Recirculating Pump Delema

[Steve in UT]

I have a recirculating pump on my hot water heater.You know, the ones that make sure hot water is there when you need it. The timer isn't going to work for us. I would like to come up with a way to turn it on when a person ether turns the light on or enters the bathroom. Preferably some sort of wifi device. Anyone aware of a method to do this?

 

[The Cobbler]

wire in a motion sensor switch? https://www.google.ca/search?q=moti...CA4QBg&biw=1920&bih=928#imgrc=dfkc2LCaENnIYM:

 

[ard]

thermostat @ the pump works well for us. I guess we lose a few $ a year...

 

[u2slow]

I bought a recirc pump, but never got to the actual install (moving HW tank got delayed by years...).

The plan was to do an occupancy sensor, or replace the light switch with a 2-pole switch so it would run the pump anytime the lights were on.

 

[ScaldedDog]

Grundfos Comfort PM Auto pumps give you the option of being thermostatically controlled (based on an included thermostat zip-tied to the hot water pipe), "automatically" controlled (where the pump tries to figure out when you require hot water, and turns itself on at those times), or just 100% run-time. I've played around with the thermostatically controlled option, but we just run ours all the time.

For those of you who've tried the motion sensors or light-switch triggered methods, are they actually effective? Since the pumps can take a couple of minutes to deliver hot water, it seems to me that you'd still be waiting a fair amount of the time, which defeats the purpose of having the pump.

Mark

 

[yeldogt]

Grundfos Comfort PM Auto pumps give you the option of being thermostatically controlled (based on an included thermostat zip-tied to the hot water pipe), "automatically" controlled (where the pump tries to figure out when you require hot water, and turns itself on at those times), or just 100% run-time. I've played around with the thermostatically controlled option, but we just run ours all the time.

For those of you who've tried the motion sensors or light-switch triggered methods, are they actually effective? Since the pumps can take a couple of minutes to deliver hot water, it seems to me that you'd still be waiting a fair amount of the time, which defeats the purpose of having the pump.

Mark

That's how I used to do it -- I tied the pump to the main bathroom light. The pump was controlled by it's own thermostat. Insulate the hot line and recirc line.

it was quick ... but -- my runs were laid out for it.

 

[u2slow]

For those of you who've tried the motion sensors or light-switch triggered methods, are they actually effective? Since the pumps can take a couple of minutes to deliver hot water, it seems to me that you'd still be waiting a fair amount of the time, which defeats the purpose of having the pump.

Haven't tried yet... but we don't need the shower immediately on entering the bathroom either. 1-2 mins delay to undress, brush teeth, or use the potty ought be enough.

 

[ArcticGabe]

I have a recirculating pump on my hot water heater.You know, the ones that make sure hot water is there when you need it. The timer isn't going to work for us. I would like to come up with a way to turn it on when a person ether turns the light on or enters the bathroom. Preferably some sort of wifi device. Anyone aware of a method to do this?

Yeah, Bingo! A Wi-Fi device would work perfect for my situation. We have a very long hot water run to the master bathroom, takes a good 5 minutes to get hot. I set the timer to run in the morning for a "normal" work day. Lately, workdays have not been so normal, so I was hoping to find a way to start the pump remotely while still in bed.

I don't like running it all the time anyway because then the cold water is always hot, since our cold line is the return. A remote on-demand system would be ideal.

 

[bimmer1980]

Just curious on which pump you guys are using......

I'm intending to put one in the garage for the DHW function from the Triangle Tube Boiler... It will be about 65 feet from the boiler to the end bathroom device and then about 45' back to the boiler. The lines will be 3/4".

Any pump recommendations?

I plan to use the occupancy switch or light switch to trigger the pump on....

 

[u2slow]

Yeah, Bingo! A Wi-Fi device would work perfect for my situation. ...so I was hoping to find a way to start the pump remotely while still in bed.

I don't like running it all the time anyway because then the cold water is always hot, since our cold line is the return. A remote on-demand system would be ideal.

I think there's app-enabled wifi switches. My BiL swears by the Lutron Caseta stuff.

I'm plumbing a return line when I install the pump. Mine is one of these: https://www.watts.com/products/plum...sories/hot-water-recirculating-systems/500800

 

[Innovate1]

I used a small pump not specifically set up for this particular application but good for hot water. Taco 006-BT4-1. Models have probably changed in 15 years. Still working fine. It's by the water heater in a return line. I ran wires to the bathroom when the house was built for a push button. Set up a delay timer to turn on the pump for 45 seconds when the button was pushed. SAF wasn't great at first but they quickly adjusted and think it's great now.

Push button is low voltage. Used an Arduino for timer - overkill but it does other things (like shut off floor heat for 1 hour when triggered because its the same heat source and can pull the temp down). Used a "relay in a box" to run the pump.

You could hack a wireless doorbell to make it wireless.

 

[wssix99]

I think there's app-enabled wifi switches. My BiL swears by the Lutron Caseta stuff.

Along these lines, I think you'll want more than just a single switch. You can get Alexa relays, etc. and built out a voice butler system so you can walk anywhere in the house and call for hot water before you need it and then have your wifi relay switch the pump on.

My wife and I get by pretty well (90% of the time) with our timer. She would like more on-demand service from the pump, but I haven't gotten around to finding a voice activated and timer activated switch.

 

[engineer2]

I like the WiFi switch idea. You could turn it on from your phone just before you get out of bed.
I also use a Taco 006-BT4-1 with the timer and thermostat. Worked fine unless the family schedule changed.
The system is down right now and I need to replace the O-ring for the Taco pump. I drained the house plumbing when working on the kitchen remodel and the negative pressure destroyed the Taco pump o-ring. Has kind of turned me off on Taco pumps since it's fussy to install and you better keep an eye on it to make sure it doesn't leak.

 

[rharman]

I set mine up with an X-10 switch and we have wireless remotes in the kitchen and master bath (upstairs). Works great for us.

 

[Steve in UT]

I found this while searching around. Apparently you can ad up to 8 motion detectors.

Link to possible solution

 

[sberry]

Not that is applies, maybe it does but,,, I was wiring a place a while back and the owner was detatched to say the least, beautiful p[lace and he wants to skimp on the wire and get it covered as fast as he can. Nice place, **** utilities but,,, he figured,, will ad this gadget and that one later. The gadget cost 40$ and the wire 8 and I try to splain that the wire was highly reliable and didn't need programing.
Some of the new is great, it has its place but a lot is so much easier and more practical with a wire. I was in another ranch where the runs were long and some of the most frequent use was at the far end,,,, the place begged for another small water heater tied in before the sinks. Could have feed it from the hot from the main.

 

[Steve in UT]

A wire would have been my preferred method. But house is all done now. I used x10 20 years ago with mixed results, not sure it's the best technology available. I did however just order a skylink pa-318 and id-318. I will let everyone know it works out.

 

[yeldogt]

You would think by now there would be a simple system. I build with the dedicated return line. don't need the return to be 3/4 ... have used the Laing in the past ..but the Grundfos Alpha seems like the way to go today ..and a better price.

But, no one makes a simple stand alone pump control. My houses with Buderus boilers have and output for the bump -- but it's just a timer. I have never tried the alpa on auto

 

[larry4406]

.....But, no one makes a simple stand alone pump control. My houses with Buderus boilers have and output for the bump -- but it's just a timer. I have never tried the alpa on auto

I found this "stand alone" pump controller. They offer wireless occupancy sensors and they monitor the return temp limit which is adjustable.

AutoHot | Eliminate the Wait For Hot Water 🚿

Eliminate the Wait For Hot Water. Hot Water Controls That Save Water, Energy, Improve System Performance. AutoHot has solutions for Residential, Commercia..

autohotusa.com

Here is one paired with a pump

AutoHot | Eliminate the Wait For Hot Water 🚿

Eliminate the Wait For Hot Water. Hot Water Controls That Save Water, Energy, Improve System Performance. AutoHot has solutions for Residential, Commercia..

autohotusa.com

 

[yeldogt]

I found this "stand alone" pump controller. They offer wireless occupancy sensors and they monitor the return temp limit which is adjustable.

AutoHot | Eliminate the Wait For Hot Water 🚿

Eliminate the Wait For Hot Water. Hot Water Controls That Save Water, Energy, Improve System Performance. AutoHot has solutions for Residential, Commercia..

autohotusa.com

Here is one paired with a pump

AutoHot | Eliminate the Wait For Hot Water 🚿

Eliminate the Wait For Hot Water. Hot Water Controls That Save Water, Energy, Improve System Performance. AutoHot has solutions for Residential, Commercia..

autohotusa.com

not a bad price on sale if it holds up and the cost with the pump is even better deal as the SS pmps are not cheap.

It has to be stainless -- or should be as it it potable water

 

[larry4406]

not a bad price on sale if it holds up and the cost with the pump is even better deal as the SS pmps are not cheap.

It has to be stainless -- or should be as it it potable water

What is odd, is that these are "Generation 1" systems which are on sale. Wondering if "Generation 2" is coming rendering these obsolete.

Other than the website and some resellers, I cannot find any real world experience of the AutoHot stuff. Maybe my google fu is failing me.