Rough inspection: Outlets "made up"?

[54FordPanel]

I am in the midst of getting my new kitchen rough electrical inspection. The inspector told my builder that I must have me electrical outlets "made up", and I can't get a good idea of what that means.
Right now I have all my wires run, and the Romax coiled up in the boxes with the name of what I want to do with that wire written in magic marker on the sheath.

Can somebody explain to me what a outlet that is made up should look like?

 

[Norcal]

It means all the boxes must be made up, grounding conductors, & others must be ready for installation of devices at trim out.

 

[avc8130]

I am in the midst of getting my new kitchen rough electrical inspection. The inspector told my builder that I must have me electrical outlets "made up", and I can't get a good idea of what that means.
Right now I have all my wires run, and the Romax coiled up in the boxes with the name of what I want to do with that wire written in magic marker on the sheath.

Can somebody explain to me what a outlet that is made up should look like?

Condense your grounds down to a single lead to install on the outlet (either with greenie wire nut or ground clips).
If you plan on pig-tailing, do that now. If not, cut each wire to proper length, cap each wire individually and coil neatly in the boxes.

 

[MrMark]

It means that a guy could come in with only a screwdriver and maybe a needle nose to form the wires and make up the outlets. The process of installing the outlets then goes quickly and is called trim out. Wires should be stripped, labeled (if necessary with a piece of romex slipped over the wire) pigtailed, the box grounded, if metal, with ground pigtail available for the device(s), and all the wires folded accordian style neatly in the box . . .

Edit: are you sure he didn't say the "boxes" should be made up? Outlets "made up" implies to me that he wants outlets installed. I guess you would just hook them up and leave them hanging loose in the box.

 

[54FordPanel]

Ok, I get the ground wires. I'm going strip the outside insulation off the romex, and bring all the grounds together with a copper sleeve, and crimp it, and leave a long enough tail to hit the outlet or switch. Right?

When you say "strip the wires", do you mean make some copper show? Or just the outside sheath?

Then should my neutrals be wired nutted together, or loosely tagged together, or what?

If I'm putting a outlet in the box, and planning on my outlet being my method of splicing, how should I treat the hots? Bundled together under a loose piece of tape?

Edit: are you sure he didn't say the "boxes" should be made up? Outlets "made up" implies to me that he wants outlets installed. I guess you would just hook them up and leave them hanging loose in the box.

Unfortunately, I wasn't here when he was here, so I'm getting all this second-hand. But I'm almost positive he doesn't want any switches or outlets installed.

 

[MrMark]

Ok, I get the ground wires. I'm going strip the outside insulation off the romex, and bring all the grounds together with a copper sleeve, and crimp it, and leave a long enough tail to hit the outlet or switch. Right?

Right, that's fine

When you say "strip the wires", do you mean make some copper show? Or just the outside sheath?

copper showing for me but maybe not necessary at this stage

Then should my neutrals be wired nutted together, or loosely tagged together, or what?

yes, and pigtailed, provided of course that there is only one cirucit in the box

If I'm putting a outlet in the box, and planning on my outlet being my method of splicing, how should I treat the hots? Bundled together under a loose piece of tape?

I would never do that, but yes that would work if you are going that route



Unfortunately, I wasn't here when he was here, so I'm getting all this second-hand. But I'm almost positive he doesn't want any switches or outlets installed.

see bold above

 

[54FordPanel]

If I'm putting a outlet in the box, and planning on my outlet being my method of splicing, how should I treat the hots? Bundled together under a loose piece of tape?

I would never do that, but yes that would work if you are going that route

You would never use an outlet as a "splice"? Is it better to wire nut all the hot leads together, and then run a pigtail to feed the outlet? I can do it either way, but I prefer to do it the right way. I'm open to whatever is correct.

 

[MrMark]

You would never use an outlet as a "splice"? Is it better to wire nut all the hot leads together, and then run a pigtail to feed the outlet? I can do it either way, but I prefer to do it the right way. I'm open to whatever is correct.

the pigtailed is the preferred way to go.

 

[54FordPanel]

Ok, then on the switches, I would have the grounds together, the neutrals wire-nutted together, and the hot line and the hot load stripped back 1/2", and Z'd up into the box....is that right?

On the outlets, grounds done, neutrals wire nutted with one pigtail, and the hots wire nutted with one pigtail that has been stripped enough to terminate on the outlet....right?

Also, from what I can gather from the 'net, they want the grounds and neutrals connected at the breaker panel. So should I do that and leave the hot leads dangling? Or hook up the hots to breakers, with the breakers turned off?

 

[avc8130]

For switches you will need ground to each switch. Neutrals are tied (assuming 1 circuit). Hot and load stripped, wire nutted and placed neatly.

Plan for outlets sound good. Wire nut ANY bare white/black.

You want it "safe" to flip the breaker on because it COULD happen accidentally.

Hots on the breakers properly, breaker flipped off.
ac

 

[MrMark]

Ok, then on the switches, I would have the grounds together, the neutrals wire-nutted together, and the hot line and the hot load stripped back 1/2", and Z'd up into the box....is that right?

right with nuts on the two hots (line and load).

On the outlets, grounds done, neutrals wire nutted with one pigtail, and the hots wire nutted with one pigtail that has been stripped enough to terminate on the outlet....right?

right and put a nut on the end of the pig tails too for safety at least that's what I would do

Also, from what I can gather from the 'net, they want the grounds and neutrals connected at the breaker panel. So should I do that and leave the hot leads dangling? Or hook up the hots to breakers, with the breakers turned off?

I would hook the hot to the breaker with the breaker off

Basically what avc said.

 

[tfi racing]

I wouldn't recommend the final stripping of your conductor's ends that will be attached to the devices at the rough in stage.They will likely get covered in drywall mud,paint and who knows what else,and you will have to strip or clean them off at the finishing stage.

 

[54FordPanel]

Thanks for the help everybody.

 

[Aceman]

Here in Oregon we're required to make up the grounds only and the rest of the wires get stuffed back in the box. We take it a step further and make up our pigtails and stuff them back in the box, but it's not required at rough in inspection.

The "hot" can't be landed on a breaker yet.

I can't understand why you'd want to prestrip the wires just to cover them with a wirenut. That's just adding extra steps....

 

[MrMark]

Here in Oregon we're required to make up the grounds only and the rest of the wires get stuffed back in the box. We take it a step further and make up our pigtails and stuff them back in the box, but it's not required at rough in inspection.

The "hot" can't be landed on a breaker yet.

I can't understand why you'd want to prestrip the wires just to cover them with a wirenut. That's just adding extra steps....

Yeah, I can see that is not needed if you are not hooking up the hot. I have always hooked up the hot so that is why I would put the nuts on. But, either way it doesn't really matter unless you are in the business and trying to make up tons.

 

[presidentsdad]

Hey all, sorry to revive an OLLLLDDDDD thread, but it seems most appropriate to my current situation.

Project: Putting in a Sub Panel in my outdoor shed, running 40 amp service from my main box, under ground, to the shed.

I just got my permit for this, but since I have never actually gotten a permit for work, I'm not 100% certain of the process for getting ready for the "rough" inspection. Usually, if I'm just adding an outlet, I do the work and move on, so no permit or inspection necessary.

I assume that I'll need to do the following to the wires coming from the new sub panel: Condense my grounds down to a single lead (either with greenie wire nut or ground clips). Then for the Hots and Neutrals: strip, wind, pig-tail, then cap each pigtail individually and coil neatly in the boxes. Is this correct? (seems to be from the above discussion)


Additional question: for the rough inspection, what do I need to do with the circuit breaker in the main panel and the wire from the main panel to the new sub panel? I assume connect and wire them, but don't energize it. This is mainly where I need the help/expertise from the group.


Additional Info: I'll be using #8 3 conductor with ground UF wire from the box to the panel in a 24 inch deep trench with conduit protect the entry and exit points down to 24 inches. Overall distance is about 115 feet, so #8 is needed.

 

[Norcal]

You posed this question at the Mike Holt forum, any DIY questions will be locked as soon as a mod notices it or it's been reported, the same thing occurs at Electrician Talk also.

 

[rburke65]

The electrical outlets must be ready to have the outlets attached. All spliced...pig tails....ready for theoutlets.....so the inspector can SEE the connections....aka made up.

 

[presidentsdad]

You posed this question at the Mike Holt forum, any DIY questions will be locked as soon as a mod notices it or it's been reported, the same thing occurs at Electrician Talk also.

Is this forum also only for professionals? I didn't realize the Mike Holt one was, so I asked the mod to close that question and remove my account over there.

 

[presidentsdad]

The electrical outlets must be ready to have the outlets attached. All spliced...pig tails....ready for theoutlets.....so the inspector can SEE the connections....aka made up.

That part I get. The part I'm fuzzy on was later in the post.

Additional question: for the rough inspection, what do I need to do with the circuit breaker in the main panel and the wire from the main panel to the new sub panel? I assume connect and wire them, but don't energize it. This is mainly where I need the help/expertise from the group.

 

[presidentsdad]

bump...any help with the last question above?

 

[benjamintmiller]

Yes, connect the wires to the circuit breakers and leave them off. If you pigtail and wire nut any wire not used yet, you can energize a few of them for temporary power and lighting. Label them and make the panel neat and the inspector will be happy with your work.

Here's one I recently did, pictured at rough inspection:

 

[presidentsdad]

Yes, connect the wires to the circuit breakers and leave them off. If you pigtail and wire nut any wire not used yet, you can energize a few of them for temporary power and lighting. Label them and make the panel neat and the inspector will be happy with your work.

Here's one I recently did, pictured at rough inspection:

Thanks. I really appreciate the feedback!

 

[Norcal]

bump...any help with the last question above?

Make up the feeder in the panel and the grounded (neutral ) and grounding conductors, mark what wire goes to each breaker so when the time comes to trim out you can install the circuit breakers and connect them to the correct branch circuit.

 

[mm08822]

Landing wires on cb’s, means you lose control on what is turned on. Everybody loves to turn on cb’s to make something work.
Although it may be fun to shock the drywallers for destroying boxes/wiring, inspectors do not like being shocked if by chance they happen to get close enough to any box.

Make up the grounds and neutrals in the panel. Put the breakers in and just be ready to land wires on each cb. They want to see gfci cb’s, afci’s, etc. They’ll know within 5’ of the panel if there is a concern.

 

[anythingyoucanimagine]

I am not electrician. I have rewired two houses (nec2017) as permitted homeowner and doing third currently.


The way I've done it is as described in this thread. Get everything ready so a handyman/apprentice with a screwdriver can put all the devices (switches, receptacles, etc.) in.


The way I understand a rough inspection is that inspector wants to see that everything is done properly --as if it were complete/finished and energized. So the whole "made up" thing is inspector wanting to see whatever you are going to do with it all hooked up: crimps, wire nuts, pigtails, etc. as if there were devices in the box. That means that the entire circuit is "ready to go". Which also means that a circuit could be accidentally energized by flipping a breaker, which is why the back-and-forth over stripping & wire nuts at the boxes or don't strip and (?? tape, wire nut, do nothing) or leave not attached in panel, etc.


Both roughs I've been through the inspector wanted to see the main panel completely done. Not sure why, but inspector wanted to see main panel DONE. For full disclosure, I had temp power during that time so panel I was working in didn't have entrance wires in the mast and no meter.


There are a LOT of legit sparkys on this forum as well as a bunch of non-electricians who have probably forgotten more than I know.


If I were doing a sub panel within line of sight of the main panel I would hook everything up inside main panel, run all the wires to sub panel, bend and cut them to length but not strip off the jackets. Then I'd probably tape or wire nut & tape the ends of the conductors. and go about wiring the rest of the sub panel's circuits.


If the sub panel was not within line of sight of the main panel, I'd put a lockout switch next to or within line of sight of the main panel and do as I described above, breaker in main panel off, conductors hooked up in main panel, inside lockout box I'd measure & cut to length but not strip jackets and either tape or nut and tape the conductors. Then I'd hook everything else up (conductors going to sub panel at both ends) and go from there. I'd also lock the lockout box.


Personally that's what I would do. They want to see that everything is done and ready to go so you need to take precaution that stuff can't be accidentally turned on.


If I'm wrong hopefully someone will correct me.

 

[presidentsdad]

Landing wires on cb’s, means you lose control on what is turned on. Everybody loves to turn on cb’s to make something work.
Although it may be fun to shock the drywallers for destroying boxes/wiring, inspectors do not like being shocked if by chance they happen to get close enough to any box.

Make up the grounds and neutrals in the panel. Put the breakers in and just be ready to land wires on each cb. They want to see gfci cb’s, afci’s, etc. They’ll know within 5’ of the panel if there is a concern.

That's what I was thinking. Thanks to everyone for the advise!

 

[teamextreme]

I assume that I'll need to do the following to the wires coming from the new sub panel: Condense my grounds down to a single lead (either with greenie wire nut or ground clips). Then for the Hots and Neutrals: strip, wind, pig-tail, then cap each pigtail individually and coil neatly in the boxes. Is this correct? (seems to be from the above discussion)
Correct, however the hots and neutrals don't need to be stripped, nor would I recommend it, to avoid mud, paint, construction muck from getting on the copper. They also don't need to be capped, since they won't or shouldn't be energized. That could potentially be a ****-load of wire nuts just to cap things off. I've never seen that done

Additional question: for the rough inspection, what do I need to do with the circuit breaker in the main panel and the wire from the main panel to the new sub panel? I assume connect and wire them, but don't energize it. This is mainly where I need the help/expertise from the group.
Correct, feeder circuit breaker to the subpanel should be left off. You can land the wires on the breaker.

See red comments above.

 

[anythingyoucanimagine]

Can I follow up and ask y'all a question:

I've been using adjustable boxes. Any reason not to do that? Lets me crank them all the way into the stud cavity for drywall and finish work and then (usually) no mud rings. I realize as non-pro/homeowner I don't really care about the extra cost. Any other issues long-term with using those boxes?

Have been using these boxes except different brand:

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Carlon-...with-Adjustable-Bracket-B121ADJ-40R/202077339

Thanks.

 

[benjamintmiller]

No reason not to use adjustable boxes, except they're expensive and not necessary for new construction.

You don't need mud rings unless you need metal boxes (such as in Chicago) or need a double box for box fill reasons but only want a single device cover plate. Around here, everyone just nails plastic boxes to the joists and the drywallers rotozip around them. Personally, I like the thicker plastic boxes so that my rotozip doesn't chew through them. They're a bit more expensive but still much less than adjustables.

 

[teamextreme]

The biggest drawback to adjustable is the price, but if you're not a contractor and don't care about that, I think they're awesome, especially for instances where the wall covering is thick. And they allow you to perfectly set the box depth after the walls are up because with the nail-ons no matter how careful you are or how many bazillion you've nailed on, it seems there's always one or two that you mess up the depth. So it would be especially helpful for a rookie in that regard.

 

[PugetDude]

Yes, connect the wires to the circuit breakers and leave them off. If you pigtail and wire nut any wire not used yet, you can energize a few of them for temporary power and lighting. Label them and make the panel neat and the inspector will be happy with your work.

Here's one I recently did, pictured at rough inspection:

Nice neat panel. I usually label the wires with a fine-tip Sharpie on ~inch of cut-off sheathing on the hot just in front of the breaker INSIDE the box; makes it easier to identify circuits later when the mud dogs get done rocking over the exposed wiring.

 

[benjamintmiller]

Nice neat panel. I usually label the wires with a fine-tip Sharpie on ~inch of cut-off sheathing on the hot just in front of the breaker INSIDE the box; makes it easier to identify circuits later when the mud dogs get done rocking over the exposed wiring.

The electrician that wired my house did that, but I'm not a huge fan because it takes up a lot of the space in the box. I recently got some heat shrink tape for my labelmaker, so when I decide to be really **** about the next panel I'll use that.

 

[Radix2]

Can I follow up and ask y'all a question:

I've been using adjustable boxes. Any reason not to do that? Lets me crank them all the way into the stud cavity for drywall and finish work and then (usually) no mud rings. I realize as non-pro/homeowner I don't really care about the extra cost. Any other issues long-term with using those boxes?

Have been using these boxes except different brand:

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Carlon-...with-Adjustable-Bracket-B121ADJ-40R/202077339

Thanks.

One other thing you watch out for is that those boxes are extremely tight for some GFCI outlets at the side. Check what you are using especially in double boxes