Rim board/floor opening header

[pfettig77]

Hi. I’m putting some stairs in a garage I’m building and I need a header for the 3’ stairs opening. The header would be perpendicular to the floor joists. I was going to use doubled up rim board but I can’t find any place that has them (or LVL for that matter) in stock. I’d really like to finish the stairs in the next few days because a lot of other things are hinging on that part. I’m using 16” tall TJI joists so I can’t use lumber for the header (can’t get 2”x16” lumber and don’t want to mix solid wood with osb.)

My question: could I make a header by gluing and screwing 1/2”roof sheathing together?

 

[Shiftless]

I don’t know the answer to your question, but I along with many others I’m sure, am impressed with a build that uses 16 inch wide floor joists. Must be a hellofa span.

 

[billconner]

I'm a little skeptical if the roof sheathing beam. How would you hang it between the joists? Since a 2x6 is probably strong enough, would you consider a "box" with 2x6 (or 2x4?) top and bottom sandwiched between full depth (16") roof sheathing?

 

[pfettig77]

I'm a little skeptical if the roof sheathing beam. How would you hang it between the joists? Since a 2x6 is probably strong enough, would you consider a "box" with 2x6 (or 2x4?) top and bottom sandwiched between full depth (16") roof sheathing?

One side of the opening is the outside stud wall of the garage - so it would sit on that on one side and it would be nailed to the TJI on the other side.

The box idea could work, I just assumed there would be nothing stronger than basically re-creating a rim board by gluing my own together.

 

[billconner]

It's the nailing into edge of OSB that raises a question. Maybe layers in a hanger.

 

[Hank11]

Gluing up sheathing is a bad idea without specific engineering advice. I’d put filler blocks on both sides of each truss joist and then put in a header with hangers. The header would be solid wood doubled up. If you need the extra depth, use 2x10 and 2x6 alternated when you build the header. One side would have 2x6 on top, other side 2x10 on top. Or skip all that and buy a piece of lvl. Surely there is a supplier with a 3 foot piece of lvl, but solid wood will be great and cheaper.

 

[strutaeng]

They do have equations for plywood for bending, shear, and deflection. But I have to admit they are kinda technical even for us engineers. I've designed some strengthening for open web wood plated trusses and have used them, as well as for heavy loading normal to the plywood faces in special conditions. But not a daily use of them.

I'm not following what you are trying to do. I have an idea but a picture, drawing or sketch is what you need so everyone is on the same idea. Is this new construction?

The LSL material is what is normally used as rim joists and that will obviously work. Normally headers are below into the wall, which can obviously be dimensional wood.

 

[pfettig77]

It's the nailing into edge of OSB that raises a question. Maybe layers in a hanger.

Right. I see. The builder I watch on YouTube, uses rim boards for his head or, and I kind of thought that was the same thing as really thick plywood. I guess I don’t know about nailing the side of it though.

 

[pfettig77]

They do have equations for plywood for bending, shear, and deflection. But I have to admit they are kinda technical even for us engineers. I've designed some strengthening for open web wood plated trusses and have used them, as well as for heavy loading normal to the plywood faces in special conditions. But not a daily use of them.

I'm not following what you are trying to do. I have an idea but a picture, drawing or sketch is what you need so everyone is on the same idea. Is this new construction?

The LSL material is what is normally used as rim joists and that will obviously work. Normally headers are below into the wall, which can obviously be dimensional wood.

The blue line is approximately where the header/stringer hanger will go. Behind it will be a short TJI joist. I’m probably using some wrong terminologies here. I’m definitely not a pro builder. Thanks for bearing with me.

 

[pfettig77]

Just occurred to me that I will have several feet of TJI joist leftover. Would that work? Seems like it would be weird/hard to nail perpendicular to other TJI joists.

 

[strutaeng]

The blue line is approximately where the header/stringer hanger will go. Behind it will be a short TJI joist. I’m probably using some wrong terminologies here. I’m definitely not a pro builder. Thanks for bearing with me.

Ok, so that blue is where the header that will receive and support the stair stringer will connect? And the floor will be open on one side or the other? Will you have a wall underneath?

 

[pfettig77]

I don’t know the answer to your question, but I along with many others I’m sure, am impressed with a build that uses 16 inch wide floor joists. Must be a hellofa span.

I’m guessing I said something newbie and stupid - I just don’t see it.

 

[pfettig77]

Ok, so that blue is where the header that will receive and support the stair stringer will connect? And the floor will be open on one side or the other? Will you have a wall underneath?

Yes. The part above my head when I took the picture will be cut out for the stairs. There will be no wall underneath. I watch a guy called Ken’a Karpentry on YouTube and this is how he does it. It’s a Cape style garage with a room above.

If you start watching the video at 17:58, you can see what I’m trying to do.

 

[strutaeng]

Yes. The part above my head when I took the picture will be cut out for the stairs. There will be no wall underneath. I watch a guy called Ken’a Karpentry on YouTube and this is how he does it. It’s a Cape style garage with a room above.

Ok, definitely use LSL then since it will carry a good amount of load. Home Depot sell it by the foot. I would use a doubled up LSL you have a nice width for long nails or screws. Use joist hangers into the TJI. Install plywood on the flanges of the joists to "flush out" the vertical surfaces.

A PSL can also be used. They come in 3 1/2" thickness but they are probably more expensive.

This is assuming the floor joists have enough capacity for the stair loading, which we obviously have no idea about. Is the stair a single run or L-shaped?

 

[Hank11]

Look up the technical data for your joists and you will find detailed instructions for how to do this. As far as the attachment to the joists you will find the need for a plate on each side of the webs of the joists. The header hangers mount to these plates.

For what its worth, solid wood will likely be stiffer in the flat dimension for a given thickness than typical engineered products. There is no reason not to use solid wood.

If you want minimal deflection of the header, back it up with another joist that hits it in the middle.

 

[The Tool Tyrant]

Lookup Simpson top flange joist / beam hangers. No need to infill.
To attach your stair stringers, run a 2" deep saw kerf through the 1-1/2 dimension, at the bottom of the plumb cut then slide a joist hanger into the kerf. No need to make a 'seat cut' and the kerf captures the hanger for you.

 

[pfettig77]

Lookup Simpson top flange joist / beam hangers. No need to infill.
To attach your stair stringers, run a 2" deep saw kerf through the 1-1/2 dimension, at the bottom of the plumb cut then slide a joist hanger into the kerf. No need to make a 'seat cut' and the kerf captures the hanger for you.

Like this?

MiTek® 2-1/2" x 16" G90 Steel Top Flange Joist Hanger

The TFL2516 Top Flange Joist Hanger features 1-1/2" top flange depth that accommodates all header types as well as back-to-back installations. It also features USP's patented Seat Cleat for quick, positive seating. It is constructed of 18-gauge steel with a G90 galvanizing finish.

www.menards.com

 

[The Tool Tyrant]

No. They have models that only require attachment at the top flange...

Top-Flange Hangers for Engineered Wood

<p>Engineered wood connectors are steel connectors used to securely attach engineered wood product (EWP) members to other members to provide overall support to any structural system. Top-flange hangers for engineered wood are an integral component for providing maximum down loads that require a...

www.strongtie.com

 

[Hank11]

This is not just download - its a header for a staircase.

 

[The Tool Tyrant]

Technically, a header is below the top plates in a wall and a beam can either be above the top plates or below if not contained in a wall. His situation is actually 'heading out' an opening in the floor system for a staircase.

 

[MoonRise]

Look up the info in the TJI tech documents.

Condition H2 (a header) picture on Page 24 of 32 and details on Page 27 of 32 in a copy here:

https://www.millcreeklumber.com/clientcontent/mcl/pdf/TJ-4000.pdf

Blocking, backing, and hangers is what is needed.

More TJI tech documents here:

TJI® Joists

Engineered to provide strength and consistency

www.weyerhaeuser.com