Question for the GJ Electricians, 3 Phase Major Issue

[4 FN 27]

I have 3 phase power coming into my shop. This morning I went in to pull my Plow out and the Garage Door would only open about 2 inches. So I tried another door. Same thing. So I flipped on the lights in the Machine Shop and the were flickering like a strobe light.

I figured I was single phased so I got out the Volt Meter and probed a 480 disconnect and came up with some weird numbers leg to leg and legs to ground.

I then went and checked a couple of 110 Outlets. Most were at 123-125 volts but I had a couple at 138.

I shut down my Geothermal Pumps (they were not running at the time) and figured later in the day Excel Energy would have the power back up and I would be good to go. I left for work figuring I would fire up the Geo System when I got home.

Got home and still had the flickering light issue. So I called my electrician who live a few minutes away and he came over.

Here is what he probed at the incoming 480 with the main breaker shut off.

A to B = 495V
A to C = 497V
B to C = 608V

A to Ground = 284V
B to Ground = 286V
C to Ground = 386V

We left the main disconnected and I called excel to report the issue. They have not shown up yet and that was 3 1/2 hours ago. I just called and they had the issue listed as low priority "over voltage" and with the storms in MN there are lot of people without power. I had them change it to an outage...thus another 3 hours at best.

So a half an hour ago I re-probed the main panel with the Main breaker off and came up with these numbers:

A to B = 493V
A to C = 268V
B to C = 271V

A to Ground = 285V
B to Ground = 287V
C to Ground = 30V

My question: Can anyone tell me what may have happened???

I drove down the street and looked at the Transformers on the Pole and 1 is brown on the bottom.

While my electrician was here we noticed the Transformer in front of the building was making a weird fast ticking noise.

Just after I probed the main the second time the transformer was just humming.

Hoping I did not loose any of my HVAC equipment because of the high voltage prior to me shutting them down.

I am all ears...

 

[4 FN 27]

Forgot the picture of the Main Panel if that helps. I probed right where the Wire enter the Breaker.

 

[Stuart in MN]

I drove down the street and looked at the Transformers on the Pole and 1 is brown on the bottom.

While my electrician was here we noticed the Transformer in front of the building was making a weird fast ticking noise.

Definitely sounds like the issue is something on Xcel's side. There were a lot of overhead lines slapping against each other in the wind last night (I heard some arcing going on in my neighborhood, thankfully it was far enough away that it didn't affect me) so that's my guess - some wires got shorted together and damaged the transformer.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Sounds like a damaged transformer.

With those readings there really is nothing you can do.

Do you have a neutral in your service(480Y/277) or no neutral (480v Delta)?

 

[4 FN 27]

So like a damage transformer.

With those readings there really nothing you can do.

Do you have a neutral in your service(480Y/277) or no neutral (480v Delta)?

My Electrician says 480Y/277.

 

[LXCam]

Well you’re definitely single phasing Pat. Either you popped a primary fuse or the transformer has an open coil. I’m not doubting the extra high reading but I’d suggest putting some fresh batteries in the meter before staking claim on that. Or double check it with an old analog meter. DVM’s will give erroneous readings with worn out batteries. Hopefully nothing got hurt. But I’d suggest adding a phase loss/phase reversal relay to the controls on anything that’s critical and runs if you’re not around.

 

[TRWham]

Well you’re definitely single phasing Pat. Either you popped a primary fuse or the transformer has an open coil. I’m not doubting the extra high reading but I’d suggest putting some fresh batteries in the meter before staking claim on that. Or double check it with an old analog meter. DVM’s will give erroneous readings with worn out batteries. Hopefully nothing got hurt. But I’d suggest adding a phase loss/phase reversal relay to the controls on anything that’s critical and runs if you’re not around.

Could also be shorted turns caused by failed insulation. If you lose some turns on the primary, then your ratio drops and you can have high voltage on the secondary.

 

[4 FN 27]

Well you’re definitely single phasing Pat. Either you popped a primary fuse or the transformer has an open coil. I’m not doubting the extra high reading but I’d suggest putting some fresh batteries in the meter before staking claim on that. Or double check it with an old analog meter. DVM’s will give erroneous readings with worn out batteries. Hopefully nothing got hurt. But I’d suggest adding a phase loss/phase reversal relay to the controls on anything that’s critical and runs if you’re not around.

Thanks Cam...checked with 3 Fluke Meters, 2 of mine and my electricians.

I checked the Pole Breakers and they are all closed both in front of the house and on the Pole a 1/2 mile down the road. None of my neighbors are out wither.

So yes I am single phased...26.8 volts on the C leg to ground this morning.

Excel was here some time during the night. Saw the tire tracks from their truck in the snow at the end of the driveway. They were supposed to call me when they arrived. No foot prints around the Transformer in front of the building and none by the Pole in the yard.

Called again and they have it noted as a Transformer problem. Now if they could only tell me what the plan is I can go back to my daily grind. So here I sit working form home which I hate because logmein.com is so slow and everything I need is on my desk...hard to service the customers at the level I expect from here...

Excel *****...the guys and gals climbing the poles and digging holes are great and do an awesome job but the machine that schedules or runs the business is broken...and I mean broken.

 

[Stuart in MN]

I deal with Xcel on a daily basis (I have a meeting with them today on a project) so I understand your frustration, but in their defense I imagine they're pretty busy right now with storm damage.

 

[4 FN 27]

I deal with Xcel on a daily basis (I have a meeting with them today on a project) so I understand your frustration, but in their defense I imagine they're pretty busy right now with storm damage.

Stuart...even when they are not busy they move slow. When I built my building we got on the list for "hooking up" on August 13, 2014. They arrived February 11, 2015. $4800 in frost charges and broke 3 trenchers cutting 48 inches + of frost to put in the power and gas.

Not to mention the Gas and Electric Crews that use to work together are separate...getting them to run both in the same trench was a never ending frustration getting them to talk to each other.

When you are at Excel...put in a good word for me...please...

 

[ddawg16]

What is most important.....leave your disconnect off until the problem is resolved.

 

[4 FN 27]

Turns out is was a blown fuse on the line 5 poles south. However I was standing in the shop when they replaced the fuse and the one on the pole in front of the house exploded. I quick jumped in my truck and up to the end of the driveway figuring I was going to find the guy on the ground since his truck was sitting there.

Little did I know he back off the driveway into the ditch and buried the truck and another lineman came. They both were down at the other pole.

They drove up the street and replaced the fuse on my pole.

I was back in business until I went to fire up the Geo System. Lost a Compressor. It's cooked...good thing there is a back-up...

Now the fun begins, having the electrician price out Single Phase protection and a Generator to run the place during outages or single phasing. Did that on the house and now I am regretting not doing it on the shop when I built it. Live and learn.

Whoops...

 

[wyliesdiesels]

File a claim with the power company.

 

[4 FN 27]

File a claim with the power company.

All fixed. Had the HVAC Tech come out. He found a broken Wire on the Geo Pump after ohming out the Compressor. That Compressor may have been down for a while. I'll have to start doing daily checks in the future.

A service call sure beats a $2000 parts and labor bill.

My Electrician found a Single Phase Cutout Switch which will be installed in the near future.

Still going to have him quote a Generator to run the Geo-Pumps and the Lighting.

 

[Aceman]

If you have an electronic meter, they typically have an A, B, and C indicating the phases lit up on the right side of the meter when they have power. When you lose a phase, it won't show whichever phase is lost on the meter.

It's a lot faster than pulling panel covers and getting out a multimeter.