replacing two single garage doors with double

[always hopeful]

Currently have two single doors with 7'0" x 8'0" holes and 1'0" center post. With post removed 17'0" x 7'0" inside to inside dimension for new double door. Each single door hole is support be traditional 2x8x8' header. Don't want to remove exterior 2x8 from header for fear of damaging the stucco.

#1 option. Remove on the interior 2x8x8' from of each existing header and
2'0" from the center end to the 1/2" plywood that was between the two 2x8x8's making the existing headers. Replace removed two foot of 1/2" ply with a 3'0" piece that would wedge a piece of 2x into the void between the two remaining exterior pieces of 2x8x8' (glue and screw into place).
Secure a new 2x8x18' replacing both interior header 2x8x8' supporting it on each end with existing 2x6. This makes a replacement header that has two 2x8 with a former center post space filled with a 2x spacer held in place by 1/2 plywood, and a 2x8x18' exterior beam replacing two pieces of 2x8x8'.

#2 option. Same removal technique, but instead of using a 2x8x18' use a 1 3/4"x 71/4" x 18'0" laminated micro beam. 1/4" plywood would have to be added to the space above the header from the header to the joists, and on the face of the 2x6 end supports to make the overall surface flush and facilitate hanging the new door.

#3 option. Do not remove the existing header. Glue and screw 2x stock to fill the space between the ends of the existing 2x8x8'0" header now supported by a center post. Secure a lam-micro beam to the face of the header from the bottom of the header to the bottom of the joists. Secure a vertical 2x6 to the existing wall on both ends of the 18'0" lam beam for support. Apply 1/4" ply to the 2x6 vertical surface so that it is flush with the laminated beam 1 3/4" thickness.

 

[kd3pc]

no idea what that header is holding ?? Upstairs on the garage? Pics?

there is a likely risk to the stucco, from the #1&2 removal of the interior 2x8 and the nailing and construction of the new header/laminated. Stucco is pretty fragile.

I would speak with the lumberyard about specs for clear span 18' and what needs to support it on the ends. IF, your current construction is typical, I doubt the current frame will support, adding a single 2x6 at the ends will not be enough frame work either.

More info and pics, please.

 

[jonjon1]

I am thinking you are going to need to redo the stucco, most likely that center beam is holding a lot of weight, post some pics that would be helpful.

I have done this before, we reframed the garage door all together and replaced the header with the proper engineered unit, I sold that house 3 years back but its still standing, lol...

We ended up putting uprights as wide as the center we took out on each side of the header, so no gained space really, just 1 door vs 2, actually did it because both doors needed to be replaced and I had a really nice single door I took from another property, it was a cheap flip and I think I just wanted to make work for myself... It worked... I probably have pics Somewhere, it wasnt an easy tak by any means..

 

[Spudland_Dave]

May I ask why?
Where I'm from...the single "Double Wide Door" seemed to be a fad on houses built in the early 70's....I know real closely personally, my uncles had em, grand parents, and MANY others in town, key word here being HAD...By now, most if not all of them have been taken down and 2 single doors installed...They all regretted the single door, and now all love the 2x doors.

 

[454ragtop]

Put in a 16 X 8 door when I built my shop, have since gone back and forth whether that was a better idea than 2 smaller doors, both have their advantages and disadvantages. One thing I noticed as I drove around looking at garages, before I built mine, was most of the ones with a double door had visible sagging of the opening. Decided that wasn't going to happen to me, and built a steel I beam into the wall above the door. That was definitely a better idea, 25 or so years later, sagging was never an issue. Moral of this story, you need a good header for that long of a span, don't mouse it.
Jim

 

[slyonedoofy]

May I ask why?
Where I'm from...the single "Double Wide Door" seemed to be a fad on houses built in the early 70's....I know real closely personally, my uncles had em, grand parents, and MANY others in town, key word here being HAD...By now, most if not all of them have been taken down and 2 single doors installed...They all regretted the single door, and now all love the 2x doors.

The reason they regretted the single door was because the garage was only built to spec for a single double door. 16 foot door with 2 foot shear panels each side.

Generally if a garage is built with double doors its a wider garage. More door room for cars and more storage on the sides.

Just my opinion.

 

[CNGsaves]

Too little information . . . WHERE you located ?? Update GJ Profile with City/St/Country.

Also will NEED lots of pictures . . . inside and out.

 

[dadsEH]

First posters! Damn kids! Get off my lawn.

 

[always hopeful]

header is supporting the truss for the roof of the garage, only. Thanks for your thoughts I am having difficulty naviagating the site. I hope this is what you are asking.

 

[always hopeful]

I don't want to park as close to the jambe on the passengers side as the single door with the present configuration requires. I have boat parked outside the garage and if I am not careful I side swipe it backing out of the garage. I'm old and cannot see for ****.

 

[always hopeful]

header only supports truss for the roof of the garage.

 

[always hopeful]

Put in a 16 X 8 door when I built my shop, have since gone back and forth whether that was a better idea than 2 smaller doors, both have their advantages and disadvantages. One thing I noticed as I drove around looking at garages, before I built mine, was most of the ones with a double door had visible sagging of the opening. Decided that wasn't going to happen to me, and built a steel I beam into the wall above the door. That was definitely a better idea, 25 or so years later, sagging was never an issue. Moral of this story, you need a good header for that long of a span, don't mouse it.
Jim

".. don't mouse it" implies, put in a steel beam or stay home? Don't attach an engineered beam to existing header with end support? "mouse"?

 

[2oolhound]

A photo from the driveway so we can see the roof and figure which way the roof trusses run would be helpful. If inside photos reveal the construction that would be helpful. !7' wide door should be no biggie although keeping the stucco may be a hassle unless you can do it from inside.

I am just finishing changing my 8'W x 7'H swinging garage door to a double steel swinging door that is 6'W X 8'H. (it's a motorcycle shop, no room for cars). Anyhow I just tore the whole front off and built a new front wall which was easier than trying to adapt.

 

[454ragtop]

".. don't mouse it" implies, put in a steel beam or stay home? Don't attach an engineered beam to existing header with end support? "mouse"?

Sorry, mouse, as in Mickey Mouse, as in poorly engineered. Didn't mean to imply only a steel beam would work, but to me, it sounds like the options you mentioned may not be up to the task. But in fairness, I'm no engineer, so when in doubt, I over engineer. Again, I'm no engineer, but if a 2 X 8 header was spec'ed for an 8 foot opening, I can't see even a reinforced 2 X 8 header being adequate for a 17' span.
Jim

 

[243]

While looking for a house the past 18 months, I specifically looked for a 2-car garage with a single door for one important reason, so I can drive my vehicles in the center of the garage; with double doors I would have to skate them to the center.

 

[toddacimer]

I don't regret swapping from a 16x7 to an 18x8 door in anyway. I also think that the 22'x6"x12" laminated header is pretty cool to look at. Swap to the big door and don't look back.

 

[always hopeful]

Ever heard opinions are like elbows... meaning everybody has a couple? Yeah, well my lumber yard cannot seem to see their way clear to giving me the info I want.
Ridge row runs parallel to front of garage and doors. Ceiling has sheetrock so pics are of marginal value. I am off to measure the span of the roof from front to back, and hopefully can use some mfg. tables to calculate load bearing.

I am tending toward using a 16" by 18' micro lam, and want to know how much support it will need on each end. If it has to equal the center beam that is one foot. If I can split the difference and hang out 6" on each end, it will make me smile. If not, well, lets just say: "this ain't my first rodeo."

 

[always hopeful]

no idea what that header is holding ?? Upstairs on the garage? Pics?

there is a likely risk to the stucco, from the #1&2 removal of the interior 2x8 and the nailing and construction of the new header/laminated. Stucco is pretty fragile.

I would speak with the lumberyard about specs for clear span 18' and what needs to support it on the ends. IF, your current construction is typical, I doubt the current frame will support, adding a single 2x6 at the ends will not be enough frame work either.

More info and pics, please.

I did not know what I did not know,,, or needed to know. The header will only be supporting the roof and no second story. The ridge row run parallel to the door jambe so the wall is load bearing. The truss are 20' long so I am guessing somehow I can now use this data to calculate the load on the header. Right now, I cannot decode the manufactures' tables, but this data should be useful.

 

[always hopeful]

I do not understand how to post a picture. I have pictures on a camera with usb plug. There is no url address.

 

[always hopeful]

no idea what that header is holding ?? Upstairs on the garage? Pics?

there is a likely risk to the stucco, from the #1&2 removal of the interior 2x8 and the nailing and construction of the new header/laminated. Stucco is pretty fragile.

I would speak with the lumberyard about specs for clear span 18' and what needs to support it on the ends. IF, your current construction is typical, I doubt the current frame will support, adding a single 2x6 at the ends will not be enough frame work either.

More info and pics, please.

"you don't know what you don't know.... " or in my case what details are requested. the ridge row runs parallel to the door so the wall is load bearing and supporting only the roof.. no second story. There is a truss system supporting the roof. The span of the truss from front of garage to the back is 20'. Hopefully, I can now use some sort of load bearing table to calculate load and header required.

 

[always hopeful]

Too little information . . . WHERE you located ?? Update GJ Profile with City/St/Country.

Also will NEED lots of pictures . . . inside and out.

I cannot figure out how to post a picture here, but if you'll look at my profile page, there is an album '67 alfa and garage. I think it's what you've been looking for since my first post... if not, I tried something.

 

[2oolhound]

Here you go:

If it's only 20' from those doors to the back wall then you don't have much of a load on anything and I don't think you need to worry about snow loads much.

The biggest issue is getting the old frame work out and the new one in. You will need to temporarily support the trusses while you install the new single header. By placing 2" x 8" x 10' boards on the floor a foot inside the garage from the doors and the same above them along the ceiling and using 2"x4' studs wedged between them to hold the ceiling boards in place, you will have a temporary support wall holding the trusses up. The 2x4 uprights will bow so you need to nail a second 2x4 to the edge of each one so they form an "L" profile and can't bow out. Then these 2x4 L's can be wedged in-between the boards on the floor and the ones on the ceiling making a temporary support wall. You will need to remove the doors and tracks before putting in the support frame. It will be wedged into place and not nailed into the ceiling. (you will nail the 2x4 uprights to the floor plates and ceiling plates of coarse)

With the temporary support wall in place you can gut all but the 2x8 front headers. You should cut a piece of 2x8 just long enough to fit between the 2 front headers so it is a continuous 2x8 header all the way across. I would then laminate a 2 x12 to the front header so it is flush on the bottom but 4" higher on top. You can use pieces if 18' 2x12's are hard to find. a 4' on each side with a 10' in the middle will strengthen the join in the front header. When laminating boards drive nails on angles, some to the left and some to the right. This will pull the boards together. Once you have the 1st 2 x 12 nailed to the old 2x8 header add a second 2x12 using 2 - 10' pieces angling the nails again. Finally add one more using 3 - 6' 2x12's and you will be at the same thickness you had but with a 6" x 12" solid beam. I would add 2 more upright 2 x 6's at each end so you had a 6 x 6 post at each end supporting the beam. This could be added before the header.

This is just a suggestion but it keeps the front header with the finished outside of the building intact and beefs up the original header you kept by joining it to a new laminated beam. I'm sure others will chime in with more possibilities.

 

[always hopeful]

I have three sketches on graph paper that hope to show how I plan to proceed. I have an album on my profile that also contains these papers and several pictures of the garage interior/exterior.

 

[2oolhound]

It's easy to add photos to the thread. When you type in the reply box look under the box and click the "go advanced" button. You will see a selection below called "additional option" and the 2nd option is "Manage Attachments". Click on it and everything on your desktop will show up on an alphabetical list. Select your photos one by one and hit upload. It's easy once you've done it once.

 

[always hopeful]

Mousing ended up not to be a problem. The city would allow an eleven inch micro beam. (passed on that plan) The manufacturer recommended a 14" micro beam to avoid some kind of a flex concern. I ended up putting in a 16" double beam for convenience, and it was actually cheaper to upgrade rather than fill in the 2" void with dimensional lumber between a 14" micro beam and the bottom of the truss... not to mention easier.

 

[always hopeful]

no idea what that header is holding ?? Upstairs on the garage? Pics?

there is a likely risk to the stucco, from the #1&2 removal of the interior 2x8 and the nailing and construction of the new header/laminated. Stucco is pretty fragile.

I would speak with the lumberyard about specs for clear span 18' and what needs to support it on the ends. IF, your current construction is typical, I doubt the current frame will support, adding a single 2x6 at the ends will not be enough frame work either.

More info and pics, please.

Decide to go with a 16" lvl beam that spanned from the bottom of the current double 8" header to the bottom of the truss. The city would accept an 11 3/4'' micro beam, but that left me with about 2" to fill between the top of my new header and the bottom of the truss. The manufacturer suggested a 14" micro beam because of something called flex.

I went with the 16" beam for convenience of installation and I decided to put a ramada style car port on the front of the garage. It is a southwestern concept made from rough cut lumber. I thought hanging all that weight on the outside of the wall would benefit from a little extra support. magic. The door is installed and goes up and down on command. The carport's major structure is in place, and waiting for me to get well and finish it.l