Strouty
Well-known member
You don't know how bad I want to help with this! I love these types of projects. The more people say no way, the more it makes me want to go forward. Of course it is your money, not mine.
Putting a basement under my garage (& back yard) ?
- Thread starter someguy11
- Start date
DeadSock
Well-known member
building a 9' wall, and infilling (with lifts compacted ) is different than excavating 9' and then building a wall. that's what I'm saying. Even leaving out the fact of existing structures within that 9'.
DeadSock
Well-known member
From the google earth picture, it looks like it further than the garage, but okay. (I was guessing 7' each)
SE just confirmed that if we use a concrete beam that integrates with the grade beam to set the garage wall on, we don't need to use a steel beam at all. This saves a lot of money and headache.
We'll need to put a couple (movable ?, steel ?) posts under it, but the only place that will not be a 9 foot ceiling in the bunker will be where this single beam goes, right under the garage wall. There are a few more details to it than that, but that is the essence anyway.
Using a steel beam would have been a headache because it has to sit entirely under the roof pads. It would be hard to limit its height to 12", meaning the clearance under the beam would have been less than 8'. I was trying to avoid that. I'm guessing the beam would have needed to be 16 or 18" deep.
The key to making this work is that the integrated beam can be 32" tall. Beam strength varies greatly with height. We couldn't make a 12" tall concrete beam work, but its straightforward to make a 32" concrete beam work. Forming and pouring this beam is going to add time to the construction schedule, but a steel beam wasn't without hassle either.
The beam needs to be under the garage wall because the snow load from the roof is supported by the garage wall. Actually, it could be designed so that the beam isn't directly under the wall, but its simplest if you can and in my situation it works out well.
Hopefully my chicken scratch diagram clarifies the situation a bit.
We haven't calculated rebar content yet, but I'm pretty sure its going to come in well under the $8,000 I budgeted for beams, posts and rebar.
FYI, there is a bit over 3 yards of concrete in the 34 feet of integrated beam.
We'll need to put a couple (movable ?, steel ?) posts under it, but the only place that will not be a 9 foot ceiling in the bunker will be where this single beam goes, right under the garage wall. There are a few more details to it than that, but that is the essence anyway.
Using a steel beam would have been a headache because it has to sit entirely under the roof pads. It would be hard to limit its height to 12", meaning the clearance under the beam would have been less than 8'. I was trying to avoid that. I'm guessing the beam would have needed to be 16 or 18" deep.
The key to making this work is that the integrated beam can be 32" tall. Beam strength varies greatly with height. We couldn't make a 12" tall concrete beam work, but its straightforward to make a 32" concrete beam work. Forming and pouring this beam is going to add time to the construction schedule, but a steel beam wasn't without hassle either.
The beam needs to be under the garage wall because the snow load from the roof is supported by the garage wall. Actually, it could be designed so that the beam isn't directly under the wall, but its simplest if you can and in my situation it works out well.
Hopefully my chicken scratch diagram clarifies the situation a bit.
We haven't calculated rebar content yet, but I'm pretty sure its going to come in well under the $8,000 I budgeted for beams, posts and rebar.
FYI, there is a bit over 3 yards of concrete in the 34 feet of integrated beam.
Last edited:
Strouty
Well-known member
That is great news. There will be some significant costs in forming, but I would think you would be well under the $8k you had budgeted for the steel as well. Rebar is cheap. I am wondering if the engineer would just be using rebar or some pre or post tensioned device.
blkhonda1991
Well-known member
dont know about the merits of the beam sizing as i am not a structural engineer...just looks too small in my eyes. the real issue i see is that you create a joint at that location for water to infiltrate on the yard side...dont know what the solution is just something to think about vs. setting a continuous slab on a steel beam. whats the hang up with 8' ceiling at a beam?
Strouty
Well-known member
I agree simple is better, just wasn't sure if that had been decided yet. I will be really interested to see these designs. I am used to dealing with vertical structures not horizontal. It is kind of neat.
DeadSock
Well-known member
One other thing you should consider in your plan and cost estimates is to get yourself bonded (and if applicable, licensed) as the GC.
The purpose of the bond is insurance for the unexpected. Even, assuming the geotech and other engineers say everything is okay-dokay, your neighbor 'could' claim the cracks in his garage floor are from your construction (we all know concrete slabs do/will crack, but). Worse, something catastrophic happens and damages his or your $1M+ houses. The 'claim' isn't your issue, it's why you paid insurance.
Digging nearly 10' deep in close proximity to existing structures is so risky ...
I'm not hating on your plan/dream, but I would be pretty scared of the risks involved.
Strouty
Well-known member
I don't think he is in CA, he probably doesn't follow the same rules. I don't think I could even visit CA, I would probably drop dead the second I walked over the state line, all these chemicals that I use cause cancer in CA.
homebuilt burner
Well-known member
I have just thought of an idea that solves all your problems. Hire the guys that dug the tunnels and work areas in Hogan's Heros. They never had a cave in and I don't think they went through any permiting process, also never got caught.
Just messing with you. rock on.
Just messing with you. rock on.
Strouty
Well-known member
I know nothing!
DeadSock
Well-known member
I'm not talking about CA issues, I'm from AK (just winter in CA
)In AK, most places don't have permits required unless your near a salmonoid waterway (recently 'floodplain'). Still, I'm not getting 10 feet deep in a hole without a 'plan' (AK has issues CA blowhards can't even contemplate).
You can still be sued tho ... doesn't matter your zipcode. Let alone $1M+ properties
The closest excavation to my house will be 3 feet, except at the doorway to the bunker from the basement.
No offense to my neighbor, but his house is a 1950 bungalo. Its considerably shorter than my house, by about 10 feet. Its not worth anywhere near $1M. Not saying something can't happen, but we won't get anywhere near his foundation.
The biggest excavation obstacle will be his garage. It the earth settles under it, we'll mud jack a bit back in.
One corner of the concrete walkway on my house has settled a bit due to the drainage problem I mention from time to time. It needs to be mud jacked once we fix the drainage issue.
One step at a time. Professional people will advise me how to handle this properly.
I'll carry insurance for the project. I did on my reno.
Strouty
Well-known member
As long as the OP has hired an engineer and hires competent construction crews, his homeowners insurance should cover the rest.
Pads need joints so they can float or they will crack. Especially because one of those pads is inside the heated garage and the other is outside under the ground.
Dunno how we'll seal the joint yet. Probably fill it with sealant, cover it with waterproof membrane and concrete it over ? It will be covered with grass.
Just want a space with some headroom, especially if it might be part of a work area.
There are limits. I bought extra insurance when I did the reno. This project will be beyond the limits of homeowner insurance.
I'm not hiring any construction crew. Me and a helper or two are doing this project, unless we get overwhelmed. I'll make good use of advisors... just as we did on our reno and on the landscape project we did last summer.
Last edited:
Strouty
Well-known member
That would definitely be a concern, especially from a workers comp standpoint.
Fishplate
Well-known member
Might also be able to lay the membrane on top of the whole thing, then cover it with soil.
DeadSock
Well-known member
I'm still back to the geotech issue.
A 10'+ hole within 3' of a structure where there wasn't a plan for the excavation when the structure was built is a concern. (full basement homes not so bad, floating pad garages tho?)
FWIW, the reason I say 10'+ is because of the 'plan'.
I'd guess 6" of compacted fill, another 2" insulation?, a 4" slab. That's the 'floor'.
Now add 9' of headroom. Above that you have roof thickness, say 5"-6" ...
Add it up ... not a 9' hole, more like 10.5' hole.
<edit>I'll admit these garages might not be floating pads, but even a 3' foundation might suffer from a nearby 10'+ hole within a couple feet</edit>
A 10'+ hole within 3' of a structure where there wasn't a plan for the excavation when the structure was built is a concern. (full basement homes not so bad, floating pad garages tho?)
FWIW, the reason I say 10'+ is because of the 'plan'.
I'd guess 6" of compacted fill, another 2" insulation?, a 4" slab. That's the 'floor'.
Now add 9' of headroom. Above that you have roof thickness, say 5"-6" ...
Add it up ... not a 9' hole, more like 10.5' hole.
<edit>I'll admit these garages might not be floating pads, but even a 3' foundation might suffer from a nearby 10'+ hole within a couple feet</edit>
Last edited:
Strouty
Well-known member
If it were me, I would look at the viability of a pond liner to cover the entire surface with about 20" of overhang. This of course after I did regular waterproofing to all areas of the new structure.
Steve from Socal
Well-known member
Are there seismic considerations in plan?
Steve
Steve
someguy123
Member
- Joined
- Feb 4, 2013
- Messages
- 14
Nope.
My buddy signed on to help me with this project full time from September to Christmas. He helped me with adding a storage loft to the garage. http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=288535 He costs me more than $20 an hour, but he is a hard worker and a great asset on a job site. He is a great guy to work with too.
Regardless of whether we build the south wall 3 feet from the property line or right to the property line, its going to be tight for space. The SE says that we can pour the footings and walls in sections. They don't have to be a continuous pour.
Thus unless we get what looks to be a really good weather window (like a week forecasted to be hot and dry), I think we are going to pour the south wall in sections.
- dig most of the basement, leaving the south edges of the hole at a 45 degree slope
- ready all the materials for pouring a section of footing
- dig out a 8 or 12 foot section of earth to final depth
- immediately shore it up with 1" plywood sheets
- form and pour the footing, leave it dry 2 days
- place and brace the ICF blocks while waiting
- pour the wall as soon as possible
- remove the shoring and backfill as soon as possible
- repeat until the entire wall (41 feet) is poured.
I don't have a problem buying 1" plywood sheets for the entire length of the wall. We'll need them for cribbing when we pour the roofs anyway.
What I am worried about is the slope instability if we open the whole wall (41 feet) up at once. I'm also worried about a bad weather event happening when we have that wall opened up and making a mess of things.
By only opening up a section at a time we create a smaller, localized soil instability. By working next to a 45 degree bank, a completed concrete corner or a completed wall section, we are always working between stabilized sections of earth.
Its going to mess up hauling dirt away to do it this way and we'll be pouring more frequently, but its much safer and minimizes the potential for harming my neighbors property. We may only do 8 foot sections next to his garage, in order to ensure that the earth next to it is never fully destabilized and his foundation never moves.
The key to making this work is the ICF blocks. We could never make this work if we were using conventional forms and we needed to get a worker between the forms and the earth wall. There simply isn't enough room.
There are other ways to handle stabilizing and pouring that wall. I'll discuss them with the Geotechnical engineer when he visits. But pouring in sections is definitely an option.
Regardless of whether we build the south wall 3 feet from the property line or right to the property line, its going to be tight for space. The SE says that we can pour the footings and walls in sections. They don't have to be a continuous pour.
Thus unless we get what looks to be a really good weather window (like a week forecasted to be hot and dry), I think we are going to pour the south wall in sections.
- dig most of the basement, leaving the south edges of the hole at a 45 degree slope
- ready all the materials for pouring a section of footing
- dig out a 8 or 12 foot section of earth to final depth
- immediately shore it up with 1" plywood sheets
- form and pour the footing, leave it dry 2 days
- place and brace the ICF blocks while waiting
- pour the wall as soon as possible
- remove the shoring and backfill as soon as possible
- repeat until the entire wall (41 feet) is poured.
I don't have a problem buying 1" plywood sheets for the entire length of the wall. We'll need them for cribbing when we pour the roofs anyway.
What I am worried about is the slope instability if we open the whole wall (41 feet) up at once. I'm also worried about a bad weather event happening when we have that wall opened up and making a mess of things.
By only opening up a section at a time we create a smaller, localized soil instability. By working next to a 45 degree bank, a completed concrete corner or a completed wall section, we are always working between stabilized sections of earth.
Its going to mess up hauling dirt away to do it this way and we'll be pouring more frequently, but its much safer and minimizes the potential for harming my neighbors property. We may only do 8 foot sections next to his garage, in order to ensure that the earth next to it is never fully destabilized and his foundation never moves.
The key to making this work is the ICF blocks. We could never make this work if we were using conventional forms and we needed to get a worker between the forms and the earth wall. There simply isn't enough room.
There are other ways to handle stabilizing and pouring that wall. I'll discuss them with the Geotechnical engineer when he visits. But pouring in sections is definitely an option.
OldSoldier
Well-known member
If your SE is comfortable with retention piers that might be an option to get your building right up against the property line without worrying about sloughing soil or cave-ins. My deepest open hole I've done that was right up against but not over the property line was about 30' deep. Ask your soils engineer for that option regarding that side of your garage.
Machine Choice
If we don't move the garage, the largest machine we can get between the garage and the trees is 8 feet wide.
Unless we lift the garage quite high, the highest machine we can get is 9 ish feet tall, maybe 10. 7 or 8 feet would be better.
The machine is going to need to turn around within a 40ish foot hole.
I don't see a way to use an excavator if we don't move the garage. We can't back a truck between the garage and the trees and with the garage in the way there is no way to swing and dump into a truck parked in the back alley. Whatever machine I use is going to have to carry the dirt out the hole via the ramp beside the garage. Slow, but it saves having to rebuild the garage, which is costly and time consuming in itself.
I can think of 5 machines that could do this job
- a skid steer loader (wheeled)
- a tracked skid steer loader
- a small articulating wheeled loader
- a front wheel assist farm tractor with a loader
- a backhoe
The problem with the skid steer loaders is that they don't reach very high. Places where this will be a problem.
- reaching over a truck box to fill it
- trimming the top of the wall when we've dug full depth (10 feet)
- reaching to the top of the ICF forms
- etc.
You can get STs that reach pretty high, ie the JD D series will reach 8'+, but most are about 6 feet.
I've known about this limitation all along. What brought it to the forefront for me today is that if we excavate and pour the south wall in sections, we are going to need a bunch of pours to do it. I haven't found a concrete pump to rent yet and the cheapest concrete pump contractor is $400 minimum per site visit. For an 8 foot wall pour, we could use a skid steer to shuttle the concrete from the truck to the form if it would reach, but it won't.
I could probably fabricate something to increase the reach height, but that would be a PIA.
Ideally I'd like to use a small articulated wheel loader. It would be much faster than a ST. The problem is that they aren't that common and I'm afraid that if I bought one I wouldn't be able to resell it when the project is done. Articulated loaders have much better reach and way better ground clearance. However, they are taller and getting under the garage might be a problem.
A 60 HP front wheel assist ag tractor with a loader would work too, but the buckets and hydraulics on them aren't really built for heavy loader work. But it would resell much better than an articulated wheel loader. They are cheaper too.
My budget is about $20K. I'm pretty sure I could rent out my machine to recover some cost if I wanted to. Moreso with a ST or TST than the articulated loader or farm tractor.
I found one articulated loader to rent at a pretty good price. I could rent it to do the majority of the dirt excavation. It would be pretty quick. Its pretty easy for even a small wheeled loaded to haul out over a yard per cycle. A skid steer will probably haul out 1/2 to 3/4 yard. That makes loading a 15 yard truck (tandem and pup) pretty slow. And they charge for the entire loading time, though I may be able to negotiate a reduced rate for loading.
The articulated loader is a bit on the big side though, at 18,000 pounds. I'd like something around 10,000 pounds, especially if the soil is soft.
I think a backhoe is out of the question. I ran one when I was younger. They are gutless wonders as loaders, unless they have changed. Big and clumsy too.
I think I need to go with a wheeled or tracked skid steer, put up with the limitations and figure out some way to get small amounts of concrete into the forms.
Thoughts ?
If we don't move the garage, the largest machine we can get between the garage and the trees is 8 feet wide.
Unless we lift the garage quite high, the highest machine we can get is 9 ish feet tall, maybe 10. 7 or 8 feet would be better.
The machine is going to need to turn around within a 40ish foot hole.
I don't see a way to use an excavator if we don't move the garage. We can't back a truck between the garage and the trees and with the garage in the way there is no way to swing and dump into a truck parked in the back alley. Whatever machine I use is going to have to carry the dirt out the hole via the ramp beside the garage. Slow, but it saves having to rebuild the garage, which is costly and time consuming in itself.
I can think of 5 machines that could do this job
- a skid steer loader (wheeled)
- a tracked skid steer loader
- a small articulating wheeled loader
- a front wheel assist farm tractor with a loader
- a backhoe
The problem with the skid steer loaders is that they don't reach very high. Places where this will be a problem.
- reaching over a truck box to fill it
- trimming the top of the wall when we've dug full depth (10 feet)
- reaching to the top of the ICF forms
- etc.
You can get STs that reach pretty high, ie the JD D series will reach 8'+, but most are about 6 feet.
I've known about this limitation all along. What brought it to the forefront for me today is that if we excavate and pour the south wall in sections, we are going to need a bunch of pours to do it. I haven't found a concrete pump to rent yet and the cheapest concrete pump contractor is $400 minimum per site visit. For an 8 foot wall pour, we could use a skid steer to shuttle the concrete from the truck to the form if it would reach, but it won't.
I could probably fabricate something to increase the reach height, but that would be a PIA.
Ideally I'd like to use a small articulated wheel loader. It would be much faster than a ST. The problem is that they aren't that common and I'm afraid that if I bought one I wouldn't be able to resell it when the project is done. Articulated loaders have much better reach and way better ground clearance. However, they are taller and getting under the garage might be a problem.
A 60 HP front wheel assist ag tractor with a loader would work too, but the buckets and hydraulics on them aren't really built for heavy loader work. But it would resell much better than an articulated wheel loader. They are cheaper too.
My budget is about $20K. I'm pretty sure I could rent out my machine to recover some cost if I wanted to. Moreso with a ST or TST than the articulated loader or farm tractor.
I found one articulated loader to rent at a pretty good price. I could rent it to do the majority of the dirt excavation. It would be pretty quick. Its pretty easy for even a small wheeled loaded to haul out over a yard per cycle. A skid steer will probably haul out 1/2 to 3/4 yard. That makes loading a 15 yard truck (tandem and pup) pretty slow. And they charge for the entire loading time, though I may be able to negotiate a reduced rate for loading.
The articulated loader is a bit on the big side though, at 18,000 pounds. I'd like something around 10,000 pounds, especially if the soil is soft.
I think a backhoe is out of the question. I ran one when I was younger. They are gutless wonders as loaders, unless they have changed. Big and clumsy too.
I think I need to go with a wheeled or tracked skid steer, put up with the limitations and figure out some way to get small amounts of concrete into the forms.
Thoughts ?
Strouty
Well-known member
There are plenty of skid steers that meet your criteria and they can load a wheeler. I would look harder. I am not up on model numbers, but I would contact sunbelt rentals and see what they have.
Hiring and renting.
Local operators want $80-$100 an hour for a decent sized ST machine. If excavation takes 60 hours, that is $5,000-$6,000.
Locally a 2,000lb skid steer (JD 320D) rents for $1,000 per week or $3,000 per month. Their definition of a month is 150 hours. A week is 37.5 hours. Use more than that and there is an additional charge.
I wonder if I could get away without having a ST on site after excavation is done. I could rent one again for backfilling... $20 per machine hour seems pretty cheap.
Local operators want $80-$100 an hour for a decent sized ST machine. If excavation takes 60 hours, that is $5,000-$6,000.
Locally a 2,000lb skid steer (JD 320D) rents for $1,000 per week or $3,000 per month. Their definition of a month is 150 hours. A week is 37.5 hours. Use more than that and there is an additional charge.
I wonder if I could get away without having a ST on site after excavation is done. I could rent one again for backfilling... $20 per machine hour seems pretty cheap.
Strouty
Well-known member
How tall is the garage? Most mini excavators can work in some tight spaces. If I was digging a hole that big, I would try and feed a skid steer rather than dig with it. You say you can get 8' worth of machine to the backyard? If that is true, you have tons of options and I may consider starting my digging in the backyard rather than the garage.
The sides on most gravel truck boxes are pretty low because gravel is so dense. Yes, most skid steer can load a truck, provided the ST is a the same elevation.
One can also build a little ramp for the ST to climb to get higher than the truck. The truck operator then needs to move his truck as its being filled. Drivers sometimes complain about having to do this. Also, the reach in isn't great so the load tends to be a little lop sided.
ez-duzit
Well-known member
This is what I had, Case 530 CK Construction King. Plenty capable of doing that job, with a capable operator.
Strouty
Well-known member
EZ, that would work fine for open spaces, but I can't imagine using it in a confined area.
ez-duzit
Well-known member
toplessHO
Well-known member
have you thought about using corrugated steel panels for temporary soil retention at the property line?
I used my JD backhoe/loader to dig my basement and the 8 car garage I added to side of house thats same level as basement floor. But I didnt have any headroom problems like you.
I would not suggest using a backhoe for this,its just too awkward in turning,backing etc.
consider making a dirt ramp to load trucks,then you could get by with a smaller machine.
What make the most sense is a small articulating loader,maybe in the 1-1.5 yd range.
Landscape companies love these so it may be an easy resale.
I used my JD backhoe/loader to dig my basement and the 8 car garage I added to side of house thats same level as basement floor. But I didnt have any headroom problems like you.
I would not suggest using a backhoe for this,its just too awkward in turning,backing etc.
consider making a dirt ramp to load trucks,then you could get by with a smaller machine.
What make the most sense is a small articulating loader,maybe in the 1-1.5 yd range.
Landscape companies love these so it may be an easy resale.
DeadSock
Well-known member
I would suggest a mini-excavator and a dump trailer.
Weld a mount on the back of the bucket of the ex for a ball to maneuver the trailer.
Weld a mount on the back of the bucket of the ex for a ball to maneuver the trailer.
So I think I found the perfect machine for this job. A Bobcat A300.
www.bobcat.com/publicadmin/getFile.do?id=20423
The A series Bobcats have articulated steering, so they turn much better than a traditional skid steer. 82HP turbocharged engine. A lift of 10' 6" to the pin. It lifts 3000 pounds, so I can carry a yard of material out on each trip. It easily loads trucks, even with high sided boxes.
It turns out my friend has an A300 in his equipment fleet. He is looking to upgrade to an A770. His machine is pretty high hours, but its in excellent condition. He wants a little over $20,000 for it. It comes with a toothed high capacity bucket. Its a really nice machine, perfect for this job.
He also has a JD 323E. The A300 is much, much faster. The 323 would be better in mud, but in dry going the A300 is a beast.
His A770 isn't going to be available until later in the summer. I think I'm going to put a deposit on the A300 and take delivery of it later this year.
I was really worried about the excavation component of this job, but now that I played around with his A300, I'm thinking this project is totally doable.
In committing to the A300, we are essentially committing to excavate when its dry. If it rains we are going to have to dig a little sump, pump it out and wait for things to dry up before continuing. I could purchase a track machine so that we could continue excavating in wet conditions, but at the cost of much lower productivity. I've watched several basements get dug in my neighborhood the last 2 years. All of them have been dry.
FYI, my friend isn't totally impressed with his 323. He says it actually isn't that great in the mud because the ground clearance is poor and the tracks aren't wide enough.
www.bobcat.com/publicadmin/getFile.do?id=20423
The A series Bobcats have articulated steering, so they turn much better than a traditional skid steer. 82HP turbocharged engine. A lift of 10' 6" to the pin. It lifts 3000 pounds, so I can carry a yard of material out on each trip. It easily loads trucks, even with high sided boxes.
It turns out my friend has an A300 in his equipment fleet. He is looking to upgrade to an A770. His machine is pretty high hours, but its in excellent condition. He wants a little over $20,000 for it. It comes with a toothed high capacity bucket. Its a really nice machine, perfect for this job.
He also has a JD 323E. The A300 is much, much faster. The 323 would be better in mud, but in dry going the A300 is a beast.
His A770 isn't going to be available until later in the summer. I think I'm going to put a deposit on the A300 and take delivery of it later this year.
I was really worried about the excavation component of this job, but now that I played around with his A300, I'm thinking this project is totally doable.
In committing to the A300, we are essentially committing to excavate when its dry. If it rains we are going to have to dig a little sump, pump it out and wait for things to dry up before continuing. I could purchase a track machine so that we could continue excavating in wet conditions, but at the cost of much lower productivity. I've watched several basements get dug in my neighborhood the last 2 years. All of them have been dry.
FYI, my friend isn't totally impressed with his 323. He says it actually isn't that great in the mud because the ground clearance is poor and the tracks aren't wide enough.
Last edited:
bczygan
Well-known member
I just skimmed the last page, but the OP has done a great job of analyzing this.
Looking forward to photos of the project as it gets started.
Bill
Looking forward to photos of the project as it gets started.
Bill
So now that it seems this project is closer to something that is actually going to happen, I'm starting to think about the space more and more.
First off, it seems a shame that I'm not planning for a way to get a car down in the basement. I have 2 young sons. What if they want to do a project car someday ? The basement would be perfect. Why should we tie up the garage main floor with a car carcass for a couple years when the space is available in the basement ?
And if we are going to use the basement as shop space for vehicle projects, I should probably go with 10 foot ceilings rather than 9 foot. Once we are doing the excavation and pouring concrete, an extra foot isn't going to make a lot of difference in the cost, but it sure is nice to have a tall ceiling when working with engine hoists, lifting car bodies, etc.
First off, it seems a shame that I'm not planning for a way to get a car down in the basement. I have 2 young sons. What if they want to do a project car someday ? The basement would be perfect. Why should we tie up the garage main floor with a car carcass for a couple years when the space is available in the basement ?
And if we are going to use the basement as shop space for vehicle projects, I should probably go with 10 foot ceilings rather than 9 foot. Once we are doing the excavation and pouring concrete, an extra foot isn't going to make a lot of difference in the cost, but it sure is nice to have a tall ceiling when working with engine hoists, lifting car bodies, etc.
Thanks ! I'm doing my best. It helps that the project has an enforced start date and I get to spend a lot of time preparing.
Last edited: