2ndGearRubber
Well-known member
I stated differential, the 4425 is actually listed as "floating" input, which still lets you voltage drop and accomplish the same thing with 1 channel rather than 2. I will admit it can be annoying to deal with 4 channels worth of grounds sometimes when not using that feature. The probes I've seen listed as "differential" for the stuff like that Rigol are probably fine for board level work but the little hooks and 3" space between each lead sections doesn't work on a car. Of course that's solved with lead replacement, and many other scopes don't even come with leads so it's no big deal to just pitch them in the garbage. 1/2 to 2/3 is the scope, the leads and extras are the rest. Not including an interface of course.
If you'll deal with a choppy live trace, but good captured data, a sub 500 laptop can do pico4425 stuff. AFAIK it's still windows only software, it just needs to be able to run windows 10. Good performance which doesn't frustrate in a stressful environment means ~750, less if you deal hunt. But you also get a computer, or just use the computer you already have. The picoscopes, not just the automotive type, which I have seen all do need a normal USB 3.0 not a C. Maybe that will change. My only complaint with that Rigol you posted as far as form factor is it's basically a portable design, which isn't inherently portable. Weird choice but whatever. That's why I added the need for an interface for pico/snap-on. Both types aren't usable on their own.
The only reason I bring up pico, which is an automotive specialty as you said, is it's a thread about automotive specialty use. There's lots of statements which float around about pico being outdated, but in the real world of automotive repair it's king. The hardware isn't all that relevant to the discussion as the hardware is beyond what's required to acquire an automotive signal. Now if you're going for non-automotive use I'd bow right out of that debate because all I know is automotive use. But a 4425 is the standard for automotive diagnostic work. I think it's flawed to criticize a Picoscope 4425 on specs, when the specs have earned it a crown among automotive specialty scopes. So the specs, while "low" in the grand scheme of things, are perfectly fine as a frame of reference for tool used in automotive specifically.
Whatever someone is shopping for, if it's automotive in purpose, those specs will give you more information than is typically relevant. You can go up from there, but the signals won't get any better. Even with those specs it's pretty hard to set the scope up so badly you distort the signal. Eventually you can be stupid zoomed out and not have the resolution to zoom back in, but at least with the 4425 you need to be doing pretty awful setups.
If one could be careful with that Rigol, I'm sure it could do the job. But for basic stuff a $250 pico and the laptop you own can too. You could probably slum it with a $130 2204A if you set the thing up with any sense. All of that said, for basic hobby use an Amazon alphabet soup brand tablet scope would suffice. 2 channels, trigger and parade, you'd need to source probes but they're ready to go. Some have better specs than a 4425. Gamble with a Hantek for ~200, comes with the secondary leads ready to go.
Will only take 40v max input. No idea if it's junk, but on specs alone it should work. If compared to the resources available 50 years ago, I don't think tracking an ignition signal would be that hard. That's I suppose the root of my question - why the Rigol? Sure it's got better specs. If you want the best, 4425/ATS are in charge of automotive specialty tools. If you don't, and most people don't, you're limited by the required specs for the signal, which ain't much. So why spend more for a Rigol?
That weak *** scope intergrated into snap-on tools can do most automotive signals. 6 mega samples per second, 3 mhz band width. Communication signals will always look a little messed up, and you need to set it up right as the zoom function works backwards. But it's got a built in ignition scope on the 4 channel models.
EDIT: 6 mega samples with all 4 channels going, 1.5 as a single channel. LOL A single channel on the 4425 is 400, despite being old tech.
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, I'm just a satisfied customer I guess, if it helps me fix cars and they send me stuff in a reasonable timeframe, I can't really ask for more.