Quincy 210 air compressor

[TurkeyIslandFarms]

Hello, I am new to this page, but I hope someone on here can answer a few of my questions. I picked up an air compressor (just the compressor) a few years back at the dump and just set it in the corner of the barn because we had a perfectly good air compressor, but you never know when you will need an extra one. Any way now I have a need for a second compressor and I went and dug this one out. It is a Quincy 210L ROC 3 and it is pressure lubricated. I have never had a Quincy and was very confused as to why there were copper lines going to the top of head. I have done some research and learned that the oil pressure loads and unloads the head. The pump runs great, pumps up to 120 PSI, and makes no unusual noises and it builds 30 PSI of oil pressure.
My questions are is that a good number for the oil pressure?
How hot are the heads so posted to get?
How much oil should be coming to the top of the head through the copper pipe?
where should the copper pipe be coming from and going. As it stands there is a oil line leaving the oil pump going to a valve type thing on the left side of the crank case if you are looking at the pulley. Then a oil line leaving there going to both heads.
Also will regular 30 weight motor oil work fine or does it need some special type of oil?
Thanks in advance

 

[bsaint]

I took some thermal readings of the head of one running with new valves and a expansion chamber. Discharge temps were 215*F.

Oil should not be going to the top of the head. It is suppose to be air. There is suppose to be a line coming off the tank, to the left side of the unloader, and a line coming from the right side of the unloader to the unloader stacks.

Oil pressure is fine, a little high put better than low. My two quincy's run between 18 and 25. I dont have a snubber on one so the pressure gauge bounces.

Do not use motor oil even if its synthetic or not. Best thing to use is 30w (ISO 68) air compressor oil and if you cannot get that then 30w non detergent oil. I get this in a Shell brand from the autoparts store for cheap.

You scored big. Those pumps are $$$ new. Like $2k a pump

 

[My Old Tools]

20# of oil pressure is sufficient. I'm running a 211.

 

[TurkeyIslandFarms]

My unloader is positioned vertical with D on the top and R on the bottom. You are saying to run a line from the R side if the unloader to the tank correct? Can I do this by putting a T were the big air line going into the tank and connect it there? I found the motor at the dump with the compressor also and assumed since it was painted the same color that they went together. I then just put them on a spare tank I had.
Thanks for all the help.
Here are a few pics.

 

[TurkeyIslandFarms]

Lets try this again. Here are a few pics.

 

[pcmeiners]

Bsaint is correct, look at the manual as to the fitting off the oil pump.

The "hydraulic unloader" ( tube off oil pump) to valve on side, is a mechanism to stop the compression if the oil pressure is low, it is not the air "unloader" used to unload air pressure so the pump starts easily (both systems uses some of the same hardware but different reasons).

If you purchase an unloader careful which one, if incorrect you will need to get extra hardware which will make it much more expensive. It is the L version you need

L version....
http://www.ebay.com/itm/QUINCY-HYDR...493104&hash=item4406ca9518:g:jAUAAOSw0HVWEZ2B

Manual
http://airenergy.com/files/products/quincy-qr-manual.pdf

Parts manual...
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...0f6bb8&usg=AFQjCNEndLQ-w0GTVEgenoVzhCij9Y9PcQ

 

[The Tool Tyrant]

Here is the link to the parts manual for the correct ROC... http://www.revbase.com/TagTeam/client/Detail.asp?DataID=204647#

 

[TurkeyIslandFarms]

Thanks for all of yalls help. So pcmeiners the unloader you added a link to, would it thread in where the line is threaded into the oil pump now. Also is there a way to tell how old this compressor is.

 

[pcmeiners]

Check out the parts manual, it shows exact locations . The issue with the Ebay link, it is bit pricey, if your patient I am sure you can get a better price.

As to age, the serial number has a date code which I have found on the Internet, but I did not have success this time looking it up. Call Quincy they will get you the manufacture date.

 

[bsaint]

Bsaint is correct, look at the manual as to the fitting off the oil pump.

The "hydraulic unloader" ( tube off oil pump) to valve on side, is a mechanism to stop the compression if the oil pressure is low, it is not the air "unloader" used to unload air pressure so the pump starts easily (both systems uses some of the same hardware but different reasons).

If you purchase an unloader careful which one, if incorrect you will need to get extra hardware which will make it much more expensive. It is the L version you need

L version....
http://www.ebay.com/itm/QUINCY-HYDR...493104&hash=item4406ca9518:g:jAUAAOSw0HVWEZ2B

Manual
http://airenergy.com/files/products/quincy-qr-manual.pdf

Parts manual...
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...0f6bb8&usg=AFQjCNEndLQ-w0GTVEgenoVzhCij9Y9PcQ

If you look at the Quincy marketing stuff, they say the head unloaders are to have a load-less start. They do nothing to shut down the pump if it's making air or not. If it's not making air and you run out of oil pressure it'll still seize up because it still runs.

The whole reason why at zero psi of air it'll make air even if you Have oil pressure or not.

 

[pcmeiners]

Bsaint, not debating the low oil pressure mechanism,( causing the intake to close) is rather useless. I guess Quincy figures if the oil runs low, the pump will produce a lot less heat if the intake is closed....so instead of seizing in 2 hours, it seizes in 12 hours, without any warning. Also guessing they expect someone to check the oil every 12 hours. That why I built a control which shut down the compressor if low on oil or oil pump issue evolves (<15psi it shuts down), or if the compressor runs continuous for a give number of hours.

"If you look at the Quincy marketing stuff, they say the head unloaders are to have a load-less start."
The unloader system is double acting, unloads if oil is low (reasons for the L version unloader part), and unloads when compressor cycles off.

 

[MacMcMacmac]

Bsaint, not debating the low oil pressure mechanism,( causing the intake to close) is rather useless. I guess Quincy figures if the oil runs low, the pump will produce a lot less heat if the intake is closed....so instead of seizing in 2 hours, it seizes in 12 hours, without any warning. Also guessing they expect someone to check the oil every 12 hours. That why I built a control which shut down the compressor if low on oil or oil pump issue evolves (<15psi it shuts down), or if the compressor runs continuous for a give number of hours.

"If you look at the Quincy marketing stuff, they say the head unloaders are to have a load-less start."
The unloader system is double acting, unloads if oil is low (reasons for the L version unloader part), and unloads when compressor cycles off.

Hopefully someone will notice there is no air long before 2 hrs go by.

 

[TurkeyIslandFarms]

Ok sorry for not understanding, but I am still confused. There is supposed to be to be a line going from the tank to the thing on the side and then a line leaving there going to the heads? And a line coming from the unloader at the oil pump going up to the head also?
Also I have called Quincy two different times last week and gave them my name, phone number, email, and questions and they said they would get back with me on the next business day. Still haven't herd anything from them.

 

[Davidad]

Call Quincy or email the tech line and they can get you the information you need .


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[The Tool Tyrant]

Hopefully someone will notice there is no air long before 2 hrs go by.

One would sure hope so!...but then again

 

[pcmeiners]

"Hopefully someone will notice there is no air long before 2 hrs go by. "
Not if your a business and close weekends/holidays/vacation. Or if your busy polishing your tools on the living room floor.

As to the diagram of the pilot unloader valve setup refer to page 16 in the parts manual as linked above in previous post.

The unloader at the oil pump has a valve in it which control the air going to the valve(s) on the compressor head .

As to tech support, they are slow answering emails, your best calling them. You will like be on hold for awhile but their techs are good.

 

[bsaint]

Most of these 210s were used in climate control so it would probably be weeks before someone noticed they were running without oil.

 

[TurkeyIslandFarms]

OK I have ran up on another problem. I changed the oil in it with new compressor oil. Once I did this after about 2 mins of running it blows the dip stick out and it sounds like a gun going off. Is there a way to adjust the oil pressure? Since changing the oil it started building 40 to 45 psi of oil pressure.
Also I finally got in touch with Quincy and they helped me with the routing of the unloader lines and told me that it is a 2010 model. What would happen if the compressor ran unloaded all the time(if i didn't hook up the lines)? I needed it today and I ran it for about an hour with out the lines hooked up(haven't went and got the parts yet).

 

[pcmeiners]

"started building 40 to 45 psi of oil pressure."
Way to high, sure hope your seals hold. Got a feeling air is going in reverse, into your oil pump. Remember, the pilot unloader is an oil pressure operated switch, no air is ever meant to have access to the oil pump. Likely the reason the dip stick blows out. Wait till you get the correct parts.

 

[MacMcMacmac]

Sounds like you have air pressure going into the crankcase. The oil pressure increase is due to the air pressure pushing the oil into the pump. Did you hook up something to the crankcase breather by mistake? Either that, or the rings are blowing by.

Or...

You have air coming back down the copper line, displacing the oil in the lube circuit and sending air pressure instead of oil to the bearings. Bad news...

If it were my machine I would pull the unloader towers, take off the caps and check the unloader diaphragms to check for tears.

I would pull the pistons out of the towers and check the o-rings on the upper surface of the piston heads to see that they are there and not flattened out or chunking.

Make sure they are not seized in the tower. Make sure the metal pucks under the diaphragms are not seized in place.


I would also pull the hydraulic unloader valve and renew all the seals in it, and pull the piston to see if it moves.

You need to check all of these things to make sure they are working correctly. Someone tossed that pump for a reason.

Also, if someone doesn't feel a problem with an HVAC system after 2 hrs I'd be very surprised. The pump itself will probably make enough oil pressure to run without damage without producing enough to open up the spring loaded unloader valve. Most compressors run for decades with 0psi oil pressure. You should also shut off any compressor if no one is going to be around for a few days.

 

[TurkeyIslandFarms]

When you are talking about the hydraulic unloader and pulling the piston. What part of that mechanism should move. The piece of metal with the seal in it will turn freely but i cant make it move up and down on the shaft. I pulled the two pistons out of the towers and they were not rusted or stuck in any way and the o-rings on them look fine. I assume the diaphragms are under the pistons. Under the piece that the piston pushes down?
Sorry for being so non educated about this and thanks for all the help.

 

[pcmeiners]

MacMcMacmac, you should read the posts before commenting. He does NOT have the pilot unloader, there is an elbow in its place, so as I already stated he has air entering the crankcase via the oil pump.
TurkjeyIsland just replace the elbow with the pilot unloader before taking anything else apart!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
As state before, the part attached to the oil pump, pilot unoader, is an oil pressure operated valve which allows/denies air pressure to get to the valves on the compressor head, An elbows can NOT be used in place of the unloader valve

 

[MacMcMacmac]

MacMcMacmac, you should read the posts before commenting. He does NOT have the pilot unloader, there is an elbow in its place, so as I already stated he has air entering the crankcase via the oil pump.
TurkjeyIsland just replace the elbow with the pilot unloader before taking anything else apart!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
As state before, the part attached to the oil pump, pilot unoader, is an oil pressure operated valve which allows/denies air pressure to get to the valves on the compressor head, An elbows can NOT be used in place of the unloader valve

The hydraulic unloader I'm talking about is clearly visible on the side of the crankcase in his pictures. It is also plumbed to the output of the oil pump, which is completely wrong. If he gets a new unloader, he must not plumb the output of that through the old one. The air signal DIRECTLY FROM THE TANK must go to the new unloader, then to the towers.

I'd also be a bit leery of whether or not this newer style oil pump has the proper port in it to send oil pressure through the drilled passage in the crankcase to activate the current hydraulic unloader. If that's the case, he would definitely need the newer style hydraulic unloader.

I have rebuilt a couple of hundred QR25 Quincys for the oilfield. I may not know much, but I know these pumps pretty well.

The plumbing should look like this:

The blue lines are air. The oil pressure goes only to the bottom of the unloader valve.

This is a damn fine piece of machinery, and is well worth putting time into getting it running right.

 

[TurkeyIslandFarms]

Ok my towers look different from yours, but i pulled the top of the head off and every thing is free and moves easily. I don't think I have those diaphragms you are talking about. The rings on the pistons seem to be in good shape also.

 

[pcmeiners]

MacMcMacmac, TurkeyIsland, I am wrong, apologize. I was going by the pictorial on pg 16 in the manual, and a 210 unit I saw a year back which had the older setup.

 

[MacMcMacmac]

No sweat, we're all trying to help out here.

There will be diaphragms in the top of the towers under the thin aluminum hex shaped caps that the air line is plumbed to. Otherwise the air would not be sealed inside and there would be no force generated to push down the unloader pistons.

The diaphragms push down on aluminum pucks, which push down on the pistons,which push down a tube, which push down a thick washer which pushes down spring loaded pins, which push down the intake valve disc and hold it open.

When the pistons move down, the o-rings lift off of a tapered seat, allowing air in the head to escape through a port on the side of the tower on a two stage unit. ON a single stage compressor like yours, as soon as the disc get pushed down, any pressurized air in the cylinders vent to the common inlet plenum and out the air filter.

A word of caution, if you take off the thick caps, back off the threaded ring that the unloader towers attach to before you reinstall them, otherwise if they are screwed in too far, you can split the cap when you torque it down.

 

[TurkeyIslandFarms]

OK thanks for all of yalls help. I talked to Quincy again today and they were very helpful. The reason the dip stick was blowing out was because the crankcase vent was stopped up with dirt dobbers. The man I talked to today was an older man and he was very knowledgeable. He said the man I talked to last time I called was a new guy and hadn't learned much yet. Anyways my compressor is a 1965 model and the towers look different from the newer ones like MacMcMacmac posted pics of. After I got the vent unclogged and plumbed in my lines the correct way it ran fine and oil pressure stayed around 20 PSI

 

[pcmeiners]

"No sweat, we're all trying to help out here."
I generally have factual answers, had 2 pictures not show in my original browser, one was the hydraulic unloader on the crankcase size so assumed the unit was the old style, assumptions are not good, as is being too sure of oneself

 

[MacMcMacmac]

Good to hear it worked out.

I had the same issue with one of our cooling tower fan drives. The gearbox vent was a long stainless pipe that was full of mud dauber nests. The gearcase would pressurize and blow oil out of the main seal.

I also tried to home brew a crankcase vent filter on a small Campbell Hausfeld years ago and had the same gunshot result. I had packed in a bunch of felt too tight and it couldn't vent.

 

[tomsatx]

I am experiencing similar issues. I received this as a hand me down from my dad and didn't want to mess with repairs.

Speedaire 4B227E
Quincy 210QCB1 101 SER# 6207106

Quincy motor replaced original is what I was told, from military base that was junked and picked by my dad. Just fixed my unloader valve that wasnt allowing the compressor to turn over due to the pressure not being released. I do not have a hydraulic unloader, just a 1/4 npt pipe and elbow with a zerk fitting. My dipstick also does the loud pop at about 100 psi and the oil pressure must be too high. I noticed mine is on the crank side, not the back like all the others shown here. Does this also need a hydraulic unloader, or at least a breather? Will call Quincy next week, may not be open for good Friday.

Sent from my LM-G820 using Tapatalk

 

[MacMcMacmac]

Hmm. This is the second time I've seen a zerk fitting on a 210. I think someone is installing them thinking they are missing.

If you go to the 210 ROC 105 manual it shows a 1/8"NPT elbow with nothing in the end, so I think this is the crankcase vent. Pull the zerk and run it, I think that will solve your problem.

Grease in the oil is probably not great for the pump.

 

[tomsatx]

Hmm. This is the second time I've seen a zerk fitting on a 210. I think someone is installing them thinking they are missing.

If you go to the 210 ROC 105 manual it shows a 1/8"NPT elbow with nothing in the end, so I think this is the crankcase vent. Pull the zerk and run it, I think that will solve your problem.

Grease in the oil is probably not great for the pump.

Works perfectly now. Will install a vent plug to keep bugs out. Thanks!

Sent from my LM-G820 using Tapatalk

 

[jerryg210]

I took some thermal readings of the head of one running with new valves and a expansion chamber. Discharge temps were 215*F.


Oil should not be going to the top of the head. It is suppose to be air. There is suppose to be a line coming off the tank, to the left side of the unloader, and a line coming from the right side of the unloader to the unloader stacks.

Oil pressure is fine, a little high put better than low. My two quincy's run between 18 and 25. I dont have a snubber on one so the pressure gauge bounces.

Do not use motor oil even if its synthetic or not. Best thing to use is 30w (ISO 68) air compressor oil and if you cannot get that then 30w non detergent oil. I get this in a Shell brand from the autoparts store for cheap.

You scored big. Those pumps are $$$ new. Like $2k a pump

I have a Quincy 210 2 the will pump air by bypassing the unloaded valve, but limited pressure with it active. Oil pressure is very low. Does it hurt to run it with the unloaded valve bypassed? I have a pressure shutoff switch.