromise . . . . hope you didn't use just 2 stringers ?? Or also didn't put any of the stringers horizontal ??



Best fence has STEEL posts, 3 or 4 stringers on edge, and cedar pickets.

No stringers at all. Just leaned them all up against a string and hoping they stay up.


I can appreciate the level of quality , I am also doing 265 ft of Kentucky 4 board fence. My materials costs alone were 2100 bucks, so it may not last until the dawn of time, but it will work for me.

 

[stihlntime]

I would use screws as some have suggested. Just easier too replace damaged pieces in the future. Stronger neater looking appearance. Seldom use nails anymore if I can use screws.