Removing seized screws.

[BHH]

So in my other thread here: http://garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=157617 I have a Wilton Bullet vise that has 4 jaw screws that just wont come out. I am pretty sure they have been in there since the 40's. So far I have tried a impact driver, and a blowtorch with no luck. I dropped some EvapoRust in the screw holes for a few hours and then cleaned it out. Now there is penetrating fluid soaking in the holes and has been for about 14 hours. I tried unscrewing one after about 10 hours soaking and zero movement.

Now I am worried about the screw stripping, 2 of them are already about 20% messed from trying to get them out. I am thinking that they are just way too sized for the penetrating fluid to actually do anything.

So what are my options? In my thread a member suggested taking it to a machine shop. What exactly will they do to extract the screws? I don't want them to re-tap the holes because won't that mean I will have to adjust any future jaws to screw them on?

Anyway I just am really looking for some advice in what I can do here.

Thanks!

 

[jontar]

could try drilling and using bolt extractors or just drill slightly smaller then the screws/bolts and run in a tap to knock remaining threads out of existing holes

 

[djkeev]

Heat.

Rare is the fastener that doesn't succomb to the molecule moving properties of the gas flame.

Not red hot so as alter the molecular structure of the steel, just hot enough for some expansion and contraction to take place.

Dave

 

[u118224]

Are you sure the threads loosen counter clockwise? Heating with a torch followed up with an impact driver should remove them.

 

[metaleltr]

Removing stubborn fasteners

 

[Outlawmws]

Get the penetrating oil in there as bet for can and several times a day, stick a screwdriver in the slow and give it several sharp raps. What you are trying to do is get them to take some of the penetrating oil a bit deeper each time and the rapping also will help break the "rust joint"

This may take some time, but given time it does work, most of the time...

I'm in this same process on a set screw for the main screw retainer of a Reed 104-1/2 that is stubborn... (I wasted two straight blade driver bits trying a hammer impact, and I didn't even use a big hammer...)

 

[mayday0017]

Couldn't they be removed with a EDM?

 

[metaleltr]

^^^ The work of a true genius, Why didn't we think of that!

 

[dandan111]

You can dremmel a new slot on the screw if needed. Make sure the impact is going the right way and they should come out.

 

[Murphy4570]

Use a bigger hammer with your impact driver.

 

[Regnar]

If the above methods dont work. You could drill the head of the screw off. Remove jaws and get a pair of vise grips on the screws and twist them out.

If that fails cut them off flush with the vise and drill them out. Start out small and work your way up until only the threads of the screws are left and unwind them with a scribe.

 

[Gert]

Jou could try to drill a small hole (2 mm) trough the screw. Sometimes the penetrating oil cannot reach the deepest (bottom) threads. The small hole will make it possible the penetrating oil reaches the deepest threads.

 

[jrlp]

Personally, I'd use a battery powered impact driver to try and break them free. Failing that, a screw knocker in an air hammer (at 20-30psi air pressure). If that fails, drill/shear the heads off, get it disassembled, then deal with the stud by either drilling them out, more soaking, or vice grips. One last thing I try when everything else fails, is get the screws REAL hot with a torch, then touch a piece of candle wax to it. It will **** the wax in deep into the threads. Then try an impact driver / screw knocker again.

 

[tribbles]

Could you take a screwdriver bit, put it on the screw head and run the vise down on it until it's snug, and then take a wrench and start cranking on it?

 

[jetmech09]

Penetrating oil, heat. Maybe try a 50/50 mix acetone and ATF. Impact driver+valve grinding compound on the screwdriver tip. If you need to drill/extract - be ABSOLUTELY sure it is on center, if it is, you can keep going up by one bit size (once you get close enough # drill bits, not fractional unless you have 32nds) and you should be able to use a pick to get the threads out, or use a thread chaser/tap of that size.

 

[WVBrady]

Removing stubborn fasteners

Thanks, this is really worth watching. My dad told me that sometimes he could remove a broken bolt this way. I am going to make one of those punches for my air hammer.

 

[EOC_Jason]

Let penetrating oil (I like Kroil) soak for a day or two... Haven't found anything yet that can't be undone... You can add heat with a blowtorch or a heat gun too.

 

[dandan111]

If these ideas dont work do like murphy says and hit it with a bigger hammer again!

 

[Bob C]

Remove the head. Center punch it. Use left twist drill bits starting small and working your way up in size. When the wall thins enough, the bit will back the screw out.

 

[BHH]

Thanks for all the responses.

To the heat suggestions I heated them up last night pretty damn hot with no luck so I am not sure that is the answer, maybe it just needs more of it.

To the hammering harder suggestions, my only concern is that I damage the vice, I have seen one too many of these old wiltons crack and it is a sad sight. Especially one which seems kinda rare.

I am on vacation next week and will just leave the penetrating fluid in the holes till I get back. If the impact driver doesn't work I think I will have to go with the drilling out option. The only thing is I don't have the tools or confidence to do it right so I guess I will have to take it to a machine shop. In which case I will have to find a good machine shop that isn't going to laugh at some dude bringing in a old *** vise to get some screws out without messing up the holes.

 

[Reality Sucks]

 

[BHH]

If you can only own one Impact Driver do you get 3/8 or 1/2 ?

 

[reptilezs]

 

[OEXL16B]

You can weaken those screws quite a bit by drilling down through the center of them. And if you use a left hand drill bit while you're doing that, sometimes the screws spin right out.

 

[osborn.ozzy]

electric impact driver

 

[BHH]

I should add that that the screws are flat heads.

 

[OEXL16B]

If you're able to grab the heads with an impact driver, you'll probably snap the heads right off the shank. Been there done that.

 

[jrlp]

BHH, where are you by? Maybe a member close by can help you?

 

[BHH]

BHH, where are you by? Maybe a member close by can help you?

Canuckian is probably the closest member to me.

 

[jrlp]

Aw. Halfway across the world from me. I'm at the bottom of texas. I'd weld some nuts to the top of those screws with tig and back 'em out for ya just for a chance to see that vise runnin' again!

 

[BHH]

Well it actually works perfectly and the Jaws are in very good shape, So the only reason to get them off is for a full cleaning and so I don't have to mask them off to paint. And to change jaws in the future.

 

[TOOL MASTER]

take a 10" or so piece of bar steel...drill 3/8 hole one one end.. weld to head of bolt.. loosen bolt

 

[BHH]

I don't think the welding will work. It is recessed in the jaw, so I can't see how I can weld the screw and not the whole hole.

 

[metaleltr]

ahh the beauty of tig

 

[Canadian Cowboy]

Canuckian is probably the closest member to me.

Where abouts are you located?On


CC

 

[John Timmins]

Heat,but not too much. Melt bees wax as a penetrant - always my first step ! Bees wax was used by steam engineers before the Civil War in the 1860s.

 

[BHH]

Where abouts are you located?On


CC

East Coast of Canada.

 

[jrlp]

You underestimate someone who tig's for a living. I've removed broken 3/8" bolts 1/2" under flush from an aluminum housing without having to chase the threads. Or removed the upper front head bolt from a cast iron chebby 350 that cracked flush with the block without pulling the head, tigging away in a 3/8" hole that was a little over 1" deep.. Hell, even pulled broken cv shaft stubs from an turbo honda ****** without having to tear it down or replace seals.. A good tig welder performs what my clients call "miracles".

 

[BHH]

clearly I know nothing about welding

 

[jrlp]

For instance (sorry to HiJack..) this is a ~0.250 shaft to a ~0.055 gear. This was for an animitronic gear box, the circlip groove was cut too deep and it broke from a side load. Built a new shaft and welded the gear on after pressing it off the old shaft.

Broken bolt in al. housing.

Broken cv shaft..

Can't find the chebby head pics right now. I do repairs like this at least 2-3 times a week.. don't underestimate tig welders!