Questions about installing copper air lines

[dgreen1069]

I am moving my compressor from my garage to my basement and I plan to plumb copper air lines from my basement to my garage ceiling where I will place my retractable air hose.

Couple of questions:
1. I've read several threads on this board that recommend 3/4 over 1/2" copper pipe. My compressor has a 1/4" quick connect - would it still make sense to use 3/4" pipe over 1/2"? The difference is about $40. I've already purchased 3/4" pipe, but I don't want to waste money if I don't have to.

2. Can I use a T near the basement level compressor to create a low point that would act as a water catch? I was thinking about putting a ball valve at the lowest point to drain water out of the line. Would this work?

3. What is the proper way to connect quick connects to copper pipe? I purchased 3/4" copper pipe and 3/4" to 1/2" NPT thread adapters. I also bought bronze 1/2"NPT male to 1/4" NPT female adapters. I have no idea if that is the correct way to install quick connects or not.

Any guidance is greatly appreciated.

 

[socapots]

more air volume is the reason to go with a bigger pipe..
But i myself always wonder what effect of the 1/4 couplers is in this type of situation.

I would think that you are going to need a way for water to get out of the system. A drain in the basement is a good idea. So is an inline dryer of some type with a filter downline from that. I have a setup of copper that goes from the floorish to cielingish with a ball valve at the end of each run. and water will collect in all of them. but by time it gets to the dryer there is almost nill.

i Cant remember what i used for coupling the air coupler to the copper line. but i think it was a reducer then a threaded adapter.

be careful trying to solder dissimilar metals. i had to do that to put my air dryer inline and it was not an easy task. Then again i dont think i was using the proper torch... actually im pretty sure i was not.

hopefully someone else can set me strait if i have just given you any false information.
but hey.. mistakes and other people are the only ways to learn things.

 

[Oggy]

I am moving my compressor from my garage to my basement and I plan to plumb copper air lines from my basement to my garage ceiling where I will place my retractable air hose.

Couple of questions:
1. I've read several threads on this board that recommend 3/4 over 1/2" copper pipe. My compressor has a 1/4" quick connect - would it still make sense to use 3/4" pipe over 1/2"? The difference is about $40. I've already purchased 3/4" pipe, but I don't want to waste money if I don't have to.

2. Can I use a T near the basement level compressor to create a low point that would act as a water catch? I was thinking about putting a ball valve at the lowest point to drain water out of the line. Would this work?

3. What is the proper way to connect quick connects to copper pipe? I purchased 3/4" copper pipe and 3/4" to 1/2" NPT thread adapters. I also bought bronze 1/2"NPT male to 1/4" NPT female adapters. I have no idea if that is the correct way to install quick connects or not.

Any guidance is greatly appreciated.

1. I'd probably stick with the 3/4 if you've already purchased it. You'll pick additional volume for the system, and have a higher gain in air flow, think about driving on 4 lane highway vs a 2 lane.

2. That's a good idea, you'll want to be able to evacuate any water in the system, additionally, at the end of any long runs, and as previously stated, consider an air dryer.

3. That sounds right, You shouldn't have to worry about soldering dissimilar metals, as you purchased NPT for the dissimilar metal connections. I don't remember the thread size, so I'm not sure if you would even need the adapters, but be sure to use a thread sealant, maybe someone else could chime in on whether there would be a problem with a reaction between the metals.

 

[dgreen1069]

Correction on the fittings - they are brass not bronze. They are threaded 1/2" male on one side and 1/4" female on the other.

 

[Blacktop]

All good points but I would not recommend soldering your air lines. They really should be silver brazed for additional strength.

 

[Engineer61]

Brass & Bronze are just copper alloys and aren't considered to be dissimilar with copper so no anti-corrosion precautions are necessary, just use some teflon paste on the threads so you get a good air seal. The quick disconnect fittings should be either brass, stainless steel or if steel then nickel plated to prevent them from corroding but brass or stainless is much better.

 

[DonnyT]

Copper comes in 3 grades. M is light duty, L is med duty and K is extra heavy. Which one did you get??? I hope not type M. No type o either, M is light duty.

 

[Falcon67]

1) 1/2 is way plenty unless you have more than 100' of pipe and a lot of elbows.

2) Yes, that's a good way to work it

3) get a 1/2" flex hydraulic hose from TSC or similar - you want a flex line between the compressor and the piping, not a solid connection. On the ends for simple drops, buy 1/4 quicks with male threads and use a female adapter soldered to the pipe.

 

[gabe2365]

I found that my compressor tank would get hot and build up condensation. To fix the moisture and heat troubles here is how I plumbed my air compressor. I get no water in the main 60 gallon tank and it now stays cool. I stole the idea from a guy on youtube called chevahaulic. Compressor head --> Aftercooler "I use junkyard snake type ac condencer" --> cheepo 5 gallon air tank for the water to accumulate in with a drain in the bottom. --> plumbed uphill into the 60 gallon compressor tank. Out of the compressor tank to a 40 micron Particulate/water filter --> 0.3 micron Coalescing filter--- then the regulator. --- then to iron pipe. Good Luck

 

[dgreen1069]

Copper comes in 3 grades. M is light duty, L is med duty and K is extra heavy. Which one did you get??? I hope not type M. No type o either, M is light duty.

I went with L type copper.

 

[djjsr]

Type 'M' copper and soldered joints will easily handle any pressure from the normal garage compressor.

Go to copper.org for all of the technical information.

 

[rogsmart]

"Type 'M' copper and soldered joints will easily handle any pressure from the normal garage compressor.

Go to copper.org for all of the technical information."


The above pretty much sez it all. You do not need to silver braze for copper air lines. Soldered joints are plenty strong. Do pay careful attention to properly cleaning, fluxing, and soldering your connections. Visual inspection of each connection is aided by a simple inspection mirror on an extension and a small flash light.

Post some pics when you get going on the project. Best of luck.

 

[Spareparts]

When I did mine it was with 3/4" M copper and when it came to where I wanted a drop I put the "T" with the port up, then a couple of "Street Els" to turn it down. Remember moisture is at the bottom of the pipe so going up then down will eliminate most of the moisture. Came down the wall to a Ball Valve then a "T" for the quick coupling and on down the wall about 12" to another ball valve for a drain. Sounds a little pricy but in the long run it is better. Remember this thread is worthless without pictures, we like pictures LOL.

 

[davidlee]

Not to hijack this thread but I was looking to repipe my air lines and realized that 1/2 copper is quite a bit smaller in ID than 1/2 black iron. Your thoughts on sizing for a 40x 50 shop?

 

[DonnyT]

I went with L type copper.

Excellent choice.

 

[Fastback]

All good points but I would not recommend soldering your air lines. They really should be silver brazed for additional strength.

THIS! A fire can cause the lines to come apart and add fuel to the fire.

When seconds count the fire department is only minutes away!

 

[socapots]

THIS! A fire can cause the lines to come apart and add fuel to the fire.



When seconds count the fire department is only minutes away!

How does this work? There is no more oxygen in the air coming out of the air line compared to the air around. And the last time I put high pressure air on a fire it went out..
Mind you it wasn't a big fire.
What are the melting points of lead compared to the stronger silver anyways?

 

[coxodoina]

The quick disconnect fittings should be either brass, stainless steel or if steel then nickel plated to prevent them from corroding but brass or stainless is much better.

 

[ddawg16]

THIS! A fire can cause the lines to come apart and add fuel to the fire.

When seconds count the fire department is only minutes away!

By the time it gets hot enough to melt the solder, the lines coming apart are the least of the worries....better to prevent the fire in the first place.

The pressure rating for type M annealed 3/4" copper pipe is 350 PSI, drawn 3/4" pipe is 610 PSI.

Copper is a very good way to run your air....it doesn't rust...and it's easy to make changes.

As for the 1/4" restriction at the tank....no reason you can't upsize. Personally, go get you a 3/4" hyd hose and put matching fittings on the compressor.

 

[dgreen1069]

Thanks for all of the replies. I finished the project this afternoon without any problems. While I don't like to take shortcuts, I have very limited experience sweating pipe and no experience brazing. I went ahead and soldered all the copper. My compressor is in an unfinished storage room in my basement and is plugged into an outlet controlled by a switch in my garage. Here are a few pictures of the finished product:<a href="http://s760.photobucket.com/albums/xx244/dgreen1069/?action=view&current=IMG_0532.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i760.photobucket.com/albums/xx244/dgreen1069/IMG_0532.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
<a href="http://s760.photobucket.com/albums/xx244/dgreen1069/?action=view&current=IMG_0534.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i760.photobucket.com/albums/xx244/dgreen1069/IMG_0534.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

<a href="http://s760.photobucket.com/albums/xx244/dgreen1069/?action=view&current=IMG_0530.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i760.photobucket.com/albums/xx244/dgreen1069/IMG_0530.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>Now that this is done I'd like to find some better cabinets for the back wall. I just ordered a 56" Montezuma tool box with 20" side cabinet. I want to finish the walls in the garage and maybe epoxy the floor. I've wanted to redo my garage forever, and moving my compressor and refrigerator to the basement was my first hurdle.

 

[ddawg16]

green....nice job...very nice job.....and thanks for posting pics......

Your sweat joints look good.....

But you have to do something about those hangers for your garage rails......

You need to do something like this with SS....

 

[rogsmart]

Looks good. If you want to secure the pipe a little better you can get some plastic clips at H.D. or Lowes in the plumbing dept. There are lots of variations, but here are two common ones. They open up to slip right over the pipe. You can just add a few to supplement what you've already got. Nice little project, way to go man.

 

[dgreen1069]

green....nice job...very nice job.....and thanks for posting pics......

Your sweat joints look good.....

But you have to do something about those hangers for your garage rails......

You need to do something like this with SS....

Those hangers are nice! The ones I have are what were installed when my house was new. If I was going to change them I think I would consider going with high lift garage doors. Two of my neighbors bought four post drive on car lifts and I've been jealous ever since....the high lift doors would give me the ability to add a lift in the future.

 

[mdale]

Can you post a close up pic of what fitting you are using to go from copper pipe to thread for a quick connect?

 

[BellyUpFish]

Can you post a close up pic of what fitting you are using to go from copper pipe to thread for a quick connect?

Seems to be a popular question, or atleast it's what I'm searching tonight.

Sure would be nice if. Could find a 1/2 female solder end to 1/4 threaded end fitting. Doesn't look like its real plentiful.

I'm thinking about going with something like the following, adding a 3/8 to 3/8 male/male or 3/8 to 1/ male/male..

http://www.homedepot.com/p/NIBCO-1-...PT-Female-Adapter-C603/100343349#.UgHUYMu9KSM

 

[ddawg16]

I used a 3/4" to 1/2" reducer...then soldered a 1/2" FPT on the end.

 

[csp]

THIS! A fire can cause the lines to come apart and add fuel to the fire.

When seconds count the fire department is only minutes away!

...and what are you going to do with those air hose reels, hydraulic lines to connect the compressor to the copper lines, etc? Are you going to try to fireproof them too? They are going to catch fire long before any solder will begin to melt.

 

[NY_treeguy]

Looks Great. Nice clean install and from the looks of those sweat joints, you could be a pro.

 

[willymakeit]

I found that my compressor tank would get hot and build up condensation. To fix the moisture and heat troubles here is how I plumbed my air compressor. I get no water in the main 60 gallon tank and it now stays cool. I stole the idea from a guy on youtube called chevahaulic. Compressor head --> Aftercooler "I use junkyard snake type ac condencer" --> cheepo 5 gallon air tank for the water to accumulate in with a drain in the bottom. --> plumbed uphill into the 60 gallon compressor tank. Out of the compressor tank to a 40 micron Particulate/water filter --> 0.3 micron Coalescing filter--- then the regulator. --- then to iron pipe. Good Luck

Any pics on this? Sounds interesting

 

[Jamie V]

I have this exact setup. 6.5hp, 80gal compressor in my basement plumbed up to my garage. I ran 3/4" type K copper up to the garage. It goes to a manifold with two outlets unregulated and two regulated with the regulator mounted upstairs. I have the compressor on rubber isolators and a stainless braided hose going from the tank to the copper on the wall to not transfer vibrations. I also have a drip leg with ball valve to bleed off water. Been working great for like 8-9 yrs.

 

[Jamie V]

 

[marsh1]

green....nice job...very nice job.....and thanks for posting pics......

Your sweat joints look good.....

But you have to do something about those hangers for your garage rails......

You need to do something like this with SS....

I am researching my air line install and saw the hangers you posted. I just installed powder coated rails and a set of these would be a great addition. Where did you get them?

Thanks!

 

[ddawg16]

I am researching my air line install and saw the hangers you posted. I just installed powder coated rails and a set of these would be a great addition. Where did you get them?

Thanks!

I made them

 

[Cobra5150]

Install looks good. Here's the only suggestion I can think of
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