(re-)Discovering T-handles

[AdAstra]

There’s also this which is decent, https://a.co/d/jgQjXGM

Convert-able between 1/4" hex and square, and T part is removable as a separate 1/4" square drive item, and a 3/8" spinner converter too.

 

[Typhon]

I purchased Koken bits and Vessel bit to pair with a T-handle made to 1/4" Hex (6.35mm) / 24mm depth specifications.



However, the socket depth is still too shallow, and the socket precision is a bit off. I originally planned to use Loctite 242/262 for fixing; when replacement is needed due to wear in the future, I can just replace the bits after heating.

But based on my takeaway after this trial experiment, modifying it to use a 5/16" or 10mm T-handle with a 29–30mm depth would be more appropriate. I have already provided this feedback to the manufacturer. This setup allows for a richer selection of corresponding Screwdriver Bit Sets, is more suitable for applying high torque, and provides a better feel.

 

[whateg01]

However, the socket depth is still too shallow, and the socket precision is a bit off. I originally planned to use Loctite 242/262 for fixing; when replacement is needed due to wear in the future, I can just replace the bits after heating.

But based on my takeaway after this trial experiment, modifying it to use a 5/16" or 10mm T-handle with a 29–30mm depth would be more appropriate. I have already provided this feedback to the manufacturer. This setup allows for a richer selection of corresponding Screwdriver Bit Sets, is more suitable for applying high torque, and provides a better feel.

I don't think any of my 1/4 stuff goes deeper than that. That seems awfully deep.

 

[Typhon]

I don't think any of my 1/4 stuff goes deeper than that. That seems awfully deep.

This might just be my personal preference.

The cordless impact drivers I use are Japanese spec, and I try to avoid using extension bars as I feel they often cause runout (wobble) during rotation. Because of this, I tend to look for double-ended bits with longer overall lengths.

Consequently, I look for T-handles with a deeper bit holder design to accommodate them. In Taiwan, there are actually manufacturers that still produce these types of products.

 

[whateg01]

The cordless impact drivers I use are Japanese spec, and I try to avoid using extension bars as I feel they often cause runout (wobble) during rotation. Because of this, I tend to look for double-ended bits with longer overall lengths.

Consequently, I look for T-handles with a deeper bit holder design to accommodate them. In Taiwan, there are actually manufacturers that still produce these types of products.

Of course there's wobble. Unless something is tight fitting, there's going to be some slop. So what? You aren't spinning them at 20k rpm

 

[Typhon]

Of course there's wobble. Unless something is tight fitting, there's going to be some slop. So what? You aren't spinning them at 20k rpm

Everyone has different standards and perspectives.

Besides, discussions regarding bit holders often inevitably involve how wobble affects the overall tactile feel. By your logic, we aren't exactly repairing space shuttles here, so why even have a forum to discuss the pros and cons of tools?

If we keep going down this path, aren't we just going to end up in a philosophical debate similar to whether Snap-on is actually worth the money?

 

[T45]

Of course there's wobble. Unless something is tight fitting, there's going to be some slop. So what? You aren't spinning them at 20k rpm

one of the major selling points of T-handles is near-perfect linear loading, which is particularly important with bit-socket drivers like hex/torx.

the second part is fin-tuning the rotating mass to be proportionate to the torque level of each particular fastener. 1 piece dedicated tools allow you to get the correct weight for each size jus right.

for example, the 3mm beta T-handle is "chef's kiss" but the tool feels nothing like the 6 or 8mm versions, which are way more massive

 

[Semi-hole mechanic]

I feel much the same way about speed handles.

I learned to use a speeder when rebuilding engines instead of a ratchet because of the feel.

 

[Hohn]

The Felo T-handle bit driver came, and it's superb.
But it's more for "torquing" than "spinning." It's absolutely wonderful for any kind of adjustment of fine-feel kind of tasks. Definitely a must have for set screws or such. I think it will be living in my range bag as this will be ideal for mounting and torquing scopes, rails, bipods, and various sundry accessories.

I do have hex bit retainer sockets for my 1/4 and 3/8 square drives, so I think I'll just use the Kokens if I want that kind of skinny chrome bar feel vs the thick handle Felo thing.

They shipped me the current newer yellow/black variant instead of the older red handle. I prefer it. I think color is the only difference.

 

[Hohn]

One thing that has become obvious-- I need a set of SAE T-handle hex keys (or ideally, a flag handle) for my reloading bench. So many little set screws and such.

 

[whateg01]

One thing that has become obvious-- I need a set of SAE T-handle hex keys (or ideally, a flag handle) for my reloading bench. So many little set screws and such.

Maybe it's a good thing, but it annoys me when using long hex keys like that that they twist so much. I find myself using a hex bit and extension sometimes for that reason.

 

[shibertus]

Koken has a new T-handle with their wobble fix anvil on one end. Looks handy.

 

[YesIHaveAHammer]

The Felo T-handle bit driver came, and it's superb.
But it's more for "torquing" than "spinning."

Agreed. The socket driver sister tool is however fine for semi-spinning, as the socket supports the tool more while you momentarily let go, and you don't need to keep pressure on the tool to keep the socket seated like you would do with a bit.

 

[rd65]

When i was wrenching on motorcycles I bought 1/4 & 3/8 T handles. I used the **** out of the 1/4 but never the 3/8. Nowadays working on small engines I love my work Motion Pro 08-0359, it has 1/4 fittings on the long end as well as on the handle for greater leverage when breaking things loose.

 

[Beerhippie]

for greater leverage when breaking things loose.

FIFY.

 

[Hohn]

Maybe it's a good thing, but it annoys me when using long hex keys like that that they twist so much. I find myself using a hex bit and extension sometimes for that reason.

Lack of stiffness can be annoying, but in this case it's mostly not a problem.

 

[Hohn]

Koken has a new T-handle with their wobble fix anvil on one end. Looks handy.

I saw that, a great addition.

 

[Etchase]

This spinner t-handle has both a 1/4 square drive and 1/4 hex capability by sliding the collar back and forth. It’s why I bought it recently. Haven’t really got to use it yet, but seems good quality as do the ratchets and fluid pump I have from first info.

 

[AEAdam]

I learned to use a speeder when rebuilding engines instead of a ratchet because of the feel.

My brother moved to Madison Wisconsin and regularly went to races and other events at Road America. On one beautiful clear summer’s day, he sat on a hill watching an Indy car team swap a gear box. He said they were silent, not rushing, but constantly moving, and used speeders almost exclusively.

What looked like an impossibly complicated job was done in 15 minutes. My brother said it was like watching the ballet or Olympic gymnastics.

I still use my 1/4” speeder for body panels, trim, all the low torque sheet metal screws thru or in plastic.

I‘m not one bit surprised @Hohn is exploring tee handles. I think there is an elegance to these tools.

I haven’t gotten to tee handles for automotive, but I certainly favor them in the machine shop. I think sets of tee-allens are fixtures in every machine shop I’ve ever been to. I like the ones with heavy balanced handles that spin nicely.

 

[Hohn]

I used to be able to spin my speedhandle like a jumprope to get B1 bomber and C-130 panels off really quickly. When you see someone do that, it makes you think they’re a pro. So I took it upon myself to master it— some of the people all the time, you know.

 

[AEAdam]

Koken has a new T-handle with their wobble fix anvil on one end. Looks handy.

I wonder how Koken leadership and workers feel about those awkward Americans cursing and talking about their products.

The Japanese are known for their formality in technical sales, presentation style. Maybe in the US, that very unpolished spokesperson has appeal to a similarly unpolished diesel mechanic.

I could imagine Koken Japan being mortified by that video

 

[Hohn]

As would I. Japanese culture still very much expects formality and polished professionalism, and I'm sure they are aghast at "marketing to Americans."

 

[Ditchdigger]

It finally arrived. Feels good in the hand. I will have to get acquainted with it and see how I feel.

 

[YesIHaveAHammer]

It finally arrived.

Beta 910/40 3/8” drive swivel T-handle ?

Just so I can find this post in 6 months when I've subconsciously made an excuse to get one

 

[Ditchdigger]

Beta 910/40 3/8” drive swivel T-handle ?

Just so I can find this post in 6 months when I've subconsciously made an excuse to get one

Here is the one I bought

 

[Reed Prince]

I've picked up a few over the years.

 

[Max]

Here is the one I bought

Thanks. You just cost me $48 - 20%. Where should I send the bill?

 

[Dankotaru]

I have, from L to R in the picture below, a Motion Pro 1/4 drive spinner I bought about 5 years ago, a 20yo Craftsman 3/8 drive ball bearing spinner with adjustable collar handle, a hex bit spinner I ordered from VIM probably 12-14 years ago that shipped direct from Taiwan and arrived labeled Blue-Point, and a VIM mini bit ratchet with spinner collar I got last year.


I use the old Craftsman 3/8 drive the least. Maybe a dozen times since I've owned it. If I'm using a 3/8 drive socket, it's just usually on the end of a ratchet and knurled extension, which already allows me to remove fasteners fairly quickly after breaking them free, so I just rarely even think of using the T-handle. But the ball bearings spin great and it feels good to use when I do.

The Motion Pro I use a little more often, almost exclusively with 1/4 drive hex or torx sockets working on motorcycles.

The Blue-Point hex bit spinner I use all the time. It's very smooth and the perfect size to get at fasteners without interference, and I can torque on it better/easier than with a screwdriver. I hardly use traditional drivers any more because I just load the spinner with the bit I need and go to work. This tool and Wera hex-plus bits are my go-to for most motorcycle work, but I use it regularly on my vehicles as well.

I bought the VIM mini bit ratchet last year to finally replace an old Craftsman one that kept reversing direction on me while using it. It's handy for tight areas and low-torque fasteners. When I got it I thought the black plastic spinner sleeve was gimmicky, but I've come to appreciate it. I can use the ratchet to get behind the front MC wheel and remove front fairing bolts, then put the bit in the handle end and use it as a spinner to quickly remove the side fairing bolts.

 

[Hohn]

I had occasion to take apart our two-year old GE Profile dryer that was squealing like a banshee multiple times as I replaced the tensioner arms (shot already in two years!) but couldn't get sufficient tension on the new parts. (FYI: the GE Profile series are awful, my wife has expressed epic buyer's remorse since within the second month of ownership).

Taking apart and reassembling the major panels of the dryer, I used my Koken (square drive) and Felo (1/4" hex bit drive) T-handles and what a game changer they really are.

I have bit holding sockets from Tekton, so I could put 1/4" hex bit on both the 3/8 Koken, the 1/4" Koken as well as the native Felo drive. Many of the screws are 1/4" hex so ironically the bit holders could just natively work like a nut driver.


The felo is very comfortable in hand, but the Kokens just work better. The skinny bar handles are more amenable to the single-finger-clock-wind technique for spinning screws in and out. And then when you need a bit more torque, the t-handles deliver an excellent feel for exactly how much torque you are applying. This is critical when all the screws are just into sheetmetal and they're begging for an excuse to strip the holes out.

I will likely be proliferating T-handle variants now, perhaps a 1/4" T-handle with a wider span to get a bit better rotational inertia.

One of the key things I love about my 3/8 Koken T-handle is that the the handle is somewhat wide and heavy, so, once spinning, it tends to keep spinning based on its own inertia. I'd love to find something like that in 1/4" (square ideal, hex also would be great).

 

[JradM]

Since we've veered away from traditional T-handles, I bought this a couple months ago (Vessel 400PD2). If I hadn't already been the proud owner of multiple Felo Smart sets, this would have revolutionized my work. It's a 1/4" square drive and 1/4" hex bit driver in one.



I prefer my Felo Smart sets, but they're multiple times more expensive and it's not a huge gap. It's just a bit faster to switch between modes and I prefer the handle shape.

I use the M-tec nutdriver version on vehicles a lot. It's a big timesaver since you can break free/final tighten most 15mm or smaller fasteners in the T-handle configuration, then spin them off or on in a screwdriver orientation. The only faster method is a power tool - but even then, it's usually not faster if you need a second tool to get a feel for how tight you're making things.

 

[Hohn]

I don't think I've ever impulse bought something as fast as that Vessel!

 

[Mr. Tool]

Or just buy the Koken 3715SLK

I have this one and it's excellent to use!


I also have the Craftsman Mach Series In Drive T-Handle 14pc Set in both 1/4" and 3/8".

 

[JradM]

I have this one and it's excellent to use!


I also have the Craftsman Mach Series In Drive T-Handle 14pc Set in both 1/4" and 3/8".

I like that "tested to 1700 rpm" line.

 

[Mr. Tool]

Another excellent tool from Koken to use ( which I have as well) is the Koken 4711X free turn cross wrench (or even the 4711XZ model).

Ko-ken Free-Turn Cross Wrench

Using our z-series design the square drive locks onto its paired socket with increased strength. Our cross wrench also offers a detachable slide bar for easy storage; perfect for throwing in your trunk or tool box.

kokenusa.com

 

[Typhon]

I came across these while I was purchasing a TOPTUL Socket Set. These two tools are now on my To-buy List.
1、





2、

 

[YesIHaveAHammer]

What do we think of these T handles with side drive?

Still mostly symmetric so maybe P handle isn't the right term.

Beta 900T/44
1/4", 238mm (9.4") long, pre-twisted shaft


I have similar in hex and Torx for bicycle maintenance and like them. But I can imagine needing to swap the socket between each end could be tedious on these. They do make these 941 nut drivers for that problem, with 12pt on the side and 6pt on the long end.

 

[YesIHaveAHammer]

I don't think I've ever impulse bought something as fast as that Vessel!

I was about to but gave it a couple of days and didn't. This video and Amazon reviews didn't convince me. Quite a bit of play with hex bits, and that red collar just slides and spins around which then needs reorienting before clicking in.

The Felo is pretty deep for bits and doesn't hold especially well from what I read. I saw someone had permanently fitted a Wera Rapidaptor into it by tapping a grub screw.

 

[Pexto]

The Felo is pretty deep for bits and doesn't hold especially well from what I read. I saw someone had permanently fitted a Wera Rapidaptor into it by tapping a grub screw.

I've got a Felo Smart handle and liked it enough that I bought a 2nd one (for another toolbox). Yes, the fit on bits is not especially tight. It's not that bits fall out, but they do have a lot of play.

What it boils down to is that the Felo's hex recess is quite a bit larger than .250". I cut a piece out of a beer can and glued it in to give a nice snug fit. I think beer can aluminum measures about .004", and the shim covers 3 sides of the hex recess. Works great!

 

[T45]

What do we think of these T handles with side drive?

Still mostly symmetric so maybe P handle isn't the right term.

Beta 900P/44
1/4", 238mm (9.4") long, pre-twisted shaft

Heres the similar SK/Facom era version (NOS, on ebay).
Good for UL travel toolkits, i'd say, but not ideal shop use.

Pardon Our Interruption...

I have dedicated nut drivers in 7,8,10mm T-handles if I need them. But they are too bulky for portable kits for sure.

Hazet shop kit.

 

[T45]

Another option for hybrid shop/mobile applications is the TM4CSA

You can leverage it with a sliding T-handle quite effectively, pairs with a 6 inch extension for pretty good reach, and it packs very small.

It's only downside its its relatively heavy vs something like the SK, so whiile its very portable, if you are needing UL or weight sensitve (hand carry vs tool cart etc), YMMV.

Again it depends on what you are working on in what location.

That vessel L-key solution looks pretty light and very low-volume, so probably has its place somewhere.