question regarding a new main panel that was installed.

[paranoid56]

So tell me what you think. I am having solar installed and they promised a 125amp panel (i originally wanted a 200 amp setup but the cost to run all new wire from down the street was just to much money)and they said that the wire coming into the house was enough to handle the 125amp load.

so on Wednesday their electrician came out to replace the old 100amp zinsco style with my so called 125 system. i came home to find this installed. now correct me if i am wrong, but isn't this just a normal 100 amp panel? along with poorly written labeling and miss matched brands of breakers. it has 12 spots for breakers and as it sits they are all filled now

i sent a email to my contractor telling him it looked like a 100 amp setup was installed and this was his response.

the panel is a 125amp rated buss with a 100amp main. This gives us the ability to have the 30amp beaker required for you PV system. The combination of yhe main & solar beaker cannot exceed 125% of the panel rating. Bottom line, it is a 125amp panel. Hope this clarifies for you.

so whos right here?
thanks for your time.

 

[Steevo]

I particularly like the label of "new room".
What if you build another? Do you call that "newer room"?

 

[paranoid56]

well he never went in the house so those were written on the old panel.

 

[Engineer61]

Did you have a permit and inspection for this? A new panel should have two free spaces for breakers (to allow future expansion) in order to meet code.

 

[paranoid56]

as far as i know. they said they pulled the permits and what not. i know sdge was out and turned the power back on and put a new tag thiny on it (on the head)

 

[Norcal]

The job fails 408.4. This is a copy & paste from the 2011 NEC:

408.4 Field Identification Required.
(A) Circuit Directory or Circuit Identification. Every circuit
and circuit modification shall be legibly identified as to
its clear, evident, and specific purpose or use. The identification
shall include sufficient detail to allow each circuit to
be distinguished from all others. Spare positions that contain
unused overcurrent devices or switches shall be described
accordingly. The identification shall be included in
a circuit directory that is located on the face or inside of the
panel door in the case of a panelboard, and located at each
switch or circuit breaker in a switchboard. No circuit shall
be described in a manner that depends on transient conditions
of occupancy.

Bold by me. CA is on the 2008 NEC, but there were no changes from 2008 to 2011.

 

[Norcal]

Did you have a permit and inspection for this? A new panel should have two free spaces for breakers (to allow future expansion) in order to meet code.

Got a code section to cite?

 

[paranoid56]

lol figures, so one of the fails is because its not labeled properly? i thought i read that it needs to be labeled and not just written with a sharpy.

should i ask for a copy of the permit? they are supposed to be installing the solar panels on Monday.

 

[sickjuice]

Looks like a butcher job. The cheapest guy is usually the cheapest for a reason

 

[paranoid56]

yea i didnt get ti pick him sadly. its all though the solar company i was bummed that i didnt get to keep my old panel as i had at least 200 bucks in damn new breakers in that thing

 

[Norcal]

yea i didnt get ti pick him sadly. its all though the solar company i was bummed that i didnt get to keep my old panel as i had at least 200 bucks in damn new breakers in that thing

You got the new Zinsco for a replacement, A C-H BR*panel, tell em you want your breakers back.


* BR line marketing : "Engineered Value" = cheap.

 

[Speedy Petey]

You got the new Zinsco for a replacement, A C-H BR*panel, tell em you want your breakers back.


* BR line marketing : "Engineered Value" = cheap.

This is a bunch of BS. Equating C-H BR series to Zinsco is near slander. BR series breakers middle of the road, they are FINE and have a long track record of reliability.

 

[Speedy Petey]

lol figures, so one of the fails is because its not labeled properly? i thought i read that it needs to be labeled and not just written with a sharpy.

Um, NO, there is no rule that it must be actual labels.
That is pretty sloppy (due to the poor handwriting), and I would have used a label maker, but it is perfectly within code. Some inspectors would make the guy go all through the house to identify the old circuits. MOST would not. The requirement for detailed information is a JOKE. The labels and stickers they give in panels allows for a few words, so just how detailed are you supposed to get??

The panel was a replacement, and YOU chose to save money by not upgrading, so the spare space requirement does NOT apply.

 

[pattenp]

paranoid, for your own satisfaction did you look at the spec label inside the panel to verify the panel is rated at 125A?

 

[Dick in Wisconsin]

should i ask for a copy of the permit?

Are you paying the bill?

You're paying the bill. You're entitled to the permit and you're entitled to information about what you did.

Regarding the panel and breaker they apparently took away ... what does your contract say? Is that "theirs"? Is it silent?

We'll be interested to see how the solar works out for you.

 

[jhelrey]

Just use hand sanitizer and get rid of the sharpie mess and relabel it yourself

 

[Jefe]

should i ask for a copy of the permit? they are supposed to be installing the solar panels on Monday.

Permits are public record. Go to your city's website and poke around for the permit section and look up your property.
Also, there's probably language on the permit requiring it to be posted on the job-site.

 

[Tim The Tool Man]

Also, there's probably language on the permit requiring it to be posted on the job-site.

This is what I was going to say. Check your front window... Also demand your old hardware back.. You would be surprised how hot a commodity old zinsco breakers are on ebay and craigslist.

 

[Norcal]

This is a bunch of BS. Equating C-H BR series to Zinsco is near slander. BR series breakers middle of the road, they are FINE and have a long track record of reliability.

But they are still cheap. They are not going to burn your house down, but still in the Yugo category.
Edit
You are aware that some 150-200A BR panels used a Zinsco main for years? That is one improvement that was done after re-branding as C-H was to dump the Zinsco design main breakers.

 

[paranoid56]

Are you paying the bill?

You're paying the bill. You're entitled to the permit and you're entitled to information about what you did.

Regarding the panel and breaker they apparently took away ... what does your contract say? Is that "theirs"? Is it silent?

We'll be interested to see how the solar works out for you.

Well acutally i am not paying any of the bill. the solar lease i had them include a panel upgrade. orginal contract said upgrade to 200 amp then a addon saying that i would do a 125amp and they would credit me back. since i cant afford 5k to have a new power line ran to my house. i cant find anything in the contract about what happends to the old one.

paranoid, for your own satisfaction did you look at the spec label inside the panel to verify the panel is rated at 125A?

so looking at the inside lable it lists 4 different model numbers

• MBE1224B100BTS
• MBE1224B125BTF
• MBE1224B100BTS
• MBE1224B125BTF

However it does say 125Amps max under that section.
but no where that i can see actually says what exact model it is (at least visable to me, i even took off the main cover to see the breakers and all that was inside there was a small lable but no model info.

This is what I was going to say. Check your front window... Also demand your old hardware back.. You would be surprised how hot a commodity old zinsco breakers are on ebay and craigslist.

yea i will do that

 

[Norcal]

Well acutally i am not paying any of the bill. the solar lease i had them include a panel upgrade. orginal contract said upgrade to 200 amp then a addon saying that i would do a 125amp and they would credit me back. since i cant afford 5k to have a new power line ran to my house. i cant find anything in the contract about what happends to the old one.



so looking at the inside lable it lists 4 different model numbers

• MBE1224B100BTS
• MBE1224B125BTF
• MBE1224B100BTS
• MBE1224B125BTF

However it does say 125Amps max under that section.
but no where that i can see actually says what exact model it is (at least visable to me, i even took off the main cover to see the breakers and all that was inside there was a small lable but no model info.


yea i will do that

The differences in the cat. #'s are if a 100 or 125A main breaker was installed & the S&F is Surface or semi-Flush. But there seems to be a error as all the semi-flush models are 125A

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Where the OP failed by not being present when the installation was being done. I would never consider having someone do work when I was not there. I did have my steel building erected, in part while I was at work, but it was a large project and I made a list every day of issues, and I took off work a couple of critical days.

If OP had been standing there, when the old panel came out, he could have grabbed it and headed for the garage with it, right then. The contractor will sell those breakers to his next Zinsco customer.

Tell him you own the panel, nothing in the contract states otherwise, and you want it back, and you are aware of the value of the breakers as you paid alot for them.

Charles

Charles

 

[paranoid56]

as much as i wanted to be there, my job didnt allow me to be out that day, to many deadlines. however, still waiting for the word back from the contractor.