Roof time - help!

[BigE]

I need to put a roof on my house and my garage is attached so I guess it counts. I've been quoted some pretty high numbers ($5500+ for basic shingles) to roof this house so I'm looking for suggestions. One guy told me he'd cut me a break if I could find a better deal on shingles. I have a friend who owns a hardware store and will pass on his deal to me so I may go that route. I've attached an aerial view of my house so you can see what I'm working with. I believe the roof to be original which would make it 23 years old. The granules are literally washing off the shingles and I can see fiberglass threads all over the roof. The house is only 1 story and less than 1600 square feet so I can't see why it would be very expensive to do. I'm looking for any recommendations on how to go about this, methods to use and, most importantly, MATERIALS! If you have a recommendation on shingles, I'm all ears. I've been told dimensional is better, but I'm not sold that it's worth the cost over traditional. Additionally, any advice on the chimney, the chimney top (rusted) and sealing around where it connects to the roof would also be appreciated.

Thanks!

 

[what have i done]

probably not to bad of a price. Did they say how many square they will need for the shingles.
My house is a 2 story outside dimensions are 28x87 with the garage. We had some hail damage here so I turned into insurance. I was quoted $7700 for fiberglass dimensional shingles with a 30 yr warranty...thank god for insurance in a case like this.

i was told around here a rule of thumb is to figure $250 per square. hope that helps

 

[Steevo]

I am guessing that is about a 1500 sq ft house, plus garage?
I think $5500 for good quality 30-year asphalt shingles is a fair and reasonable price, IF it includes removing the old roofing and starting with fresh new tar paper. If it is an overlay, that is too high, and not a good idea.

 

[Junkman]

Around the North East, most homes are now using the Architectural Shingles, since there are no tabs to line up, they go up faster and look better. The slight additional cost is offset by less labor. The reason that roofing is so expensive is the liability and workers compensation insurance. You can put one shingle layer over the original layer, and if you are not planning on staying there another 20 or 30 years, I would do this. It cost a lot to strip a roof, and if the underlayment (plywood) is sound, there is no need. I also prefer to have it hand nailed, rather than stapled. Don't skimp on shingle quality, since the labor is just about the same for cheap shingles vs. the best.

 

[Falcon67]

Our 1460 sq/ft house was $6500 in 1999 for complete tear off and re-do. The cedar shakes under the shingles was in bad shape, so that added another $1500 to rip that off and re-deck. $5500 today from a company with references seems pretty reasonable if it's tear off to the deck, re-paper and shingle.

As for materials - how often do you get hail storms in AL? If not very often or never, get the best shingle you can buy or go metal. If it's like here where we get the **** beat out of our stuff every 8-10 years (some place within 100 miles of here gets baseball sized hail every spring and golf ball hail is pretty common), buy the cheapest fiberglass shingle you can get and spend your $$$ on replacement coverage insurance. We're on our second roof since 1997 and haven't paid much for one yet.

 

[BigE]

Not a whole lot of hail here in Alabama although I have seen it before.

Perhaps I should bargain with the contractor to remove the old roof myself? I'm more than willing to do some work, especially if it's not something very delicate, like demo. I'm already going to pull the gutters myself (replacing those, too). There maybe some water damage to fix as I can see where there was a somewhat substantial leak in the corner of the garage at some point. The contractor will take care of this as well.

Any recommendations on particular shingles? I need to give my hardware guy a model to quote.

 

[RoofDude]

As a professional roofing contractor it would be easy to tag my opinion as bias. Although, having said that, it appears you have a competitive bid to do your project. That would be very inexpensive here. Your home may only be 1600sq ft but your roof has considerably more square footage. A hip roof like yours has plenty of "waste" on it as well. (I personally love the look of a hip roof).

A word of caution would be to make sure you hire a competent roofer. They are rarely the least expensive option. Although, the easiest on the wallet in the long run. I can't tell ya how many reroofs I do a year on homes that have been roofed within the last 5-10yrs.

Best bet on your chimney is to have a new cap fabricated. Your roofer should be able to handle this or at least lead you in the right direction.

Most all of the shingle roofs we do today are laminate shingles. They certainly hold up to winter conditions better. Having said that, I believe your best money spent will be on hiring a good contractor. A competent roofer can install a great roof that will last a long time regardless of the material used. Remember that your roof protects your entire investment. Going cheap can cost alot of money down the road.

 

[RoofDude]

I forgot to add..... my own home is a split entry bi-level. 1100sq ft per level, with a 630sq ft garage. My entire roof is 3450sq ft.

 

[ddawg16]

I think RoodDude is giving you some straight Info.....

I did my roof myself about 5 years ago....I will NEVER do that again....

My roof design is very similar to yours.....a lot of hips.....what is not obvious is that everywhere there is a hip, you have to cut the shingle at an angle....translation...more work and more waste....and you have a lot more ridge shingles....lot more....

I had about $2700 into my roof.....it cost me $800 in labor for tear off....$600 for the skip to hold all the trash.....and a lot of work....in my case I had to replace a lot of damaged and rotted wood....basically, the first row of eves and all of the facia board.

And my house is only 1026 sq ft....

So....your quote sounds very fair....but I would get at least 2 more.....and ask for references....and ask little questions....like...does the price include all drip flashing? Does he use valley flashing? (he should in my opinion)

And.....I vote highly for the dimensional shingles....not that much more...maybe 10-15%...but it looks so much better....and they actually loast a bit longer....and don't show flaws and wear and tear as bad....trust me.....much better choice....

BTW....nice looking roof line....

 

[tatra]

roof dude, could you give us a list of questions to ask?.........such as how much per square, ice and water shield, etc.............may be looking at a new roof myself and did it myself last time and that ain't gonna happen again............

 

[BigE]

Roofdude/ddawg,

Thanks for your comments. I have gotten 3 bids over the last several months. 4200, 5500 and 5700, but I feel the 4200 and 5700 are too old to consider current. I have a connection to all 3 of these roofers so I feel they are all capable. Having read your comments, I am inclined to go with Mr. 5500. He quoted me 6500 for dimensional and he lives in the neighborhood. In fact, he built the entire neighborhood with the exception of my house and one other. I guess things have just gone up in the last several years. My parents had their house roofed for 3400 several years ago. Another friend had his done for 3600 several years ago. Both houses are much bigger than mine, but are not hip roof. I guess I just need to **** it up and pay it.

Thanks for the input, GJ. I'm open to more as I'm always looking to learn.

 

[BigE]

Also, can you walk on a dimensional roof the same as a traditional? Will it cause damage or cause you to slip?

 

[Kevin54]

In our neck of the woods prices average roughly $100/sq. for a nailover and $200/sq. for a tearoff. That is for standard 3-tab. Dimensionals run material cost difference higher.

 

[RoofDude]

roof dude, could you give us a list of questions to ask?.........such as how much per square, ice and water shield, etc.............may be looking at a new roof myself and did it myself last time and that ain't gonna happen again............

No Problem. Before I get to the questions you should ask, let me comment on the question you shouldn't ask

Never ask the roofer how much per square. It immediately puts you into "that" category of potential clients. The tire kicker/tight azz (fair or not). Most jobs are by the job basis anyways. Very rarely, are two homes exactly the same with the exact same details. Most people who's first question is "How much per square" are the pita type clients anyways. It isnt too difficult to figure out if it is a must know on your agenda. The area of your roof divided by 100 = square (100sq ft). Although, most homes escpecially hip roofs require more material than the exact square footage of the roof plan.

Questions I would ask:
1. How long have you been in business...? Alot of people hire Noobs or less experienced pros. Typically it is a way to save some money but, can be quite the risk in the event of a problem down the road. Something like 90% of start up roofing contractors fold up shop within 5yrs. 80% of the remaining in the next 5yrs. It is a tough business. Im more comfortable as a consumer doing a major expense with a company that has proven they will be around. Not to say they arent a risk either but seem to be less of a risk.

2. Insurance & Workmens Comp.....? Do you carry liability Insurance, and Workmens compensation coverage for your employees....? Any reputable company carries these insurances, & will have no problem proving to you that they do. Many a homeowner has found out the hard way what can happen when a hired contractor does not have these coverages.

3. References....? May I see some of your work...? Ask for several jobs to drive by & see for yourself. I prefer to see some that are similar to my home. Recently installed is okay, as it shows how they clean up, & what impact they had on the surrounding landscaping, etc.. although, I'd like to see at least one that was several years old. Again, any reputable contractor will have no problem showing his work. Most take pride in it & will happily meet this request.

4. Why...? This is important. Ask why..? Have your contractor explain everything to you. Most of us prefer an informed client. It is much more pleasant to speak with, and or work for someone who "cares" about what is going on his home. It also will give you great insight into the knowledge of the person you are interviewing. Have him explain in detail, how he is going to perform the job from start to finish.

5. Warranty...? Everyone who installs quality anything stands behind their work. How long is his labor warranty...? NOT the mfgs material warranty, his labor warranty. What is covered...? For how long...? Everybody makes mistakes, people of high character/work ethic make it right, and dont pass the buck.

6. Scheduling...? How long will this project take..? When will it be done..? Fair questions. Keep in mind weather can alter both of these. If you have a "two day job", ya want them scheduling it with multiple good days of weather. I wouldnt want my roof torn off today, with threat of rain tommorrow. Things happen....!? In the event there are some unforseen problems, you want them to have time to repair them not hurry & cover em up to prepare for adverse weather.

7. Variables. Know up front, how much sheeting repairs/replacement will be. It happens. Your roof may have never had an interior leak, or any signs of leakage to your eye. However, your eaves are rotten, your fascia board is toast, etc... You want to know up front how much per sheet, or how much per square foot for sheeting replacement/carpentry work. Last thing you want is an open-ended change order for a contractor to make christmas for his family cause you have no pre agreed terms for additional repair work that is needed. Or be pressured into spending alot more money because they "have to get this roof watertight". If you arent home, or cant see for yourself, request that the contractor photgraphs the damage, and or replacement for you to see. That way there is no discrepency... its called keeping honest people honest.

8. Payment. Be sure that you both fully understand the payment arrangements/agreement, for obvious reasons.

Lastly, be a real world person. Dont have unrealistic expectations. Let's face it, having a roof redone can be very nerve racking for some. It is noisy, strange men will be at your home, in your attic, all over your yard. It can certainly be an uncomfortable experience. In the event you have rotten wood, or underlying issues with your home, remember it isnt your roofers fault He's there to fix it

By interviewing several people, you should get a good feel for who you trust with what is for most of us, our most valuable investment.... our home. I make alot of buying decisions based on my gut. By asking alot of questions, you'll understand who you are dealing with. You'll be able to tell, who the real professionals are, and who the pretenders are.

If you have any more questions, just ask. Im sure I left a few things out. Just typing some quick thoughts while eating lunch. I have a job to get back to

 

[RoofDude]

Also, can you walk on a dimensional roof the same as a traditional? Will it cause damage or cause you to slip?

Yes you can walk on them. You wont slip on laminate shingles any more than you would on 3-tabs. Depends on the pitch. The steeper, the more "slippery". You should avoid walking on them when its real hot though, as high temps make shingles..... "gooey". You can scar them easily in high temps.

 

[srmofo]

^ he makes some good points. I helped do my buddies roof this summer, then the roof over my porch, then my new garage roof last weekend. I got more experience than I cared for this summer.

2/3 needed new sheeting. The only thing I would add is that you need to prepare for sheeting damage and have the money available. If its as old as you think it is, I would almost guarentee that something is gonna need replaced. This is even more true if the attic isnt properly vented

 

[Shocker]

Thanks for all that info RoofDude. Much appreciated!

 

[BWS]

The thing to me is the look......yeah,yeah,warrenty shmorrenty.The shingle manuf. is gonna pro-rate and basically do everything in their pwr to screw you.Hire an established roofer and the labor/workmanship is rarely an issue.It boils down to looks.........Around here(mnts of Va),a new subdivision goes up and they put the same colour shingle on every freakin house?

The roof represents such a large area of design landscape,if you will.....do your homework WRT colour and style.I really like the architect series.They're way more rigid than the old azz 3-tab.I wouldn't however spring for the stupid high-$ architects....thats warrenty BS.I'd be inclined to go with what roof cont. recomends,balancing the cost/warrenty aspect.

We have Hunter Green standing seam metal fr with a "weather wood" coloured arch. series rr.When I built the house 25 years ago we put shadow black 3-tabs on and they look like S**T.At the time just didn't realize how important this design feature was.Best of luck,BW

 

[sharage71]

On my 24 x 30. I paid 40 per square labor. I bought the arch shingles,paper,button tabs, and coil nails. End up around 120.00 per square. 10 squares.

 

[ddawg16]

We need a section where we can keep good info.....Thanks RoofDude....this one thread should be a keeper.....

Two other things to add....

Warranty....when I was buying my shingles I asked the guy if I should go 30 or 40 year.....his reply..."After 25 years you are going to be tired of that roof anyway."

Dirt....unless you have plywood or OSB, and your doing a tear off....your attic will be a mess.....my roof is 1x6's....with just enough space between the planks to let about a ton of the shingle gravel through....in retrospect I wish I had covered the floor of my attic with plastic.....clean up would have been a lot easier...

On one last thing.....and I'm sure RoofDude would agree.....if your doing tear off...let the roofer do it....in most cases, his total cost will be about the same or less than if you got your own tear off crew and then paid him just for the roof....it also eliminates the 'schedual' issues that can arrise....

 

[porschedude996TT]

To give you an idea what it would cost to do it yourself. I roofed my shop (30'x40') with a simple 6/12 gable roof with some help from my two nephews. Materials were $2000 (28 squares) and I paid them by the hour which cost me $600. I installed the drip edge and laid the #30 felt. I let the nephews install the shingles. Material was delivered to the top of the building by the roofing supplier.

If you can find some good help doing side jobs, you can save some money. The guy that delivered the material to the top of the building asked if I had someone to do the job (He said he roofed for 15 years). I asked his price and he wanted $500 to $600 to do the job.