Question about hurricane ties

[Locker537]

Is it OK to drives nails through a plywood truss gusset in order to attach hurricane ties?

This is the style tie I am using.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Simpson-...C-_-NavPLPHorizontal1_rr-_-NA-_-100275721-_-N

I don't want to compromise the integrity of the glued and screwed gusset. The alternative would be to not install any hurricane ties on the side of the trusses with gussets.

 

[larry4406]

One hurricane clip per truss end is the normal method. They are reversible so you can mount on either side.

 

[Jeepster04]

Ive seen people mount them on both sides of the truss but the norm seems to be mounting them on 1 side only. Not sure you would gain much having one on each side of the truss as opposed to just having them on one side. If youre that close to winds damaging the building then youre probably going to have other things to worry about. Im putting them on 1 side only.

Personally I would not put nails through the gussets. Wish my truss had the plywood gusset as opposed to the thin steel plates...

 

[matt_i]

I think due to the added thickness, and the structural importance of getting into the 2x material and not just the gusset, I'd find the size of nail that fits...its probably a #10 and hand drive normal framing nails instead of the "shorties" that Simpson can supply to go with it. Even if too long, bend the sharp point over on the other side with a hammer in a "clench".

 

[Jeepster04]

Just bought hurricane clips and the 'joist nails' a few days ago for my build. Lowes only had 1.5" and 3" joist nails, but that doesnt mean that other stores wouldnt have 1.75" or 2" nails. Bending the nails over would insure they wont be pulling out though!

I wouldnt want to drive that many nails through the plywood for fear of creating a weak plane in the gusset. Could also split the plywood....

 

[tarmy]

You need to use the correct fasteners...nails. The Simpson nails are special in more than one way...they are specifically designed for the shear forces, which regular nails are not. Also, they are coated to resist decay so that they don't fail when needed...in other words they won't rust or be compromised by time and weather.

The idea is for those fastening systems to flex but not fail...movement, to a designed degree, is your friend. Using the incorrect nails may not result in the intended flex not fail outcome that is part of the engineering.

 

[matt_i]

You need to use the correct fasteners...nails. The Simpson nails are special in more than one way...they are specifically designed for the shear forces, which regular nails are not. Also, they are coated to resist decay so that they don't fail when needed...in other words they won't rust or be compromised by time and weather.

The idea is for those fastening systems to flex but not fail...movement, to a designed degree, is your friend. Using the incorrect nails may not result in the intended flex not fail outcome that is part of the engineering.

I agree on the detailing Simpson provides in their nails, but I think you'll get 95% of what's intended with standard coated framing nails of equivalent diameter/gauge. In my opinion, the major factor in play is the shear area of the nails (iow proper diameter to just barely clearance-fit the hole) and not some uber-strength alloy. After all the hanger itself is nothing exotic, just galvanized low carbon 1018 cold rolled steel. If worried about corrosion proection there are Maze and other hot-dipped galvanized (a step greater in corrosion protection than electrogalvanized in my book) #10s that are very acceptable in my opinion and easy to buy in a single box.

Just to add more info, Simpson somehow "cold heads" the gauge of the nail when forming the head. If you look they will have an 8 or 10 that becomes more visible, on the active face of the nailhead, after hammering it, basically so an inspector armed with a magnifying glass has no doubt that the correct gauge has been used. While I would be pretty surprised if a framing inspector actually resorted to that on a fairly standard residential garage or shop project, at least you can see down the track of what Simpson is trying to promote or identify, and fall in line with similar diameter materials and corrosion protection. Its just not 3 feet away in the same aisle

 

[tarmy]

I agree on the detailing Simpson provides in their nails, but I think you'll get 95% of what's intended with standard coated framing nails of equivalent diameter/gauge. In my opinion, the major factor in play is the shear area of the nails (iow proper diameter to just barely clearance-fit the hole) and not some uber-strength alloy. After all the hanger itself is nothing exotic, just galvanized low carbon 1018 cold rolled steel. If worried about corrosion proection there are Maze and other hot-dipped galvanized (a step greater in corrosion protection than electrogalvanized in my book) #10s that are very acceptable in my opinion and easy to buy in a single box.

Just to add more info, Simpson somehow "cold heads" the gauge of the nail when forming the head. If you look they will have an 8 or 10 that becomes more visible, on the active face of the nailhead, after hammering it, basically so an inspector armed with a magnifying glass has no doubt that the correct gauge has been used. While I would be pretty surprised if a framing inspector actually resorted to that on a fairly standard residential garage or shop project, at least you can see down the track of what Simpson is trying to promote or identify, and fall in line with similar diameter materials and corrosion protection. Its just not 3 feet away in the same aisle

I agree with your thoughts too.

If it were me...the labor and effort of installation are the hard part.....so the cost is not an issue if I lived in or owned the structure. I just want it to be safe and in one piece...maybe beat to hell...but standing. The diameter of the nail is also an issue as you pointed out...as well as the head staying on and not failing.

I live in earthquake country...and people really don't appreciate the forces of either hurricanes or earthquakes on large structures. Here, buildings are thrown UP and side to side...hurricanes can either **** the structure up...or exert side, lateral force similar to the earth shaking...which is why many of the same simpson ties are used in both areas of the country...

Advice to OP...do it right the first time, use the correct fasteners installed per spec...then no worries...

 

[Locker537]

I agree with your thoughts too.

If it were me...the labor and effort of installation are the hard part.....so the cost is not an issue if I lived in or owned the structure. I just want it to be safe and in one piece...maybe beat to hell...but standing. The diameter of the nail is also an issue as you pointed out...as well as the head staying on and not failing.

I live in earthquake country...and people really don't appreciate the forces of either hurricanes or earthquakes on large structures. Here, buildings are thrown UP and side to side...hurricanes can either **** the structure up...or exert side, lateral force similar to the earth shaking...which is why many of the same simpson ties are used in both areas of the country...

Advice to OP...do it right the first time, use the correct fasteners installed per spec...then no worries...

I'm using the correct Simpson fasteners. I was originally intending to install a tie on opposing "corners" of the truss as I recall that is what I read in the spec. This means one tie would need to go through the plywood gusset. I was concerned about only that aspect.

Alternatively, I can install both ties on the same (non-gusset) side of the truss, or simply install one tie per truss.

 

[larry4406]

Alternatively, I can install both ties on the same (non-gusset) side of the truss, or simply install one tie per truss.

Each truss end gets one clip/tie. Side not relavent. 2 clips per truss unless special detail says otherwise.

 

[theoldwizard1]

There are different style of hurricane ties, but the one referenced is very popular, probably because it is low cost.

If you live in an area where hurricane ties are required by code, you should know that you can NOT use standard nails/screws. You have to use fasteners that approved for this specific job. Some inspectors might not pass your installation.

For amateur, the Simpson Strong Tie screws are great if you have an impact.

This one appears to be a bit stronger Simpson Strong Tie H1

 

[Locker537]

Each truss end gets one clip/tie. Side not relavent. 2 clips per truss unless special detail says otherwise.

Yea, I figured I could install them on the non-gusset side of the truss. That's likely what I will do.

 

[Locker537]

There are different style of hurricane ties, but the one referenced is very popular, probably because it is low cost.

If you live in an area where hurricane ties are required by code, you should know that you can NOT use standard nails/screws. You have to use fasteners that approved for this specific job. Some inspectors might not pass your installation.

For amateur, the Simpson Strong Tie screws are great if you have an impact.

This one appears to be a bit stronger Simpson Strong Tie H1

That type of tie won't work with a truss that has 1/2" thickness gussets. Yes, they are stronger than the style I linked in the original post.

Others in this thread have mentioned different fasteners, not me. I choose 8d Simpson nails because of cost and higher sheer strength compared to the Simpson screws.