Romex in conduit indoors?

[2000xpsd]

Found a couple of threads on this but no clear answer... I'm wiring my flouresant lights in, they are connected with 1/2" metal conduit, can I run 12/2 to connect them all or does it have to be thhn?
I know you can't when it in a wet location but this is indoors so I need a code expert. I've got plenty of 12/2 romex, doesn't make sense to buy 3 rolls of thhn if I don't have too.

 

[pattenp]

Romex in conduit is OK. The issue is 12/2 may exceed the fill limit for 1/2".

 

[2000xpsd]

According to other posts (1) 12/2 is ok...I forget the percentage it comes out to

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Ive sleeved romex in conduit to protect it going down a wall wall joists,or to sleeve a piece of existing romex coming through a floor to get it to a junction box or fixture.
From that point to the next junction through a piece of conduit I would run it in thhn.
Why are you using 12/2 to feed lights?

 

[joecam]

In NJ it is apparently a code violation to have jacketed romex in a conduit, I just had to rerun all my garage wiring with thhn.

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

 

[Stuart in MN]

Why are you using 12/2 to feed lights?

Because he already has it on hand:

I've got plenty of 12/2 romex, doesn't make sense to buy 3 rolls of thhn if I don't have too.

 

[Falcon67]

My experience with 12-2 in 1/2 conduit is that if you have a run of any length, you'll be wishing it was 3/4.

 

[bczygan]

A semi-related question.

Why is it improper to glue sections of PVC conduit together with the wiring already in it?

Does the cleaner or cement screw up the wire covering or cement it to the conduit?

Bill

 

[CJ7VFR]

In NJ it is apparently a code violation to have jacketed romex in a conduit, I just had to rerun all my garage wiring with thhn.

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

I live in NJ. Have lived here all my life (51 years), and I have never heard of this code violation. And I have bought and sold a few homes over the years, had them all inspected by professional inspectors, and not once did any of them ever question romex in conduit where it needed to be in it.

As a matter of fact, they all said it would be code violation if the romex was NOT put in conduit where it was exposed to any outside forces that could damage it, such as going down the surface of a wall to a wall mounted box or fixture.

The romex dropping down to the boxes in my current garage all had to be sleeved in some type of protective conduit instead of just running exposed down the walls to the boxes. Same for the wiring in my basement bar area. The inspector never said I had to rip out everything and re-do it all with individual wires. Just put the exposed romex in some conduit to protect it from damage.

It was the same for any outside UF-B wiring that was run into the ground. We had to put the UF-B in conduit where it was exposed coming out of the house and down to the ground, and up from the ground up to any box on an out building to protect it from getting damaged.

Do you have the actual code they said you violated to make you re-do your installation? That just does not sound right that you had to re-do everything with individual wires versus running any exposed romex in conduit.

Jim

 

[CJ7VFR]

A semi-related question.

Why is it improper to glue sections of PVC conduit together with the wiring already in it?

Does the cleaner or cement screw up the wire covering or cement it to the conduit?

Bill

Maybe they don't want the wires to get "glued" to the conduit. If it did, it would then be impossible to pull it out if you had to replace the wires.

Jim

 

[pattenp]

A semi-related question.

Why is it improper to glue sections of PVC conduit together with the wiring already in it?

Does the cleaner or cement screw up the wire covering or cement it to the conduit?

Bill

Because the NEC specifies that conduit is to be completely assembled before wire is installed. No reason is given in the code.

 

[bczygan]

Because the NEC specifies that conduit is to be completely assembled before wire is installed. No reason is given in the code.

Rules without reasons are meaningless. And meaningless rules create distrust of the entire body of rules and the rule making body itself.

As a practical matter, does anyone know what the thinking behind this rule is?

Bill

 

[Beemer533]

If I had to guess it would be the concern of the primer and/or adhesive damaging the conductors... But that is speculation on my part, although I can't think of anything else..

 

[simpler=better]

Rules without reasons are meaningless. And meaningless rules create distrust of the entire body of rules and the rule making body itself.

As a practical matter, does anyone know what the thinking behind this rule is?

Bill

The rule makes perfect sense: If you can't pull the wire through when fully assembled, you might as well have just used direct bury, or 'Romex', or BX, etc.



The reasons for using conduit instead of assembled wire thingies:
#1-Keep the wire from getting smashed, chewed, cut, rubbed, burned, etc.
#2-Allow for easy wiring changes between point A and point B after everything is said and done.
#3-Contain sparks/arcs/heat/fire/bad juju if the wiring somehow fails catastrophically inside the conduit.

Assembled cables don't do any of those very well. (Okay, #3 can be argued to a point with BX).


EDIT: The primer/glue for PVC would at least weaken the romex's insulation, if not melt through immediately. Those are some nasty solvents.

Don't mean to sound snippy, but there's a reason for using romex and a reason for using conduit..and a reason for sometimes using both.

 

[CNGsaves]

^ ^ ^ ^ ^ +1.

Just put pull string in sticks of conduit when they are glued together and you won't risk damaging the wire. Once it's all glued together just yank through the wire with your pull string.

Worst case scenario, you now have pull string glued into place !!

It's just better to **** through pull string with "mouse" and shop vac.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

In NJ it is apparently a code violation to have jacketed romex in a conduit, I just had to rerun all my garage wiring with thhn.

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

Yupper!

Tommy

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

In NJ it is apparently a code violation to have jacketed romex in a conduit, I just had to rerun all my garage wiring with thhn.

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

I live in NJ. Have lived here all my life (51 years), and I have never heard of this code violation. And I have bought and sold a few homes over the years, had them all inspected by professional inspectors, and not once did any of them ever question romex in conduit where it needed to be in it.

As a matter of fact, they all said it would be code violation if the romex was NOT put in conduit where it was exposed to any outside forces that could damage it, such as going down the surface of a wall to a wall mounted box or fixture.

The romex dropping down to the boxes in my current garage all had to be sleeved in some type of protective conduit instead of just running exposed down the walls to the boxes. Same for the wiring in my basement bar area. The inspector never said I had to rip out everything and re-do it all with individual wires. Just put the exposed romex in some conduit to protect it from damage.

It was the same for any outside UF-B wiring that was run into the ground. We had to put the UF-B in conduit where it was exposed coming out of the house and down to the ground, and up from the ground up to any box on an out building to protect it from getting damaged.

Do you have the actual code they said you violated to make you re-do your installation? That just does not sound right that you had to re-do everything with individual wires versus running any exposed romex in conduit.

Jim

I think hes talking about running romex in pipe from box to box versus shielding a piece of it like I was talking about.I shouldve mentioned earlier I remove the outer sheathing when I shield a piece of romex inside of pipe to a box.
Electrical inspectors frown on running it from box to box around here also.
As far as home inspectors calling it out as a violation Ive never met one that could cite an electrical/hvac or plumbing code even if you left the book in front of them open to the page.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Maybe they don't want the wires to get "glued" to the conduit. If it did, it would then be impossible to pull it out if you had to replace the wires.

Jim

But as long as the inspector isnt standing behind you sometimes emergencies do happen.

 

[sberry]

Rules without reasons are meaningless. And meaningless rules create distrust of the entire body of rules and the rule making body itself.

As a practical matter, does anyone know what the thinking behind this rule is?

Bill

No. They are telling you, do it this way. The book would need to be 10x as long if they had to splain why at every turn. They don't care to splain it every way to every one so they all understand it in their own personal way.

 

[sberry]

As a practical matter, does anyone know what the thinking behind this rule is?

Bill,,, is it really that much of a stretch to imagine a slob with hot plastic cement and plastic coatings on wires. Its another thing they have found to be so they try to prevent dumb fuks from doing. Similar to not putting multiple N wires under screws, using staples and box connectors.
Its a rule regarding the workmanship and method.

 

[sberry]

I see some old jobs from 3o's. The installer must have spent an apprenticeship back then before moving to a small town along with the electric.

 

[sberry]

The handyman does all these little things you take for stupid and wonder about cause he never read the book where it said not to.

 

[sberry]

Does it really need an explanation to say bury it 18 or 24 and easier to allow some exceptions under certain conditions. About the only thing that has been fundamentally changed in my lifetime in the area is allowing gfci protected circuits at a foot. Some of these code and methods been in place a long time.
Protect the wire, where to drill and staple and how big some fuses need to be and some fundamental wire sizes been around since they invented the light bulb. Today with eco codes we can have more stuff with slightly less peak over a bit more time.
Not so many 1800 watt heaters out there like chore heaters of past or like a large oven on a dedicated.
Many moons ago a guy got scalded in a shower if someone flushed. Today the same pipe that was barely adequate in 1970 can feed 2 baths and never notic it, low flow shower and a stool that uses 1/4 the water over the same or longer time frame. Water slam isn't the issue it was. Most home owners are not filling tanks or irrigating and the object isn't to use as much as they can.

 

[sberry]

A 20A is ideal for the fact that the loads in residential come thru a 15 end and it gives a bit of head room for a lamp and motor starts without nuisance trips.