Round box for receptacle?

[Raisedonadeere]

I am installing some receptacles in metal liner ceiling. I can easily and accurately make a 4" or what ever size is needed to make a hole in the metal ceiling for these receptacles, square holes much tougher with tools I have. For one hole I would just use the oscillating tool and gut it out but I have several and I don't want it to look like **** when I am done.

But I am not aware of a round box that will mount a standard duplex receptacle. Is there such an animal? Or am I missing the trick here. Any ideas would be appreciated.

 

[sparky 1971]

Check out the Arlington FSC3227R box. It's an old work receptacle box that fits in a 3-1/4" round hole. Will require a jumbo plate to cover the hole. I have never used one, so I can't be much more help. If I were to guess, I wouldn't think it would work with just the metal pan. It will probably require some backer behind the metal to mount it into,

 

[Lightning rod]

Yes, there is
https://www.lowes.com/pd/RACO-1-Gang-Round-Metal-Electrical-Box-Cover/3179239

And

https://www.homedepot.com/p/RACO-4-in-Octagon-Cover-for-Duplex-Receptacle-731/100142391

 

[Shiftless]

Yes, there is
https://www.lowes.com/pd/RACO-1-Gang-Round-Metal-Electrical-Box-Cover/3179239

And

https://www.homedepot.com/p/RACO-4-in-Octagon-Cover-for-Duplex-Receptacle-731/100142391

I’m not a sparky, but that one might not meet current code. If you are subject to inspection. I wouldn’t assume you’ll pass. Check with your governing body.

406.4 Receptacle Mounting.
(C) Receptacles Mounted on Covers. Receptacles mounted to and supported by a cover shall be held rigidly against the cover by more than one screw or shall be a device assembly or box cover listed and identified for securing by a single screw.

Does anybody have experience with those one hole covers passing inspection? Can we just ASSUME since Lowe’s and others sell them that they are acceptable for new work?

.

 

[Raisedonadeere]

I’m not a sparky, but that one might not meet current code. If you are subject to inspection. I wouldn’t assume you’ll pass. Check with your governing body.

406.4 Receptacle Mounting.
(C) Receptacles Mounted on Covers. Receptacles mounted to and supported by a cover shall be held rigidly against the cover by more than one screw or shall be a device assembly or box cover listed and identified for securing by a single screw.

Does anybody have experience with those one hole covers passing inspection? Can we just ASSUME since Lowe’s and others sell them that they are acceptable for new work?

.

I see that there would be a problem with that one screw leaving the receptacle largely unsupported from the push pull plugging into it. In fact I recall seeing some done using a plate like that in a farm milk room where the receptacle was breaking apart, dangerous to say the least.

I suppose I will have to decide how I am going to cut those holes square.


OTOH maybe some of you could suggest how to use a surface mount box fed with some armored cable through small hole drilled into the sheet metal and anchoring to the sheet metal with a connector of appropriate type for connecting to metal boxes? Doesn't have the look I wanted but basically I just want to get it done and inspected.

 

[tyme2par4]

I’m not a sparky, but that one might not meet current code. If you are subject to inspection. I wouldn’t assume you’ll pass. Check with your governing body.

406.4 Receptacle Mounting.
(C) Receptacles Mounted on Covers. Receptacles mounted to and supported by a cover shall be held rigidly against the cover by more than one screw or shall be a device assembly or box cover listed and identified for securing by a single screw.

Does anybody have experience with those one hole covers passing inspection? Can we just ASSUME since Lowe’s and others sell them that they are acceptable for new work?

.

If you look at the Home Depot product page, it say's "meets UL and CSA Compliance."
That would lead me to believe it is a "box cover listed and identified for securing by a single screw."
You would want to make sure you use a heavier duty outlet as well. The screw holes on the cheap outlets are usually a bit flimsy, but spec-grade outlets are built stronger.

 

[cybrdyke]

Plastic:
Carlon BH614R Cut a 3-1/2 hole
Carlon B618RR Cut a 4" hole
Steel:
Garvin 45141-OWBX
Raco 150
Cover:
Raco 731

If the receptacle is mounted to the box, then you can use the one-screw cover.
CD

 

[sberry]

Asking how to do doesn't make it a good way. Take a recept box, draw around it, nice sharp line. Punch a hole with a saw or a step bit then cut them with a snips, you can get red and green, they are both worth having but I do most with red and with just a little practice can be precision. Cut a little ruff if you have to and trim exactly. They can be made nearly perfect.

 

[sberry]

I have made then nearly perfect. Measure and cut oft leaves them not right but I measure, drill a hole with a step bit. Install the sheet, leave it a little loose and then cope with snips right around it. Cut it to fit. You can break the mounting ears off the recept or cut a couple smiles out top and bottom to be able to remove the device.

 

[ripperd]

Seems to me A jigsaw with a metal blade would work fine to cut out a square. Drill a hole near a corner to start so you don't have to plunge the blade.

 

[sberry]

Snips.

 

[alfredeneuman]

I’m not a sparky, but that one might not meet current code. If you are subject to inspection. I wouldn’t assume you’ll pass. Check with your governing body.

There is one that already has the receptacle in it (I don't have a link, sorry) that is UL listed as an assembly, and not subject to the "2 screws" rule

 

[Dumber than lumber]

Hole saw. Use a smaller one and overlap.

 

[Bert_]

I've done Romex a few times in buildings with tin on the inside.

I always surface mounted 4sq boxes. Use a Romex clamp so it pokes through behind the tin and keeps the wire away from any rough edges.

I've never liked the look of a flush mount box in tin

 

[Shiftless]

If you can get by with a single, here is one with an integral receptacle.

 

[sberry]

It would be a bit different if it was existing but since they got to be cut in anyway this is a good place to learn and he got more than one. Snips.

 

[sparky 1971]

I see that there would be a problem with that one screw leaving the receptacle largely unsupported from the push pull plugging into it. In fact I recall seeing some done using a plate like that in a farm milk room where the receptacle was breaking apart, dangerous to say the least.

I suppose I will have to decide how I am going to cut those holes square.


OTOH maybe some of you could suggest how to use a surface mount box fed with some armored cable through small hole drilled into the sheet metal and anchoring to the sheet metal with a connector of appropriate type for connecting to metal boxes? Doesn't have the look I wanted but basically I just want to get it done and inspected.

Just use a regular 4" square box. Drill a hole in the metal big enough for a Romex connector to fit through but not so big the box won't cover it. I will suggest getting something behind the metal to screw to though. Maybe go right next to the truss with the hole then screw the box through the metal and into the truss.

Flush mount boxes on ribbed metal look awful, but people want what they want.

 

[sberry]

I did some recent and with pole barn steel and good depth right in the center looked good.

 

[sparky 1971]

I did some recent and with pole barn steel and good depth right in the center looked good.

Surface mounted boxes always look better in pole barn type buildings. Raco even came out with a 4" square box that has the knockouts on two sides brought out so EMT will lay flat on the ribs without offsets. I did one building where the owner wanted flush boxes. After the tin installers got done butchering up the holes he was sorry. I had to use jumbo plates and even then some holes didn't cover.

 

[sberry]

I agree surface with a connector thru the sheet is good. Easy to install and might use a couple sheet metal screws to secure the box. I got nothing against a 1/4 bolt and nut either.

 

[Raisedonadeere]

Thanks for all the comments, many helpful comments, too many to acknowledge that hit the nail on the head one way or another in this discussion. I no longer want a round box that will have good cosmetics for mounting a receptacle. If they exist they are not very common LOL.

What I have settled on is to surface mount using the boxes that have knock outs on both ends and go through the metal with a nm connector. There are just too many ways it could come out crappy trying to get a good flush mount. With the surface mount I can take off anywhere I please later on to another location for a light or whatever as I work out how the garage will be used.

 

[Innovate1]

I have been thinking about this myself. Detached 30 x 40 with 14' ceilings. Considering doing a painted metal ceiling instead of drywall. But not used to working with steel roofing... Was thinking I wanted flush receptacles for lights but if I go with tin I am now thinking surface mount boxes with the wire coming out the back would be pretty easy. Put them on a truss with the wire coming up right beside and no extra backing needed. Was going to try to install boxes and wire before the ceiling went up and wondered how to locate boxes to land in the valleys but guessing I should place the boxes after tin. I could run wires to the approx box location and leave a bit extra. Then finish up the boxes after the tin is up. Was told by a local metal supplier they have a lighter gauge of material for interior use.

 

[Raisedonadeere]

I have, for purposes of moving on with the wiring, installed nail on receptacle boxes at the desired locations. I left enough loop in the cable to allow moving the box to the flats in the metal once it is installed. After a correcting a few mistakes I have learned it is easy to relocate a nail on box. With the metal in place I think it will be easy to locate the box precisely where I want it. Once I am in the attic locating the boxes I will make final decision on whether to mess with cutting the square holes or just run the wire through a small hole to feed surface mount boxes.