Rock Auto (Counterfeit?)

[Torque&Recoil]

A few months ago, I wanted to replace the lower ball joints on my truck. They are pressed into the cast steel LCAs. While I do own a press, the entire control arm assembly including bushings was only a few bucks more, so I ordered R and L Moog assemblies from RA. They came from two different warehouses. The boxes looked identical, however the ball joints installed in the control arms were different. One was silver with a grease fitting. The other ball joint was black with no grease fitting. This made me nervous, because I expected the Moog ball joints to have grease fittings. I bought a Delphi ball joint, and replaced the black ball joint with the Delphi part. Then I popped the rubber boot off the black ball joint. There was only a tiny bit of grease under the boot. Was that a counterfeit part, or just an old design that sat on a warehouse shelf for 10 years? I have no idea, but I am very glad that I did not put it on my car.

 

[BillK]

It was sold with the OEM part number (that's how people search for it) but in no way did I ever represent that it was a "OEM part".

Did you actually use the OEM part number as your part number ? Or your part number and something like "replaces the oem number" ?

If I buy a part with the OEM part number on the box I expect it to be the OEM part, period.

 

[Wrench97]

A few months ago, I wanted to replace the lower ball joints on my truck. They are pressed into the cast steel LCAs. While I do own a press, the entire control arm assembly including bushings was only a few bucks more, so I ordered R and L Moog assemblies from RA. They came from two different warehouses. The boxes looked identical, however the ball joints installed in the control arms were different. One was silver with a grease fitting. The other ball joint was black with no grease fitting. This made me nervous, because I expected the Moog ball joints to have grease fittings. I bought a Delphi ball joint, and replaced the black ball joint with the Delphi part. Then I popped the rubber boot off the black ball joint. There was only a tiny bit of grease under the boot. Was that a counterfeit part, or just an old design that sat on a warehouse shelf for 10 years? I have no idea, but I am very glad that I did not put it on my car.

That's how Moog stuff is coming now, it's made off shore and both part numbers don't necessarily come from the same manufacturer, in fact they may not even be made in the same country. Mevotech is the same way except I've gotten 2 sway bar links that are the same part number but one has grease fittings and 16mm nuts while the other no fittings and 17mm nuts....

 

[dcg9381]

Did you actually use the OEM part number as your part number ? Or your part number and something like "replaces the oem number" ?
If I buy a part with the OEM part number on the box I expect it to be the OEM part, period.

It was [part description] by [company name] non-OEM replacement part for [toyota part number].
We had a page describing the part, describing how to replace it, and indicating that this was a non-OEM part separately manufactured.

 

[rust in the eye]

Did you actually use the OEM part number as your part number ? Or your part number and something like "replaces the oem number" ?

If I buy a part with the OEM part number on the box I expect it to be the OEM part, period.

The OE number is the best identifier.
Unless an aftermarket brand otherwise poses as OE I don't object. Granted there are lots of bad players but overlooking the best identifier for your part is counterproductive.

 

[Chilliwack Murray]

Out of 100+ orders from RA I’ve only ever had a few issues - the ever popular folded head gasket, a part broken in shipping and a listing error. All were handled quickly and at no cost by entering the info on the website. A couple other times where I ordered wrong I was able to return with a very minimal shipping fee, and that’s cross border shipping… guess those days are gone.

I’ve never had a part I suspect was counterfeit from them. I’ve bought a lot of manufacturer close out and quite a few OEM closeout parts - was very happy to get expensive parts that were obsoleted by the OEM for cheap, in the original box . The downside with those is you just never know what they will have in stock and when.

 

[nicks78camaro]

Is it a race to the bottom?

I'd rather pay more and not replace it several times.

Yes it is.

Me too.

 

[hobie18]

I have had swveral issues with ra parts.
Broken brake parts (delivery).
Counterfeit knuckles.
Wrong part in right box.
Improper parts listed as correct.
Would be.less of an issue if ra cared.
The knuckles...

 

[LNKMK8]

For all the Ford guys... here is a great video on spotting counterfeit parts. I agree that Amazon 3rd Party and eBay seem likely are higher risk of counterfeits, but I supposed once they get out in the distribution chain, it is possible to find them elsewhere.

 

[cosmokenney]

I have to agree with what others are saying about the Rock Auto website. It is old and clunky looking. But I would rather use that than eBay motors or Amazon where when you search for a specific make and model year part and get results for a similar part from every generation of the same vehicle most of which I know won't fit. But yet I still have to wade through the knee deep mud of all of those results. It is unusable. And, no, I am not going to impulse buy a fuel injector for a 2021 Mini Cooper when I am searching for a fuel injector for a 2006 Mini Cooper. So why bother me with those unrelated search results.

 

[hobie18]

I have received bad parts from Rock bottom.

 

[IRQVET]

I have received bad parts from Rock bottom.

Can you expound on this? Looking to be educated so I know what to avoid.

I find experiences interesting. I’m a daily driver Toyota guy so I always gravitate toward Denso if not an OEM Toyota part. But I also own other brands (Chevy & Willys) so I’m always curious what others are experiencing.

 

[bwringer]

I received a serpentine belt tensioner kit that was missing one of the two idler pulleys.

It took all of two minutes to fill out the form online, then I got an email to confirm the issue, then they sent out a pulley the very next day with no fuss.

Can't ask for better than that, really

If you know who the OEM was, you can save a crapton of money. For example, I ordered an Aisin water pump for a Toyota, and it is literally the OEM part with TOYOTA ground off. Same for a lot of NGK, ND, etc. stuff. Quite often this will be marked in the catalog too.

 

[IRQVET]

If you know who the OEM was, you can save a crapton of money. For example, I ordered an Aisin water pump for a Toyota, and it is literally the OEM part with TOYOTA ground off. Same for a lot of NGK, ND, etc. stuff. Quite often this will be marked in the catalog too.

You sure about that one? Aisin makes parts for other companies (Nissan transmissions comes to mind). I was always told Denso was the subsidiary company owned by Toyota that makes all their parts. I have no idea if that is true, that is just what I was told years ago by a Toyota Mechanic.

Quick inter webs search:

"DENSO Corporation is a global automotive components manufacturer headquartered in the city of Kariya, Aichi Prefecture, Japan. After becoming independent from Toyota Motor, the company was founded as Nippon Denso Co. Ltd. in 1949. About 25% of the company is owned by Toyota."

"Aisin Corporation is a Japanese corporation that develops and produces components and systems for the automotive industry. Aisin is a Fortune Global 500 company, ranked 359 on the 2020 rankings. Aisin is a member of the Toyota Group of companies."

TOYOTA MOTOR CORPORATION GLOBAL WEBSITE | 75 Years of TOYOTA | Purchasing | List of Member Companies

Various materials concerning Toyota Motor Corporations' automotive business

www.toyota-global.com

Toyota Motor Corporation, through its Toyota Group, owns or has significant ownership stakes in several companies that produce automotive parts, including Aisin Seiki, Denso, JTEKT, Toyoda Gosei, and Toyota Industries.

Here's a more detailed list of key parts companies within the Toyota Group:

• Aisin Seiki: A major supplier of automotive parts, including transmissions, engines, and other components.
  
  
• Denso: A leading supplier of automotive electronics, climate control systems, and other components.
  
  
• JTEKT: A company that produces steering systems, chassis components, and other automotive parts.
  
  
• Toyoda Gosei: A manufacturer of automotive parts, including interior and exterior components.
  
  
• Toyota Industries: A company that produces automotive parts, including engines and transmissions.
  
  
• Hino Motors: A manufacturer of commercial vehicles, including trucks and buses
  
  
• Daihatsu Motor: A manufacturer of small vehicles
  
  
• Toyota Auto Body: A manufacturer of automotive bodies and chassis
  
  
• Aichi Steel: A manufacturer of steel products for the automotive industry
  
  
• Toyota Boshoku: A manufacturer of automotive seats and interior parts

 

[Buckaroo5]

You sure about that one? Aisin makes parts for other companies (Nissan transmissions comes to mind). I was always told Denso was the subsidiary company owned by Toyota that makes all their parts. I have no idea if that is true, that is just what I was told years ago by a Toyota Mechanic.

Quick inter webs search:

"DENSO Corporation is a global automotive components manufacturer headquartered in the city of Kariya, Aichi Prefecture, Japan. After becoming independent from Toyota Motor, the company was founded as Nippon Denso Co. Ltd. in 1949. About 25% of the company is owned by Toyota."

"Aisin Corporation is a Japanese corporation that develops and produces components and systems for the automotive industry. Aisin is a Fortune Global 500 company, ranked 359 on the 2020 rankings. Aisin is a member of the Toyota Group of companies."

TOYOTA MOTOR CORPORATION GLOBAL WEBSITE | 75 Years of TOYOTA | Purchasing | List of Member Companies

Various materials concerning Toyota Motor Corporations' automotive business

www.toyota-global.com

I also believe that Aisin has been the waterpump OEM manufacturer for Toyota. Denso has been the OEM manufacturer for spark plugs, injectors, coils, sensors and radiators. I think NGK has also been an OEM manufacturer for spark plugs in some cases. Koyo for bearings. All of these are quality manufacturers.

 

[bwringer]

You sure about that one? Aisin makes parts for other companies (Nissan comes to mind). I was always told Denso was the subsidiary company owned by Toyota that makes all their parts. I have no idea if that is true, that is just what I was told years ago by a Toyota Mechanic.

"DENSO Corporation is a global automotive components manufacturer headquartered in the city of Kariya, Aichi Prefecture, Japan. After becoming independent from Toyota Motor, the company was founded as Nippon Denso Co. Ltd. in 1949. About 25% of the company is owned by Toyota."

TOYOTA MOTOR CORPORATION GLOBAL WEBSITE | 75 Years of TOYOTA | Purchasing | List of Member Companies

Various materials concerning Toyota Motor Corporations' automotive business

www.toyota-global.com

Which one?

Aisin makes, among many other things, transmissions for pretty much everyone, including Toyota. Most, but not all, Toyota transmissions are Aisin.

The Aisin water pump I mentioned is literally identical in every little detail to the Toyota OEM part. The original part I removed said "AISIN" as well as TOYOTA. The one I installed said AISIN in the same place, but the raised letters that said "TOYOTA" on the original were ground off.

You can actually see this in the photo of this Aisin water pump from RockAuto, for a 3.5L V6:

The shiny area just to the left of the pulley flange says "TOYOTA" on parts obtained through Toyota, and it's been ground off here. Both say AISIN on the left.

Aisin was partially founded by Toyota, and is one of many companies with partial ownership or complex relationships with Toyota:

Toyota Group - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The OEM spark plugs I purchased from a Toyota dealer in Toyota boxes were NGK.

The alternators, and lots of other electrical, AC, fuel, and other gubbins in many Toyotas (and pretty much every other car on the planet), are very often Denso (previously known as ND or Nippon Denso). They're partially owned by Toyota, but they don't make everything found in a Toyota, and they manufacture parts for pretty much everyone.

Of course, Toyota also sources parts from many other companies as well. It's a big ol' complex world out there, and there are few absolutes.

 

[IRQVET]

Great feedback guys, I had no idea Toyota sources so many parts from so many parts suppliers. Kinda makes sense that they’d have ownership of various parts companies based on geographical location/ market location.

 

[JerseyBoatBuilder]

I did auto part logistics for a little while, A lot RA parts for AC Delco, Gm Original Equipment which is GM factory parts, Mopar, Nissan, Infiniti , Ford Motor Craft, AISIN and a few others were all drop shipped by Tonsa Automotive for RA. Their warehouses even had special RA shipping centers to process and ship their orders for them. Tonsa is also a supplier to Dealerships in the North East.
Parts would bounce all over the place from them to Auto manufacturer warehouses to supply dealerships and back again.

Never received a counterfeit GM Original Equipment part from RA.

 

[Farmall450]

Rock Auto went the way of Craigslist?
Their website is old but actually quite good and easy to use.

Sort of like McMaster. Not a bad thing.

 

[KFBR392]

Counterfeit stuff is everywhere. Electronic components too.

I ended up parting out a decent old Pioneer receiver because I ordered transistors from 3 different reputable parts vendors and they were ALL counterfeit. I had so much time and money wrapped up in logistics and bogus parts, I just gave up and parted the unit out so I could at least make some money off of it.

Same thing happened with a Fisher amplifier, now that I think of it. Except, in that case, it was those proprietary STK darlington amplifier packs. The market is so flooded with counterfeit STK packs. I won't order new ones anymore, period.

The reproduction STK packs seem to work pretty well these days. I’ve restored a lot of old Pioneers with them. Back in the day, they sucked. But they seem to be more reliable now. Better than buying vintage OEM pulls from parts units—they’re all dying and have higher failure rates than the new ones is how I see it.

 

[nbpt100]

This is disconcerting. I knew it was happening on Amazon with things like spark plugs. I had a brand new Toro snow blower that appeared to have a counterfeit Bosch plug in it. Now they have infiltrated the OEM auto companies and parts stores like NAPA!!!

What are the Auto companies like Ford, Toyota, etc. doing to make sure they are not being scammed and in tern scamming their customers. If these are showing up at dealer ships and NAPA it is off the charts.

I know the FBI goes after counterfeiters, but it if is coming form overseas how much can they do?. I wonder how much of a priority it may be for them.?

 

[Wolfen1086]

I have never had a problem with rock aytu

 

[Wolfen1086]

I mean rock auto

 

[r8eoaktv]

i purchased what was supposeto be a motorcraft connector from ra . the connector that came in a factory sealed bag was not the correct connector. it didnt even match the photo on ra website, i ordered MOTORCRAFT WPT1648 and i dont know what connector i received but it wasnt WPT1648. i ordered another from different website and what i received was the correct connector. never had issue like this with them before , i have been a customer of theirs for years. i would like to note they did refund me for the connector.

 

[AJHD]

Great feedback guys, I had no idea Toyota sources so many parts from so many parts suppliers. Kinda makes sense that they’d have ownership of various parts companies based on geographical location/ market location.

I didn't actually watch the video, but there is a video on YT I came across from the WSJ on the Ford F-150, and how Ford sources parts from 24+ countries.

God only knows how many 3rd party manufacturers (OEM), distributors, vendors, suppliers, etc. they're buying from in the process.

I imagine most other, if not all, modern brands and models are much the same. With globalization and outsourcing, this should come as no surprise.

Obviously there is always an actual OEM, but it seems that no one actually makes anything anymore. They just buy it from someone else, rebrand it and/or assemble it. To a certain extent it's true.

 

[IRQVET]

Its funny I have a buddy that is a ****** shade tree mechanic. I say ****** because he is good with newer vehicles with all the electronic gizmos, but struggles with basic mechanics. He is kinda an odd bird. Anyway, we were just discussing how many auto manufacturers are being to eliminate things like dip sticks, forcing you to rely on the digital oil life reading on the dash.

We both started talking about if we were in the market for a new vehicle today, things you used to expect to be there under the hood- may no longer be there, and we’d have to play closer attention to things like that. I’m not buying a new vehicle if it doesn’t have a dip stick- call me old fashioned.

 

[BombShelter]

Rock Auto has kind of dropped off my radar, I usually check at least four different sites when ordering parts and they are no longer the price leader. I haven't ordered from them in two-three years. I do search by manufacturer's part number, I don't know how else you could do it, it may have replacement manufacturer's number but they'll also list the original number.

My one issue with them was an 86 Bronco Computer, mine had a huge core charge, they didn't supply any return paperwork and I couldn't find anything on the website.

I don't have proof but I'm always leery of Amazon Car Parts, while the parts look identical (OEM), the new ones last three years compared with 20+ years on the original part. They're no better than the cheap stuff.

 

[Leon bee]

Rock has saved my *** a few times. Don't think I'd get too pissed about a stray fake part. If it didn't cost toooo much.

 

[bigredcornhead]

i recently got warped rotors from Napa, straight out the box warped. So PO'd spent a week adjusting brakes before i put the old rotors back on and no more bad vibes. These days i might only trust Rock. Just saying

 

[Wrench97]

i recently got warped rotors from Napa, straight out the box warped. So PO'd spent a week adjusting brakes before i put the old rotors back on and no more bad vibes. These days i might only trust Rock. Just saying

How do you adjust disc brakes?

 

[whateg01]

..., but large global businesses like Boing, Ford, etc.., are unknowingly getting caught up.

Just like a Rollex, this is how you tell if your airplane is a counterfeit!

 

[bigredcornhead]

How do you adjust disc brakes?

Drums I meant drums

 

[Wrench97]

Drums I meant drums

Yea I've seen a lot of out of round "new" brake drums....they use to come with a slip of paper in the bow telling us to true the drum on a brake lathe before installing....

 

[bigredcornhead]

Yea I've seen a lot of out of round "new" brake drums....they use to come with a slip of paper in the bow telling us to true the drum on a brake lathe before installing....

Even crappier part about this whole ordeal, is that no local parts houses except for O'Reilly's or any other auto shops turn brake drums or rotors, or at least in my area. O'Reilly's only does it on like Monday when the one person who knows how to use the machine comes in. Everything is just throw away and buy new these days.

 

[Wrench97]

Even crappier part about this whole ordeal, is that no local parts houses except for O'Reilly's or any other auto shops turn brake drums or rotors, or at least in my area. O'Reilly's only does it on like Monday when the one person who knows how to use the machine comes in. Everything is just throw away and buy new these days.

Yea we actually sold our lathe 20 years ago, now I wish we still had it.
There was a Fleetpride location I used that had a set up to grind flywheels but nobody that knew how, every time I needed a flywheel cut I had to do it myself store manager use to laugh and say I should hire you.. I would tell him you can't afford me. Corporate finally caught on the machine was not making money and had them pack it up and sent it somewhere else.

 

[out plowing]

I'm giving up on RockAuto, shipping prices and poor quality has not helped me to want to stay. It's to the point that I can go to my local parts store and have the same listed price that day or go with RA and wait a week for the same cost.

 

[whateg01]

I'm giving up on RockAuto, shipping prices and poor quality has not helped me to want to stay. It's to the point that I can go to my local parts store and have the same listed price that day or go with RA and wait a week for the same cost.

I guess it's been 6 months since I last ordered anything from RA, but at that time it was still way less than the parts store. I've bought same items on Amazon for less though. Or same item, same money, faster shipping.

 

[Mr onetwo]

I just ordered a set of SKF front hubs for my 2014 Ram 1500 from RA. The price was lowest even with shipping except for this one really sketch website so I pulled the trigger.They were genuine and in perfect condition when they were delivered.I have been told that SKF is the OEM supplier to RAM but I don't know if that is true.Otherwise, I have been ordering parts from RA for years and have had very few problems.Those instances were taken care of promptly. When searching I go to their website and Moparpartsgiant.com to start my search.About 80% of the time RA is the lowest price.I am very leery about Amazon parts except for Redline oil and Royal Purple filters for my Hemi.

 

[dchawk81]

My new Remy (not Delco Remy) starter from RA was $300 cheaper than AutoZone's Duralast. And AutoZone wanted a core or 40 bucks on top of that yet. RA didn't ask for a core on new ones.