quick grounding wire question

[dragginbalz]

Good morning,

I got the conduit hung this weekend and I started running my wiring to one side of the wall. These are all connected to the subpanel in the garage so the ground and neutral are seperate.

Inside that 3/4" EMT I ran:

1 - #12 green
1- #12 white
1- #12 black
2- #10 red

I am using the #12 to run one row (5) 110V/20A, GFCI protected outlets
I am using the #10 to run one 30A /220v for my welders and plasma.

The receptacle for the welder is hot hot ground.

Can I use one #12 ground and ground all outlets and the 220V recep back to the panel and pigtailed to each box? (keep it as planned)


Do I need to upgrade the conductor size to a #10?

OR

Do I have to pull a # 10 ground specifically for the 220V and leave the #12 for the 110v?


Thank you everyone in advance.

t

 

[sberry]

A 10 would cover all the circuits. You really dont even need a wire as the pipe is a ground conductor but it wont hurt anything. Circuits 30A or under use a full size wire, one that matches the conductor, personally since this is in metallic pipe the 12 wouldn't bother me or cause a loss of sleep though.

 

[tfi racing]

I agree,the ground wire is not required unless its a wet condition and you used raintite fittings,but if you want the guarantee,run it.#10 is the rule in this case,but #12 wouldn't bother me any either if that is all I had.

 

[Aceman]

I agree,the ground wire is not required unless its a wet condition and you used raintite fittings,but if you want the guarantee,run it.

Maybe in Canada but not here. EMT qualifies as an equipment grounding conductor regardless of where it's used according to the NEC.

But if a seperate equipment grounding conductor is pulled, it must by sized to the largest overcurrent device. A 30 amp breaker in this case, so #10 must be used. If any of the 20 amp #12 circuit branches off from the 30 amp circuit, a #12 equipment ground is fine for that particular circuit. Make sense?

 

[dragginbalz]

Thanks everyone for the responses!

So by using the EMT as the ground, I can just run a pigtail from the outlet themselves to a ground screw or clamp in the (metal) outlet boxes and call it a day? Would that be a best way to go, or would I just be better off removing the #12 and pulling a #10? Based on the trouble I had pulling the second #10 I am not looking forward to pulling another wire unless absolutely necessary. I was thinking I could probably just solder a #10 to the #12 and pull it on though the conduit. That sounds easier (in theory) than running the fish tape again.

Thanks again everyone for the input.

t

 

[sberry]

Yup, tape a 10 to the 12 and have at it, that is the best.

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Problem with using the EMT for ground is that it can get loose at a connection with time, damaged, disconnected for other work, or corroded, or any one of a host of other things and you lose the ground. I prefer to pull a ground wire thru the conduit, then I know the ground is made.

Charles

 

[Falcon67]

What I've been doing on conduit runs is pigtailing the grounded to the first box and outlet on a plug run, then just pigtailing the grounded running in the conduit to the outlets on the rest of the run and making sure the little paper "nut" on all the screws is removed.

 

[sberry]

If conduit is used as the ground the devices need a wire from them to the back of the box IF they are mounted in a removable cover. If they are screwed to the box like in a handi box then they are self grounding.

 

[dragginbalz]

Well, Thanks everyone for the helpful responses! They were greatly appreciated!

I ended up pulling out the #12 and replacing with #10. It was a bigger pain than I thought (I had a kinda long pull (for me anyway) and 5- 90's (4 sweeps and an elbow that was holding up the progress!)

I ended up (after breaking the 12 gage trying to pull it through and being not so nice to the wife) putting in a junction box so that I do not exceed the 4- 90's between pulls . It made life MUCH easier!

Now onto finishing wiring the outlets.........

Thanks again !!!

t

 

[sberry]

Not that this isnt going to work but I think we mentioned that the 3rd wire here should be an 8 or better to go along with the 6's. . It should be an 8 white wire.

 

[dragginbalz]

Not that this isnt going to work but I think we mentioned that the 3rd wire here should be an 8 or better to go along with the 6's. . It should be an 8 white wire.

???

Maybe you are thinking about a different thread???

The largest wire I was running was a #10 to a 30 Amp 220V receptacle. No one mentioned a # 8 above (not that I can tell)

Just when I thought I had a handle on this, you come along and confuse the **** out of me???

Thanks a lot!


t

 

[sberry]

Sorry, yes this was a different thread, I read a lot of them and lose my train of thought.