Quad box ground

[bluedog225]

What do y’all prefer for grounding a metal quad box? A single long, ground half flipped around each plug ground and then to the box? Or a pigtail with leads coming off to the plugs and box? Wire nut or just twist them?

Whichever one I use seems a little hacked together. Thought I’d check with the experts.

Thanks

 

[Snapped-off]

Pigtail off the incoming ground feed to the box, with more pigtails to any receptacles.

Use your imagination.

Sketch not to scale.

 

[Bert_]

Metal box? Self grounding receptacles and no pigtails.

 

[JohnX14]

I'd wrap the ground screw and assuming there are multiple cables in it I'd then splice all the bares or greens (stripped) using a Splice Cap (crimp sleeve) and leave a conductor beyond the splice cap for each receptacle. Granted grounding receptacles are legal, but I'd put the pigtail as well. If it is a single grounding conductor, and if it is solid, I'd wrap the ground screw then hit each receptacle all with one conductor. If it is stranded conductors, I'd do it exactly like post #2.

 

[Snapped-off]

I'd wrap the ground screw and assuming there are multiple cables in it I'd then splice all the bares or greens (stripped) using a Splice Cap (crimp sleeve) and leave a conductor beyond the splice cap for each receptacle. Granted grounding receptacles are legal, but I'd put the pigtail as well. If it is a single grounding conductor, and if it is solid, I'd wrap the ground screw then hit each receptacle all with one conductor. If it is stranded conductors, I'd do it exactly like post #2.

I've got a bunch of EC motors where they wrapped the stranded ground on install and it just destroys the wire.

Most of them I find when replacing a motor, the ground wire is broken into two pieces.

 

[bluedog225]

I didn’t know about self grounding stuff. I guess another alternative is spade terminals for the stranded.

Thanks all.

 

[Bert_]

I didn’t know about self grounding stuff. I guess another alternative is spade terminals for the stranded.

Thanks all.

Self grounding means the outlet can ground through the mounting screws to the box.

 

[sparky 1971]

If I'm using a metal box, then I'm probably using EMT and not pulling a ground at all. If for some reason a ground wire is present because I've used Romex, MC cable, PVC, or someone else did it, I will bond it to the box and I'm done. No grounds are getting connected to the receptacle.

 

[sparky 1971]

I didn’t know about self grounding stuff. I guess another alternative is spade terminals for the stranded.

Thanks all.

If you're using stranded, strip the wire but leave the stripped insulation on the end of the wire. It will keep everything together so the strands don't fray apart.

 

[Shiftless]

If you're using stranded, strip the wire but leave the stripped insulation on the end of the wire. It will keep everything together so the strands don't fray apart.

Great tip from a real pro.

 

[bluedog225]

If you're using stranded, strip the wire but leave the stripped insulation on the end of the wire. It will keep everything together so the strands don't fray apart.

You guys have better strippers than me.

 

[JohnX14]

I've got a bunch of EC motors where they wrapped the stranded ground on install and it just destroys the wire.

Most of them I find when replacing a motor, the ground wire is broken into two pieces.

I was referencing solid conductor around the screw, not stranded.

 

[JohnX14]

If you're using stranded, strip the wire but leave the stripped insulation on the end of the wire. It will keep everything together so the strands don't fray apart.

Another trick, whether leaving the insulation on the end or not, is to 'twist' the group of strands counterclockwise. The screw tends to tighten the twist rather than separating them. Although I'll generally use a solderless terminal, unless I'm in a hurry or a bind. I generally don't wrap stranded conductors.

 

[Snapped-off]

I was referencing solid conductor around the screw, not stranded.

I understand. I was just venting frustration as I swapped out 3 motors last week. 2 had broken grounds.

 

[onewheat]

 

[racecougar]

^^^Belt, suspenders, and double pocket protectors.

 

[mike93lx]

^^^Belt, suspenders, and double pocket protectors.

Need to know the torque value used for the ground screw and emt connector... And only 1 screw holding the box in???

 

[PCustoms]

Need to know the torque value used for the ground screw and emt connector... And only. 1 screw holding the box in???

There's 2 screws, but what are those wire nuts rated for?

 

[mike93lx]

There's 2 screws, but what are those wire nuts rated for?

I only see one screw from the box to the wall, and then the emt connector. Hardly strong enough to handle a vehicle impact

Ideal tan are good for up to three 10's

 

[PCustoms]

I only see one screw from the box to the wall, and then the emt connector. Hardly strong enough to handle a vehicle impact

Ideal tan are good for up to three 10's

But reds are faster

 

[mike93lx]

But reds are faster

Ah, missed that

 

[sparky 1971]

Why are there two hots and two neutrals from the same circuit in the conduit?

 

[PCustoms]

Why are there two hots and two neutrals from the same circuit in the conduit?

To go to the next box?

What am I missing? (Pretty sure I know )

 

[sparky 1971]

To go to the next box?

What am I missing? (Pretty sure I know )

There has to be a junction box before the box in the photo. Make the splices in that box with one set going to the devices. There's nothing wrong with the way it's done in the photo other than using a bunch of extra wire, I've just never seen it done that way. Might as well have a conduit in and another out of the box shown and eliminate the box not in the photo. It does save a couple of wire nuts though, and those tan twisters are getting pricey. I just bought a jar of 400 for $60.

 

[PCustoms]

There has to be a junction box before the box in the photo. Make the splices in that box with one set going to the devices. There's nothing wrong with the way it's done in the photo other than using a bunch of extra wire, I've just never seen it done that way. Might as well have a conduit in and another out of the box shown and eliminate the box not in the photo. It does save a couple of wire nuts though, and those tan twisters are getting pricey. I just bought a jar of 400 for $60.

Kind of begs the question, what's at the top of that vertical conduit? Doesn't it...

 

[Mainiac Mat]

Pigtails....
This little piggy went to the ground screw on the box
These little piggy went tot he ground termimal on the outlets
And the last little piggy cried wee-wee-wee all the way back to the load center.

 

[mike93lx]

There has to be a junction box before the box in the photo. Make the splices in that box with one set going to the devices. There's nothing wrong with the way it's done in the photo other than using a bunch of extra wire, I've just never seen it done that way. Might as well have a conduit in and another out of the box shown and eliminate the box not in the photo. It does save a couple of wire nuts though, and those tan twisters are getting pricey. I just bought a jar of 400 for $60.

Since speculating is fun, my vote is that there is one of these just above the picture

 

[sparky 1971]

I have never seen one of those in my life. I guess the possibilities are endless.

 

[u2slow]

I take the longest incoming bare bond wire and wrap it on the box screw, and then into a wire nut with all the rest.

Sometimes I daisy-chain one tail across two receptacles before going to the wire nut.

 

[mike93lx]

I have never seen one of those in my life. I guess the possibilities endless.

It came up searching for "emt wye" in the hopes of posting some silly plumbing fitting.

https://www.gordonelectricsupply.com/p/Bridgeport-4256-Dc-1-2-3-4-D-C-Cplg/5818558?utm_source=google&utm_medium=shopping&utm_campaign=catch-all&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=21890440937&gbraid=0AAAAAD8Z3WHNqxsq_6d5b8jP27gCcDVkW&gclid=Cj0KCQjw8cHABhC-ARIsAJnY12wkmKDHlXV3FPGjEjINZACKJZnqLYqKH6b5nm5CCgoEtMaIVXaJFokaApetEALw_wcB

 

[PCustoms]

Since speculating is fun, my vote is that there is one of these just above the picture

I have never seen one of those in my life. I guess the possibilities endless.

I was going to say the same, but I figured some pro would hoping and say "seriously, how do you not know about these!"

 

[JohnX14]

Tough crowd here...

 

[sparky 1971]

I was going to say the same, but I figured some pro would hoping and say "seriously, how do you not know about these!"

Those look to me like they are made for someone that likes to work harder than they have to. Stripping off a mile of jacket, then trying to shove two sets of that twisted **** they call MC down a piece of EMT doesn't seem like a fun way to waste time.

 

[u2slow]

Those look to me like they are made for someone that likes to work harder than they have to. Stripping off a mile of jacket, then trying to shove two sets of that twisted **** they call MC down a piece of EMT doesn't seem like a fun way to waste time.

That's a common transition for concrete suspended slabs. You have a ceiling box cast into the concrete, and there's an EMT stub-down for it at the nearest planned stud wall.

 

[onewheat]

Why are there two hots and two neutrals from the same circuit in the conduit?

To go to the next box

To go to the next box?

What am I missing? (Pretty sure I know )

Correct - and I'm not sure?

There has to be a junction box before the box in the photo. Make the splices in that box with one set going to the devices. There's nothing wrong with the way it's done in the photo other than using a bunch of extra wire, I've just never seen it done that way. Might as well have a conduit in and another out of the box shown and eliminate the box not in the photo. It does save a couple of wire nuts though, and those tan twisters are getting pricey. I just bought a jar of 400 for $60.

There is a 60' run, 8' off the ground with a junction box every 10' and a 4' drop to double gang outlets - the boxes alternate what circuit they're on. The splice could have been in the 8' junction box saving 4' or wire at every drop, I guess. Is that what you're saying? That's the way it was run.

Kind of begs the question, what's at the top of that vertical conduit? Doesn't it...

A junction box



The right side wall - you can see the conduit and a few of the drops. It's the way the electrician pulled the wire.

 

[mike93lx]

To go to the next box

Its the same conduit... The source and destination have to be the same place unless you have a splitter on the conduit.

Edit, I see the t now

 

[dscheidt]

I didn’t know about self grounding stuff. I guess another alternative is spade terminals for the stranded.

Thanks all.

Self grounding means that one of the mounting ears has a brass contact spring for the mounting screw. That assures that device is making good contact with the screw. The screw is, one hopes, screwed into a metal box that's grounded. They're nearly universally in metal conduit installations, because it saves much time terminating devices, and saves the wire, and the boxes are neater. To meet code requirements on exposed work boxes, you need to use an exposed work cover with recessed corner screws, and use real serrated nuts on the device mounting screws, not the stupid break-off tabs built in to new covers. Also, the plastic or cardboard insulator retaining thing on the screw has to be removed.

 

[sparky 1971]

To go to the next box

Correct - and I'm not sure?

There is a 60' run, 8' off the ground with a junction box every 10' and a 4' drop to double gang outlets - the boxes alternate what circuit they're on. The splice could have been in the 8' junction box saving 4' or wire at every drop, I guess. Is that what you're saying? That's the way it was run.


A junction box



The right side wall - you can see the conduit and a few of the drops. It's the way the electrician pulled the wire.

Just for fun, could you post more pictures? The top and bottom box while still showing a bit of the conduit as well as both in the same photo but closer than in this picture. I'm curious about what in the world is going on. It appears that the conduit comes straight down from the top box and is supported by a minnie clamp, but has a backwards box offset to get into the bottom box. I want to tell myself that can't be and there is something out there I'm not familiar with. Or, my eyes are playing tricks on me...again.

 

[mm08822]

I see it too, now that you mentioned it.

Depending on the rib spacing and depth, it could require a little planning to minimize offsets. Even a painted 4x4 spacer under the upper boxes to eliminate offsets into them would be helpful. Single 1 hole straps on the horizontals would be simple.

I would not want to be adding cowboy straps on the verticals, just use a 1 hole strap.

 

[sparky 1971]

I see it too, now that you mentioned it.

Depending on the rib spacing and depth, it could require a little planning to minimize offsets. Even a painted 4x4 spacer under the upper boxes to eliminate offsets into them would be helpful. Single 1 hole straps on the horizontals would be simple.

I would not want to be adding cowboy straps on the verticals, just use a 1 hole strap.

That might be it, but if it's in a minnie on the way down, it should line up perfectly with an existing ko.

Not many people know about them, but Raco has made a box for this application. Part number 232CS. CS stands for corrugated steel and on two sides opposite each other, the ko's are punched a little farther out, allowing the conduit to lay on top of the ribs with no offsets or spacers needed. The other two sides are the standard location. Run the pipe horizontal across the ribs using one hole's, set a box and go straight down (or up) to another box. I've started using Caddy 812M's for straps on the verticals. The little bastards are expensive, but there's no screwing around with the bolt when it comes to minnies or box offsets.

4 in. Square Box, Welded with Elevated Conduit KO's, 2-1/8 in. Deep, 600V, Elevated Side Knockouts, Raised Ground | 232CS | Raco

4 in. Square Box, Welded with Elevated Conduit KO's, 2-1/8 in. Deep, 600V, Elevated Side Knockouts, Raised Ground

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