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Rockwell Delta DP

pottsie454

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I just pick up a cool drill press. Rockwell Delta floor model 17-600. 1hp 3ph motor, variable speed. Seems like a solid old piece of equipment. The chuck has some wobble to it, I am hoping to be able to fix with either cleaning the chuck, or buying a new one. Any tips?

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DavidB

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Nice buy. Looks like a good machine. Your wobble could be from the chuck, spindle, or bearings. First check to make sure the chuck is tight on the spindle. It is held on with a collar so it might havecome loose. If it is on tight, Without the press running, grab the chuck and see if you can move it side to side any. If the chuck and spindle move side to side as one there is play between the spindle and bearings. Investigate the cause. If not, remove the chuck and see if the spindle wobbles. Loosen the ring on it and pop the chuck off. You can use the ring to force the chuck off by unscrewing it. It requires a pin or sticking the appropriate sized drill bit in the hole and using it to loosen the ring. If the spindle still wobbles it is possible it is bent or the bearings could be bad. At that point you should have a good view of the lower bearing and can take a look at it. Hopefully at this point can tell what is wrong. If not you will need to remove the spindle and check it. With luck the spindle is fine and the chuck just needs to be cleaned and put back on. If you're unlucky, like I was with my Clausing DP, then the spindle may have problems. You might be able to head over to http://www.vintagemachinery.org/ and find a manual and parts diagram for your machine.
 

tool_scrounge

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Looks like a neat drill press.

Usually the belt is worn and squeaks. If you look at the belt, you will see the Rockwell part number. If you order this, it will be expensive. If you look close, you will see the generic part number, which I believe is 1922-V-544, which can be bought on eBay for a lot cheaper.

If the spindle is bent, it can be straightened when fully disassembled. See Owwm.org for details.

Since it is three phase, you are probably going to want to get a 120v, 1 phase to 240v3phase variable frequency drive. If you plan to drill metal, I would set the output frequency to 30 hz and leave it there. Then use your variable speed drive for 175 to 2125 rpm.
 

JASTECH

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Wow, nice. I've been wanting/needing a variable speed DP for a long time. Restoring it will be fun I would think.
 
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pottsie454

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Its a 1725 rpm motor in it currently. I plan on either putting in a 220v single phase or putting together/buying a phase converter. I plan on tear it all down, cleaning it up, and painting it gun metal grey and pearl white.

Thanks for the advice on the chuck wobble. I will look into the suggestions when I get time to rebuild it.
 

Outlawmws

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With that @ 350 using a 1725 RPM motor I'd go with the VFD as suggested. Either that or get a 1040 motor, maybe even a multi speed 1040.
 
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pottsie454

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Well I painted the DP the other day. Here are some pictures. Turned out nice. I still have alot of cleaning to do to the post and foot of this thing, but its coming along. I forgot to take photos of the body work, but I will post more as I go along. I also have a VFD I am about to buy and hook it up soon.

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pottsie454

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I checked the run out off the taper shaft like shown below, I had a .005 run out at the tip. The bearings didnt feel loose, but I cant say for sure without tearing it apart and looking at it.

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Packard V8

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I checked the run out off the taper shaft like shown below, I had a .005 run out at the tip.
Unfortunately, that's bad. Probably it was dropped or jammed a long drill enough to bend it. I'd remove the spindle and find if the bend is in the taper or further up.

The good news is the Clausing/Rockwell/Delta was in production for decades and parts are available.

One other thought - the variable speed pulley system is expensive to repair when it goes bad. Since you have a three-phase motor, consider converting to fixed pulleys and a VFD.

jack vines
 

454ragtop

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Couple things, might try putting the chuck back on, put the biggest rod you can in the chuck, and try whacking it with a hammer. I know it sounds crude, but it works. Besides it's already bad, what's the worst that can happen? Also, the spindle on those is very short, it's a small cartridge with a couple bearings in the bottom of the quill. You remove the retainer, and the cartridge slides out. I took mine out and replaced it with a Morse taper style, as I have taper shank drills. I have a couple of this style 17' Delta Rockwell drill presses, used to have a variable speed one like yours but I sold it about a year ago. Still have a brand new belt to one if you need it.
HTH, Jim
 
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pottsie454

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I'd like to tear it apart but when I poked around I couldn't figure out how to disassemble it. From the diagrams I have found I will have to remove the pulley system from the top and that will be a PITA. Still considering it.
 
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pottsie454

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Rag top, was changing it to a morse expensive? I like that idea. Also, can you describe where the retainer that mentioned is at? I'd like to get a better look at the spindle.

Thanks!
 

454ragtop

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Go here http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/detail.aspx?id=1792 See page 3. The retainer is threaded and has 2 notches for a pin type spanner, you might get lucky and be able to turn it with a pair of bent needle nose pliers. I bought a used quill assembly on Ebay to get the MT spindle, think it was around $75.00, seemed like a lot, but my press is mint and I really wanted a MT spindle. They show up there, and on occasion on the BOYD section of owwm.
HTH, Jim
 
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pottsie454

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Thanks for the link man! That seems to explain it. When I get off work tomorrow I will see if I can get it out and look it over. I will try the crude approach of guiding it back into shape with a hammer if I have to, but I want to make sure thats the problem first.
 
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pottsie454

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Finally got the VFD. Built a small box to house it in. Still trying to figure out how to get the spindle out. I see a little retaining ring up there but I have tried just about all my ideas to get it off without damaging it. Any ideas? Pics below.

VFD, dont mind the romex wires coming from the bottom of the box, those are just temp until I get some 12-4 soow wire.

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With the cover on... I plan on making a cover plate over top the the VFD but I wanted to be able to access the controls..

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And here is a picture of the retaining ring in question. Any advice would be appreciated. Ive tried hooked pliers, needle nose pliers, gently taping it with a drift, and snap ring pliers..

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zkling

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I have the same drill press, without the variable speed drive, just step pulleys.

Start by removing the qull from the head. First release spring tension by backing out a screw on the left hand side under that short cylinder looking thing (spring housing). The "screw" is actually a worm gear that tensions the spring housing.

Once you are SURE there is no spring tension on the quill, then remove the retaining nuts and slide the down feed handle out the right side. CAUTION when you remove the down feed handle the quill will want to drop free. Make sure to keep a hand on it or otherwise some how block it so it doesn't fall to the floor and damage it further.

As for removing the bottom retaining nut, I made a special tool by drilling 3 holes in a piece of 3/8" plate. One hole for the spindle to hang through and two threaded hols to screw socket head cap screws into that would engage the cutouts in the retaining rings. I then tack welded the screws in place on the plate and ground them to fit the square cutouts. Then placing the plate / fixture into a vise I put the spindle assembly on top with a rubber strap wrench. The nut came right off.

As others have mentioned the spindle can be "tweaked" back to run true. Depending on the tools you have and your patience level.

The spindle on my press has 0.0003" on the end of the taper. With 0.005" on just your spindle, you are going to have some problems when you install the chuck. As the chuck will have a few thou run out in it as well, compounding the problem.
 
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pottsie454

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Your right, the chuck makes it more pronounced. Using a known to be straight piece of round stock I measured .015 runout. What's interesting is that when the drill makes contact with metal it "seems" stop runout entirely. It may be an optical illusion because the drill bit itself might be absorbing the runout while it cuts. If I can't get t fixed I'm not to bumed because it still cuts a nice hole if I properly punch and pilot hole the material.
 
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nine4gmc

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That is for a spanner wrench to fit into, I used a flat blade screwdriver and a tiny brass hammer to tap it. It unscrews to remove the guts, lefty loosie. AND, let me know if you decide to sell that on/off switch since you have a VFD now. ;)
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bullnerd

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"Couple things, might try putting the chuck back on, put the biggest rod you can in the chuck, and try whacking it with a hammer."

Very common old school trick and works fine.

BTW,you can make an adjustable spanner wrench by drilling a couple holes in the side of an adjustable wrench and instaling some small pins.
 
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pottsie454

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No dice on the on off switch. I am going to wire it into the VFD for an emergency stop. But if I decide not to, ill let you know for sure.

Also, I have the skills to make the spanner wrench but considering the size of the keys that must be awefully small bolts you guys are using. Ill have to measure it tomorrow and see whats up.
 
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pottsie454

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Still looking for an anwser to the above...

But yesterday I took the spidle out, cleaning all the mating surfaces and then reinstalled. Still wobbled. I then tried the persuasion technique and was able to get it down to .004 at the end of the taper and .012 on the chuck. Is this within tolerance or should I be looking for a new chuck?

Thanks!
 

454ragtop

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Still looking for an anwser to the above...

But yesterday I took the spidle out, cleaning all the mating surfaces and then reinstalled. Still wobbled. I then tried the persuasion technique and was able to get it down to .004 at the end of the taper and .012 on the chuck. Is this within tolerance or should I be looking for a new chuck?

Thanks!

Patience grasshopper, the fact you "persuaded" it and made it better means you need to keep at it. Just keep tapping it around, should be able to get it less than .005 at the chuck. As to your earlier question, no, Clausing parts won't interchange. A lower quill for a 17" Rockwell just sold on Ebay last week, keep looking.
Jim
 

454ragtop

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Those aren't the right ones, he needs one like this
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Delta-drill...077?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item337fed34cd
Or the other short spindle like he has that mounts a chuck directly.
Jim
 
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pottsie454

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Thanks for the links. That gave me a lot of hope on finding the mt taper spindle. I saved a search on eBay so I will look every time I get on. I'll keep you updated.

Also, started using the dp for some small metal projects. The vfd is freaking awesome. Glad I went that route.
 

pcmeiners

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Just purchase a 17" variable, 1984....
I just ordered all new bearings, my machine was used far less then yours and all the bearings were dry, as was the grease though out the machine. I used NSK 6203VV's, (rubber seals, non contact) ordered off Amazon for the two lower spindle bearings which are normal clearance vs more common C3. The remainder of the bearings I got off Ebay all Nachi with c3 clearance. Used Mobil Polyrex Em grease as this is compatible with the bearings.
The only ***** I had was the larger bearing in the floating housing just below the front variable pulley. They assembled it with a loctite equivalent (which was not visible) due to a large clearance between the housing and outer bearing race. A 12 ton press was useless, I ended up torquing up a 3 jaw bearing puller, popping that into a 250 degree oven. Bearing did not release in the oven but did once I applied more torque to the hot assembly; upon reassembly red locktite will be needed on this bearing, locktite is not needed on the remaining bearings. I made a spanner for the spindle nut from a piece of 1" angle iron, grinding to form two pins, took 10 minutes.
The VFD is a great idea, the lowest speed on these presses is still high for many uses. I would like to see if you can tap with VFD.

"I will have to remove the pulley system from the top and that will be a PITA"
That assembly came of easy, the top half pulley has a phenolic bearing, comes right off, bottom half was no issue either.
Most time consuming was the bearing just under the front pulley, the other bearing are on pretty tight but pull or press no issue
 
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