Running a paint gun off a smaller compressor?

[mike758]

My 1976 Dodge W100, which is sort of a project truck I bought, is in need of a new paint job as I have about 90% clear coat failure and there's some body work needed anyway. Shops in my area don't like doing paint, so most overcharge, plus real estate is pretty high, so the minimum for a paint job with no body work is $4,500. The other option would be Maaco which would be like $1,500, but I've heard so many horror stories about Maaco that I figured I'd rather try it myself.

Doing it myself, the feasibility really comes down to my air compressor. I have an older Craftsman 15 Gallon 3.5 HP (actually probably 1.5 HP) compressor, and a 3 Gallon 1.5 HP compressor. I was looking at an Eastwood spray gun that only needs 4 CFM @ 29 PSI which my bigger one can handle. The issue though is the fact that it's only a 15 gallon tank, so it will be constantly running which would cause heat and could possibly not hold pressure that long. The truck is only a single cab short bed, so it's not a whole lot of surface area, but it's still a lot. Buying an industrial size compressor is unrealistic because the one I have suits my usual needs, and this is only a one time thing. I was thinking of possibly running the smaller one in tandem with it, but that probably would be way more of a hassle then it's worth

 

[DTE]

I have painted cars with a worse setup than that when I was young, I am the one who says the only way to learn is do it. Now days everyone gets online and talks about all the reasons something won't work. You would need to break you truck up in sections which would be easy, so you can give your compressor a break. Maybe paint the tailgate , one bedside , the roof, etc.
Back in the day as they say a friend of mine had his airline coiled up in a pan of ice to fight the heat from a little compressor like you have. I have seen and done some nice paint work in less than desirable settings and I have seen some really bad work come out of some nice booths. So go for it. The first car I ever painted I was 18 and painted it in the driveway and it looked better than it did before.

 

[lilredex]

As DTE says...do it.

I have painted lots of stuff with a similar setup. The compressor is driven by a 2HP motor and the gun eats lots of air, but does a good job. If it is an extended job I put a fan on the compressor on hot days.

 

[DTE]

As DTE says...do it.

I have painted lots of stuff with a similar setup. The compressor is driven by a 2HP motor and the gun eats lots of air, but does a good job. If it is an extended job I put a fan on the compressor on hot days.

There ya go ! it must be a Chrysler thing. I still have the Sears compressor that I bought in 1977 and use it all the time as I am finishing up my new shop air supply.

 

[dnschmidt]

Well, everybody is entitled to a fantasy. I have a two stage 80 gallon 5 HP Quincy that puts out 17 CFM and when I use my SATA Nr2000 guns, HVLP for basecoat and RP for clearcoat, (these are notorious air hogs) it will barely keep up. I lay down one coat and while that flashes I let the compressor top off prior to starting the next coat. So have a go of it with that air nailer compressor but let me ask you this: The materials I use to do a complete repaint cost well over $800 to do a complete car. That's Epoxy Primer, 2K Primer-Surfacer, Basecoat, Clearcoat and the activators and reducers + thinners to clean the guns. I'm not willing to waste those products using a fly powered compressor unable to feed what my guns need.

The best low consumption gun available is the Iwata LPH400LV (cheap at $400 and relatively slow for a pro painter but capable of an outstanding finish) but the fact of the matter is that painting a car (and I always try my best to get a perfect finish) is an expensive undertaking. This is not a poor man's game.

 

[mike758]

Thank you guys, I guess everything is possible with the right amount of care and skill. I was considering doing it panel by panel as well. I did a lot of research on painting, and it really doesn't seem that bad with some practice. I've heard of so many issues with Maaco that my logic is I can't really do any worse

 

[mike758]

the fact of the matter is that painting a car (and I always try my best to get a perfect finish) is an expensive undertaking.

I've already ran the numbers and got the similar number of $800. The thing is though, I could be paying $1,500 for a job that might fail in a year, or $4,500 which is ultra expensive. I can consider keeping an eye out on Craigslist for bigger compressor, but my only concern is that the tanks are rusted

 

[JJThrasher]

I painted my sister and her husband's fence using a 3 gallon pancake compressor. I took some doing dialing in the settings and it ran nonstop for over two hours, but it did the job and came out ok.

 

[RV8guy]

I wouldn't use an HVLP gun for that project. You need an old school conventional spray gun. Devilbiss JGA, Binks 2001 or similar. Conventional uses less volume of air than HVLP. Ebay can be your friend here. I picked up a conventional spray Devilbiss gravity gun awhile back for $10. Be patient and know what your looking for and you can find a good deal. I would also get the slowest evaporating hot weather reducer that you can get. Get some retarder if you can. There will times that you have to wait for the little compressor to catch up.

 

[pepi]

Well, everybody is entitled to a fantasy. I have a two stage 80 gallon 5 HP Quincy that puts out 17 CFM and when I use my SATA Nr2000 guns, HVLP for basecoat and RP for clearcoat, (these are notorious air hogs) it will barely keep up. I lay down one coat and while that flashes I let the compressor top off prior to starting the next coat. So have a go of it with that air nailer compressor but let me ask you this: The materials I use to do a complete repaint cost well over $800 to do a complete car. That's Epoxy Primer, 2K Primer-Surfacer, Basecoat, Clearcoat and the activators and reducers + thinners to clean the guns. I'm not willing to waste those products using a fly powered compressor unable to feed what my guns need.

The best low consumption gun available is the Iwata LPH400LV (cheap at $400 and relatively slow for a pro painter but capable of an outstanding finish) but the fact of the matter is that painting a car (and I always try my best to get a perfect finish) is an expensive undertaking. This is not a poor man's game.

Here, here,............Iwata LPH400LV it sure is.

As to Maco more cars running around out there with those paint jobs than you may think. They paint a hell of a lot of cars, and if the OP is a first timer. Maco will have better results. Painting is the easiest and fastest part, it is the prep that cost. Yeah you heard a lot of stories, but have you seen any of those stories......

Painters/body men every penny .....................

 

[mike758]

The quotes I've been getting are for paint only. Body work plus paint is like $7,000-8,000. You're right, I haven't seen many Maaco jobs. My friend had two of his trucks done by them though, and he's had issues with flash rusting and clear coat failure and it's only been less than a few years. With that said, it's not terrible though. My truck was either a home job or a low cost one. There's a ton of fish eyes, and some areas weren't even primed.

 

[Zeke]

Run the 2 compressors at the same time with a tee connector.

 

[Waltc]

Why not join the 2 together and use a pressure regulator? Worked perfect for us before painting a semi trailer

 

[wait4me]

I painted a 33 foot sailboat with a 6 gallon pancake and a Wagner HVLP conversion gun. I'm not saying it was ideal, but it worked.

 

[larryq]

Regarding the OP's problem, I have the gun he's referring to-- the Eastwood Concours. It's ~$150 and includes a 1.2 tip, so you'll need to spend another $100 total for the 1.4 and 1.8 tips for Urethane basecoat and primer purposes.

I like the gun but the quoted specs (4 cfm @ 29 psi) they use aren't entirely real-world, if you want a good looking paint job. That said, it is pretty stingy with the air consumption and I've painted my dad's truck (1/2 at at time) with it using a 25 gal / 150 PSI, 6 cfm @ 90 psi Sears unit and it came out pretty good.

I had to watch the air inlet meter to make sure I didn't dip below 40psi (the recommended value from Eastwood) but I could spray for 20 seconds at a time before needing to pause, so you _can_ get by with it. One tip-- get some Milton hi-flow connectors for this project, since with your compressor setup you'll want every advantage you can get.

 

[Steve from Socal]

I painted my Cherokee, a single engine airplane with a Binks 62 and my 1.5 HP 20 gallon Jacuzzi compressor.

Most folks paint the roof of the cab first and tape it off, that really cuts the truck into manageable pieces.

Try some primer and see how it works, if it works great, if not plan B.

Steve

 

[L.Cheapo]

The quotes I've been getting are for paint only. Body work plus paint is like $7,000-8,000. You're right, I haven't seen many Maaco jobs. My friend had two of his trucks done by them though, and he's had issues with flash rusting and clear coat failure and it's only been less than a few years. With that said, it's not terrible though. My truck was either a home job or a low cost one. There's a ton of fish eyes, and some areas weren't even primed.

Back in the early-mid 90s my dad has his 88 Toyota pickup repainted by Maaco. The factory paint was ****, and what Maaco did was even worse. Within months it was flaking off. They redid it, and it lasted maybe 2 years before most of it flaked off again. That truck developed rot everywhere. It was still running and driving when he junked it, but if a fat guy jumped in the front of the bed, I guarantee the frame would have folded up like a taco.

 

[dogdog]

There is a youtube video on this topic putting the compressors in tandem (in this video it's two HF compressors)....
I had to adjust the cut-in pressure a little higher (might not stomach too well with some), from 90PSI-ish to 120-ish and tandem the two tank they are normally cut-off at 150 PSI-ish. and the two compressor on a different circuit breaker if you are using two compressors.... and make sure the two tanks can handle the max cutoff compressor PSIs.... say in my case , its cutoff is at 150 PSI.

but it dependents on the gun you are using.... The Devilbliss Finishline that I have won't do it even when I tandem two craftman compressor 33gal/15gal together to try and paint my roof last year.... had to resort to a buy gun design lower CFM. It worked out ok given the temp, condition I have to paint and no skill.

one more thing: Safety.... paint fumes are bad for you.... Clear coat fumes are even worse for your lungs. So make sure you wear a good proper respirator, otherwise you'll be feeling it after a few days when it does damages to your lungs.

 

[pepi]

The quotes I've been getting are for paint only. Body work plus paint is like $7,000-8,000. You're right, I haven't seen many Maaco jobs. My friend had two of his trucks done by them though, and he's had issues with flash rusting and clear coat failure and it's only been less than a few years. With that said, it's not terrible though. My truck was either a home job or a low cost one. There's a ton of fish eyes, and some areas weren't even primed.

Just thinking about what's said. Do I think a Maco paint job will hold up if parked in the weather and never polished... I would not expect it to. I am thinking you are working on a hobby truck, and not a showmobile.

Say you want a decent looking hotrod with a shine to sport around in. Consider doing the prep work yourself. Get it into primer and have it shot. Even at that a painter will want to sand and prime so his product will work correctly.

Doing it at home, the biggest hurtle you may encounter. Fighting the trash that can get into the finish from the environment you may be spraying in, or over spray caused from a lack of ventilation.

Just an example for a reference, here is what I ended up with and got a no trash/ no over spray paint job. The blower 3 ton AC air handler, and a 10in duct placed low on the floor, made a down draft sort of booth of sorts.

Food for thought

 

[drink]

I saw a Maaco ad saying they are painting cars for $199.

 

[Zeke]

I saw a Maaco ad saying they are painting cars for $199.

And that's what you get, $199 worth. In reality that's a leader ad that gets you in the door for an estimate. They will tell you that you need a more thorough sanding and a bunch of other stuff which for the most part you do need. All of this runs up the cost. Oh, and the paint? There's an upgrade for that too. Don't quote me but I think the $199 job is guaranteed for one year.

 

[PSYKO_Inc]

Back in the late 90's, my teenaged self got into an accident in my '85 S10. I fixed it with junkyard parts, and was rollin' around for several months with a brown cab and a blue bed. My mom and stepdad (probably tired of seeing the multi-colored monstrosity in the driveway) got me an Earl Scheib paintjob for Christmas that year. It was a 20-footer for sure, lots of orange peel and overspray, but it was better than before. Didn't last worth a damn, would scratch if you look at it funny. By the two year mark, it looked bad enough that I just sanded it down and shot it in gray primer, which lasted until the engine blew.

Just an example for a reference, here is what I ended up with and got a no trash/ no over spray paint job. The blower 3 ton AC air handler, and a 10in duct placed low on the floor, made a down draft sort of booth of sorts.

That's a great idea! Wonder if a wood shop dust collector would be able to do the same thing?

 

[crerus75]

The only working compressor I have right now is an import no-name pancake compressor that I got on sale at the local hardware store. It's a loud, rattly piece of junk and I expect it to toss a rod any day now, but it's my only means of producing air. I've used it with a Harbor Freight HVLP gun to spray single-stage enamel on shop cabinets and, while the compressor ran non-stop, it eventually got the job done. Same thing with latex paint on some plywood garage shelves. I have to wear hearing protection because the little rattlebox is so loud, and it gets hot enough to fry an egg, but it works. I don't know if I'd try an entire truck, but I'm stubborn enough that I probably would.

 

[gungatim]

do you know anyone with a larger compressor you can borrow for the weekend? I loaned my old Campbell hausfeld 2hp 20 gal. compressor out several times to friends who needed to paint something...

another option: rolling on rust-o-leum. no joke, can turn out pretty nice. do a search for the technique, lots of sanding and buffing but that's how cars used to be painted...cheap and best of all, no compressor needed!

 

[dnschmidt]

Don't you guys have any rental stores where you live? ABC rental is 5 minutes from my house. I'm sure they're got something better than what you have. Why not rent a decent compressor?

 

[Jazz1]

I would just use the larger compressor and as others suggest paint "pieces" Most of my projects the doors are off as well as tailgate. If box is separated from frame and moved to squirt rear of cab BONUS. Hang as much tin as you can for painting.

 

[mike758]

After thinking about this more, and researching, it sounds like Maaco is "ok", BUT only if you do your own prep work. With that said though, I would still need to run a sprayer to apply an epoxy primer

 

[Zeke]

Epoxy primer is for top notch jobs over bare metal. I guarantee you that many good paint jobs are done over a sealer. You may have to spot prime and polyester primer is very good for that. It's a sanding primer whereas you do not sand a sealer coat. And sealer is inexpensive. But you have to paint within 8 hours of sealing.

 

[zarbat007]

I consider myself to be a serious hobbyist.

I have: SATA 3000 RP, SATA 3000 HVLP, Iwata LPH-400, Devilbiss mini gun, Astro EVO 4014 and cheap Devilbiss with 1.8 tip for 2K primer.


I first bought the Astro since it was recommended by an online forum as the best budget gun under $100. This was about 8-9 years ago and it was the first gun I ever used. I painted a BMW bumper using single stage black and the result was beautiful.

Astro EVO 4014 is supposed to be a "copy" of Iwata LPH-400 design and its also LVLP. They even designed/shaped it like Iwata. The fluid tip is not designed like Iwata however.

Having used both, while the Astro is a pretty decent gun, the Iwata has a bigger fan, less overspray, and can lay clearcoat like glass! Big difference between them.

You can buy EVO4014 (1.4 tip) for sealer/epoxy/basecoat/clearcoat and EVO 4018 (1.8 tip) for 2K High build primer.

As for the compressor, yes it needs to be decent with at least 8 CFM(real CFM)/60 gallons capacity even if painting panels (using low CFM guns). If the compressor is continuously working, the moisture can cause issues.

If it was my project, I would probably use SEM Metalock DTM primer (Direct to metal). It can be used as a highbuild primer and reduced and sprayed as a sealer. I have not used it myself, but it has good reviews online.
SEM is a great company and I've never had any issues with their products.

https://www.semproducts.com/refinish-primers/metalocktm-dtm-high-build-primer

You must wear approved respirators, preferably the air-fed ones when using painting materials. The hardeners used in primers or clearcoat contain isocyanide which is extremely dangerous. Even your eyes must be covered since isocyanide is "moisture seeking" and can soak through your eyes.
Thats not the only danger, the solvents and chemicals are also harmful.

 

[dnschmidt]

Zarbat007 is pretty much telling you like it is. I'm a pro and his advice is quite good for a hobbyist. The changes I would make to his recommendations are as followings. The EVO cost the same but is not nearly as good as the forged ASTRO EURO series guns that have effectively replaced it. These are made in both RP and HVLP (Blue and Green). Use the HVLP (Green) for everything except clear. Use the 1.3 RP (Blue) for clear. These will get the job done. As he stated his compressor recommendation is the bare minimum.

If you've got the cash to go for a pro level gun the best bargain out there and without question the best gun for the money is the DeVilbiss Pro-lite. In Europe DeVilbiss makes a gun called the GPI which is amazing for the money but they don't import it into the U.S. It is available from Spraygunsdirect which is an outstanding company in England that I deal with that ships stuff from England faster than I can get it from domestic sources. Highly recommended. The Pro-lite is the best value in pro grade spray guns available anywhere. The GPI is the best DIY gun available anywhere. Check out THE GUNMAN on YouTube. That dude tells it like it is.

 

[johnyg]

i just re painted most of my pick up that had clear coat problems on hood, roof and tops of fenders.i used base and clear,2hp 25 gal comp,hf hvlp gun,cheap water filter reg. and disposible discant filter at gun.i had to work outside under a pop up canopy and work around the weather so a great finish was not possible,so i put extra clear on so i could sand and buff out the defects.its a 5 footer but i saved alot and learned alot.i also painted an old snap-on tool box before this to get my routine down and that really helped alot.paint in sections,50 ft of hose before filter-reg,big fan on comp and hose and slow thinner.have fun...john.

 

[Citation]

Just throwing out an alternative idea, what about doing the "Rustoleum" paint job? There are a number of web articles about it. It's basically may thin layers of brush applied paint with sanding in between. The reported up side is the costs and resources (other than time) needed to do the job are very low. It's reported to work well and you don't have to worry about keeping things clean while coats are drying. I suspect it would only work with solid colors but still, worth a look
http://www.rickwrench.com/index79master.htm?http://www.rickwrench.com/50dollarpaint.html

http://www.stangnet.com/mustang-for...at-the-50-rustoleum-roll-on-paint-job.823570/

 

[Zeke]

Just throwing out an alternative idea, what about doing the "Rustoleum" paint job? There are a number of web articles about it. It's basically may thin layers of brush applied paint with sanding in between. The reported up side is the costs and resources (other than time) needed to do the job are very low. It's reported to work well and you don't have to worry about keeping things clean while coats are drying. I suspect it would only work with solid colors but still, worth a look
http://www.rickwrench.com/index79master.htm?http://www.rickwrench.com/50dollarpaint.html

http://www.stangnet.com/mustang-for...at-the-50-rustoleum-roll-on-paint-job.823570/

I was thinking of bringing that subject up although my first choice would not be Rustoleum. Most paint stores have a few colors in industrial synthetic enamel. Not bad for a car of truck, you just don't have a lot of options for polishing out after the last coat.

 

[mike758]

http://https://scontent-iad3-1.**.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/11206062_934425396578651_3152222022700215761_n.jpg?efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&oh=8832ac62688578e0943ecea2669f2576&oe=57D371AB

I was considering the rustolium approach, but while it seems good, it still seems like a lower quality finish. I attached a picture of the truck, actually only a couple of years ago, to show that it's actually pretty decent. The paints pretty bad now, but the camera doesn't really pick up on that.

 

[zarbat007]

dnschmidt,

Thanks for the tip about the new Astro gun models. Since getting the Iwata/SATA guns I only use my 4014 for sealer/epoxy primer.
Only reason I recommended 4014 is due to the lower CFM consumption. I will try the EUROHE103 when I need a replacement.

I've also watched GUNMAN's youtube videos, very informative.
He mentioned in one of the comments that Devilbiss GPI is the same gun as the Tekna Pro-lite sold in North America.

This is quoted from his website:
https://thegunman.net.au/the-gunmans-top-10-spray-guns/

1 Gun to rule them all, the DeVilbiss GTI Pro lite is an amazing gun at a reasonable price, available in 1.2, 1.3 & 1.4mm setups and with the choice of 3 air caps allowing the painter to change the air cap to suit the spraying conditions and material used, the Tekna model sold in the USA is near identical but has a black body and no air regulator on the gun but this is not a problem as I like to run an extra gun regulator anyway, I also have noticed that they are a bit cheaper in USA and come in great packages with multiple air caps and fluid tips.
But does this gun lay on a coat of paint or what, easy to setup, made by the DeVilbiss company who founded the spray gun and built to top quality standards in the UK.

Since I am just a hobbyist, I find it hard to justify buying a Tekna Pro-lite even after reading all these great reviews online, but I also have a hard time letting go of my Sata guns, something about the way they feel in your hands...

But the Tekna is indeed a great deal! If I sell one of my Satas I will get one. Comes with 3 needles and 2 caps and a regulator for about $410 USD. A SATA cap/needle kit costs about half of that!

 

[KenS]

You can throw a lot of money at spray guns and equipment, but if the OP is using a small compressor -- probably portable -- he needs equipment to match. He may want to look at a LVLP (Low Volume Low Pressure) gun to match his compressor. It will not give the high-end results of some of the pricey pro equipment mentioned here, but if the OP is sticking with a small compressor, he may be surprised with the results.

Amazon's cheap Sprayit LVLP with three tip sizes.

Google LVLP -- there's lots of information and YouTube videos out there to help you decide.

And it you want to throw some money at LVLP, take a look at the outfits here: LVLP at SprayGunWorld.com.

 

[dnschmidt]

The GPI is not the same as the GTI. It is an entirely different gun. The GTI was an HVLP gun that came with the 2000 aircap and then was made into the PLUS gun when they went with the RP 410 aircap. Honestly the SATA 3000 and 4000 series were not very good. A lot of painters that made the switch from their Nr2000's sold their 3000's and went back to the Nr2000. Now, the SATA 5000 is absolutely killer. Light years ahead of the 3000 or 4000.

 

[zarbat007]

dnschmidt,

Would you recommend GPI over the Tekna? Especially since the Tekna comes with three needles and two caps? (Tekna Pro-lite). It has amazing reviews on autobody forums, especially for waterborne paints.

I agree with you, SATA 4000 does not have much good reviews, one of the major complaints is the slow spraying speed. However, from what I've read online, the 5000 series is supposed to be as fast as 3000/first gen RP but with a "softer" spray. Most complaints about the 3000 are about the weight and lack of balance.

 

[dnschmidt]

Depends on budget. The Pro-lite with the TE20 cap (THEY GIVE YOU THE TE10 AS WELL) is your clearcoat gun of choice. The GPI can handle everything else with no problem. Go to spraygunsdirect.com and buy the kit with the multiple tips. So you've got one really great gun for clear and one really really good gun (that's dirt cheap) for everything else.