Redefining "politics"; and deleted threads.

[bushmechanic]

It's happened before, but recently, two very interesting threads, in which both I posted carefully considered thoughts, were deleted.

Not just locked, removed from space and time.

Everyone was behaving nicely, and in at least one of them a discussion bridging national borders that might have been building up understanding, if not outright acceptance, had commenced.

We have a long-standing, incredibly popular thread where all of us can post pictures of our firearms, and yet we cannot have a thread in which a genuinely curious citizen of a different nation asks why we have them in the first place.

Isn't that what information exchange is all about? How can we come to understand each other when the only places to do so are in the comments sections of news articles.

This thread was great. Differing opinions were respected, and understanding was being engendered.

We've established that Garage Journal is a place to picture privately owned firearms in what amounts to a photo gallery, but we've also established that Garage Journal is a place in which their place (or lack thereof; whichever the case may be) in our national hearts must be spoken in hushed whisper.

The same goes for the deleted thread regarding minimum wage musings. This is probably the most relevant subject to grace this forum in a very long time.

From country of origin issues with tools, all the way to the Harbor Freight debate, and including the launch of new tools that excite many of us; this subject exists at the heart of it all.

Likewise does it exist within any observations or opinions in regard to youth today displaying any difference in behavior or work ethic in contrast with "the old days".

This is a place where everyone, every day, talks right around every point in both the deleted threads. Those concerns are at the very heart of everything we discuss.

Does that make them "politics", somehow? Is discussing owning a gun or paying an employee any worse than extolling the virtues of knock-off tools and firearm photograph expertise?

I, for one, find it irritating to be hushed in such a manner.

Rules are rules, and that's fine, but when they break themselves before anyone has a chance to explore their limits, they are simply tools to be used in fear and/or censorship.

That being the case, I submit that "politics" as used in the regulatory language should be strictly defined.

So far as I can tell, the current unillustrated definition is:

Politics: Speak of what you will, but neither how nor why, in any context of history or current event; exhibit controversy, but never discuss it.

We had two threads where people were genuinely getting somewhere in discussion, and now they are gone. That is a loss. Luckily, I saved one of my posts for use elsewhere, but I shouldn't have needed to.

Here's my own opinion: As a place so darn concerned with what comes from where and who made it, as well as who works where and why, Garage Journal should have the stones to allow discussion of the issues below the surface.

It's cowardice otherwise.

 

[rshadd]

There are lots of other forums that cater to political discussions.

 

[DekeT]

Here's my own opinion: As a place so darn concerned with what comes from where and who made it, as well as who works where and why, Garage Journal should have the stones to allow discussion of the issues below the surface.

It's cowardice otherwise.

That is just like, your opinion man. WTF are you to pass judgment on the courage of the moderators? You don't like it create your own forum.

Oh and IB4L!

 

[Jagmandave]

I'm sorry bushmechanic, but I respectfully disagree......

There is absolutely no need to discuss the political machinations behind the construction or even prices of tools and equipment or frankly, anything about guns.

In every forum there are those who want to discuss politics, religion and other taboo subjects here - why is it necessary to do it here too?

It's not.

If you want to discuss those things, go to the appropriate forums set up to talk about those things and have at it.

I for one am sick to death of having to talk about politics, religion, guns and government in every damn forum on the web.....and I'm grateful that the mods keep those subjects off this board.

 

[mtwaterguy]

In the majority of cases these posts are deleted because someone reported them. There's been a couple lately that a mod has posted in and shortly after the thread is locked or deleted. You might want to direct your comments to these members. Posts about why a thread is deleted usually end up in the basket along side the original post. If you read the rules, they state mods may remove posts at their discretion without reason.

 

[Outlander]

Personally, I would encourage the elimination of COO, brand & profession bashing as much as the elimination of politically charged threads. But, then what would we debate?

 

[bushmechanic]

That is just like, your opinion man. WTF are you to pass judgment on the courage of the moderators? You don't like it create your own forum.

Oh and IB4L!

I do create my own forums.

I pass not judgment on personal courage; rather the courage of action.

Read it all again, and observe why I've started the thread; however long it may last. It has little to do with bickering about politics, and more to do with how pervasive politics are within the most popular discussions on this site.

 

[bushmechanic]

There are lots of other forums that cater to political discussions.

The next project I've got going live is a pretty heavy-handed entry, in that regard.

 

[bushmechanic]

I'm sorry bushmechanic, but I respectfully disagree......

There is absolutely no need to discuss the political machinations behind the construction or even prices of tools and equipment or frankly, anything about guns.

In every forum there are those who want to discuss politics, religion and other taboo subjects here - why is it necessary to do it here too?

It's not.

If you want to discuss those things, go to the appropriate forums set up to talk about those things and have at it.

I for one am sick to death of having to talk about politics, religion, guns and government in every damn forum on the web.....and I'm grateful that the mods keep those subjects off this board.

My point is this:

In nearly every major thread that doesn't begin with "The _____" or "Show us", topics are discussed that cannot be completely analyzed without further digging.

The threads wrap around themselves and repeat, as if stuck in some imaginary causality loop of reductive logic. With a single step, points could be illustrated.

There are elephants being ignored all over this place.

"When I was a kid, I worked hard."

"People these days don't appreciate the virtues of working, or even showing up on time."

"X brand of tool was great until they moved production."

"Sure, grab that one; but make sure it's last year's model, because they were bought out by X a little while back."

Along with the countless keyboard cheers associated with such statements, an undertone of political fire boils. It's okay to say those things, but not mention why those things exist to be said.

Common counters to the above might be these:

"It's not like it used to be; you can't just go get a job."

"They don't pay me enough to care? Why should I put in extra effort just to line their pockets?"

"I wouldn't have paid for X brand, anyway. They were charging too much."

"Still wouldn't buy it, because I can grab a similar item at HF for next to nothing."

These discussions happen here continuously. They are absolutely political discussions. If I was to select every politically charged thread and post on this forum and delete it, the place would be in a rather unfortunate state of affairs.

Current interests are important, and the industries commonly discussed here are highly vulnerable to economic and political influence.

My point isn't to suggest everyone can complain about Congress in their own threads. I mean to suggest that some threads I've seen deleted could have seen heavy use as reference for common discussion, or at least could have illuminated a few points more honestly.

We have politics here every day. We just don't have them over the table.

 

[mmack66]

In before this thread gets disappeared.

 

[larry_g]

My point is this:

In nearly every major thread that doesn't begin with "The _____" or "Show us", topics are discussed that cannot be completely analyzed without further digging.

The threads wrap around themselves and repeat, as if stuck in some imaginary causality loop of reductive logic. With a single step, points could be illustrated.

There are elephants being ignored all over this place.

"When I was a kid, I worked hard."

"People these days don't appreciate the virtues of working, or even showing up on time."

"X brand of tool was great until they moved production."

"Sure, grab that one; but make sure it's last year's model, because they were bought out by X a little while back."

Along with the countless keyboard cheers associated with such statements, an undertone of political fire boils. It's okay to say those things, but not mention why those things exist to be said.

Common counters to the above might be these:

"It's not like it used to be; you can't just go get a job."

"They don't pay me enough to care? Why should I put in extra effort just to line their pockets?"

"I wouldn't have paid for X brand, anyway. They were charging too much."

"Still wouldn't buy it, because I can grab a similar item at HF for next to nothing."

These discussions happen here continuously. They are absolutely political discussions. If I was to select every politically charged thread and post on this forum and delete it, the place would be in a rather unfortunate state of affairs.

Current interests are important, and the industries commonly discussed here are highly vulnerable to economic and political influence.

My point isn't to suggest everyone can complain about Congress in their own threads. I mean to suggest that some threads I've seen deleted could have seen heavy use as reference for common discussion, or at least could have illuminated a few points more honestly.

We have politics here every day. We just don't have them over the table.

Your opinion has been noted.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[404]

bushmechanic, are you a speech writer? Your post sounds like a politicians speech. Start a blog if you want your opinions preserved.

You want a gun forum go to thehighroad.com They are the most polite group I know of. Why do we need guns? Really? Why do we have to justify owning them!!

Moral cowardice? Go on some feminist site and ask them why they ignore FGM. That's moral cowardice.

Mods are doing fine by me. I write stuff, get it out of my system. If they delete it, not really a problem to me. I probably go off the handle I bit from time to time but I have not been whacked, so I think the mods are pretty lenient.

 

[Stooge]

We've established that Garage Journal is a place to picture privately owned firearms in what amounts to a photo gallery, but we've also established that Garage Journal is a place in which their place (or lack thereof; whichever the case may be) in our national hearts must be spoken in hushed whisper.

no it isnt, its a place for garage related topics. you want to comment on politics and the like, go on political/ current events forums, or start a blog. want to talk about guns? go on a gun forum. there are clearly stated rules stickied in the respective sub forums.

 

[bushmechanic]

In before this thread gets disappeared.

It might, it might not.

I just felt I should express my opinion before I forgot to do so. I made my point, so I'll just leave it there, and what happens, happens.

 

[Ryan]

Here's the general policy:

I don't have a ton of time to police and cherry pick threads created in Free Parking. I don't have much time at all. In fact, I think about getting rid of Free Parking all together quite frequently. Rather than do that, however, I shoot threads with broken rules with a shotgun. It's faster... and cleaner...

So, sorry fellas... Sincerely. I wish I had more time to dedicate to it... But I don't. As such, when politics or religion or whatever comes up... the thread goes.