Running Propane Gas Lines

[DuluthMN]

Ok, I take pride in knowing that I have learned to tackle all my garage projects so far by myself. Granted the tape/mud job is not the greatest and the cabinets may be a tiny tiny bit off center. But at the end of the day I take great pride in knowing that I did it myself.

Now here is my dilemma, I am getting my propane tank next week and they said they would do the hook up to the furnace (as long as I had the fittings) and that they would do the run from the new tank to the garage where my existing line would be. But I am just not sure that I am comfortable running the black pipe myself. I'm probably looking at 30' from the furnace to the outside of the garage.

Am I over reacting, is this something that I can do myself?

Something to add: The propane company said that they also do a test fire once hook up is complete.

 

[shotgunfatcat]

Do you have the threading tools? if so do it yourself.

 

[DuluthMN]

Do you have the threading tools? if so do it yourself.

No threading tools. I priced the pre-cut and threaded black pipe at Menards and the prices did not seem that bad. I just worry about the whole leaking propane and the garage blowing up. I was told to use the cement and not the white thread tape stuff.

 

[shotgunfatcat]

loctite makes a liquid pipe sealer, it works great. Don't know if that is what you mean by cement.

I think this is what I use.


http://www.henkelna.com/cps/rde/xch...tredDotUID=productfinder&redDotUID=0000000M7S


I wouldn't use the tape either.

 

[csp]

As long as you use pipe dope (it's not cement) and get your fittings very tight you shouldn't have leak problems. You should cap the pipe at the one end and install a pressure test gauge at the other end and fill the pipe with 10psi of compressed air. It should hold that psi for a minimum of two hours (I think that's what code is), but I like it to be overnight or indefinitely. Your system should never see more than 2psi once the propane is turned on.

If you have a leak you can spray each fitting with soapy water to find them.

Teflon is ok to use on 1/2" pipe, but pipe dope is better. On larger pipe (1/5" or bigger) we use both.

 

[DuluthMN]

ok, so it sounds like I should just run it myself. I will be running 1/2" black pipe with pipe dope. I think they wanted $3 a foot to run it. Doing it myself will save me money for sure.

 

[Possum]

I am all for DIY, but for $3 a foot at only 30ft if I understand you correct doesn't seem that bad. By the time you by the pipe, assorted unions, elbows, fittings, shutoff valve, appliance connector, sealant, two trips to home depot , and most of all time, will you really be saving all that much?

 

[csp]

That $3 a foot does sound very reasonable. You'll also be getting 20' sticks with the pro doing it and fewer joints than DIY.

 

[94legaleagle]

the propane company would charge you $3.00 / foot for 30 feet = $90.00 total expense

Your first post makes me believe you are not sure whether you can tackle this project or not - what is your time worth? if it will take you one hour total, and you pay yourself $15.00 for that hour of time, the cost is now down to $75.00 - BUT, you haven't bought materials yet

BUT, the big question is whether you trust yourself to do this or not - one leak, and KABOOM!!!!!!! is KABOOM and no more shop worth $90.00? ie: if things go bad and there is a leak, can you replace your shop for $90.00? if so, go for it otherwise, YES, I DO understand wanting to do it yourself, but sometimes there is a time when you can't afford NOT to have someone else do something for you - and I think this is one of those times.

 

[DeadSock]

I'm of the belief that if "it's invisible and can kill me", I prefer not to DIY.

So, that applies for gas and electrical.

Sure, I *could* hook up another breaker or tee a gas line, but I'd prefer a pro.
note: I have done both ... but still prefer it being done by a pro.

Just IMHO.

 

[APEowner]

The propane company will do a leak test on the whole system before they fire it up so even if you do screw it up they should catch it before it's a problem.

 

[wizardlockman]

i am a old pipe fitter from idaho and you can run the black pipe very easly but use teflon pipe dope on fitings as for leaks you can check your self with a 30 lb gauge the system to pass inspecion must hold 15 lbs pressure for 24 hours as long as that works your good also on pipes you must make sure there are 7 thresds in 3 showing if you count the threads on pipe there is ten total and that is all there is to good luck

 

[mhm993]

Propane is hardly invisible--they add that rotten smell after all-- and this is an easy diy. Though, at 3 bucks a foot, unless you get pride in a job well done, might as well spend the $90 bucks and let someone else do it.

 

[csp]

BUT, the big question is whether you trust yourself to do this or not - one leak, and KABOOM!!!!!!! is KABOOM and no more shop worth $90.00? ie: if things go bad and there is a leak, can you replace your shop for $90.00? if so, go for it otherwise, YES, I DO understand wanting to do it yourself, but sometimes there is a time when you can't afford NOT to have someone else do something for you - and I think this is one of those times.

I love it when people who won't attempt something like this chime in with all that can go wrong. Can there be a problem? Sure there can. Can you avoid such problems though? Absolutely. You do the same pressure test that the pros do and it will be fine.

I could get hit by a bus crossing the street at any given moment. I have the sense to look both ways before attempting such maneuvers.

Follow the correct procedure and there won't be a problem. We're not building a rocket here.

 

[DuluthMN]

Ok, I just spoke with the propane company and it will be $3 a foot and $84 an hour labor. He said that he would guarantee it would be under an hour of labor.

He said that they would run the black pipe out of the furnace and make a "T" with a drip flange. And then they would run copper the rest of the way. He said cooper is way cheaper than black pipe. Is it possible to join the copper tubing and black pipe at the "T" thing that he mentioned? Do I buy 1/2" copper tubing to match the black pipe?

 

[csp]

They should be using a black pipe ****** to get out of the furnace and then a flex pipe to join with the rest of the hard line.

Around here, copper isn't allowed as gas line.

Are you supplying all of the materials or is the $3 a foot for materials?

 

[DuluthMN]

They should be using a black pipe ****** to get out of the furnace and then a flex pipe to join with the rest of the hard line.

Around here, copper isn't allowed as gas line.

Are you supplying all of the materials or is the $3 a foot for materials?

$3 a foot includes materials.

 

[justsam]

Ok, I just spoke with the propane company and it will be $3 a foot and $84 an hour labor. He said that he would guarantee it would be under an hour of labor.

He said that they would run the black pipe out of the furnace and make a "T" with a drip flange. And then they would run copper the rest of the way. He said cooper is way cheaper than black pipe. Is it possible to join the copper tubing and black pipe at the "T" thing that he mentioned? Do I buy 1/2" copper tubing to match the black pipe?

You must run hard pipe directly out of the applicance, that is code, so sheet metal covers do not abrade the pipe.

I do not understand "drip flange", I would call it a drip leg, a 3" or so piece of pipe pointing down via a "T" at the input to the appliance. this is code in many areas.

I am not so sure about copper being cheaper than black pipe. I would opt for all black pipe, it is not that long of a run, and for gas I like the robustness of black pipe. Connecting copper to iron pipe requires a dielectric coupling. Not an issue if they have one on the truck.

 

[tool whore]

Plumbing and fitting are mechanical trades that are licensed and for good reason. That said, you can do it and do it correctly. To do it correctly, you get your info from the code and not a HD helper. The code requires (National Code) teflon tape that is rated for gas, normally yellow in color. It is slightly more like a stick of wrigleys as compared to the normal white tape for water lines. Also, on top of the tape, you'll need to use a pipe dope rated for GAS, not water. Usually it is thicker, much stickier and sometimes colored. In major metro areas, the inspectors usually require the color such as blue so that it is easy to view from floor to ceiling. Be neat with it or it will look like ****.

Any black pipe that is in the ground will need to be wrapped (with pvc or asphalt tape) or painted with asphalt paint. Above ground but outside has to be painted (usually a particular color such as brown or green. I prefer black, some places require a spec. Inside it should be vented in any walls (ran inside of a larger pvc pipe, can be tricky). Then there are the hangers. You cant just duct tape it to the wall. There's alot of work involved and $3/ft seems reasonable. A 30# air gage will do you. The pressure of you system 2#? will need to be applied times 5 for a code inspection (10#). Go ahead and fill it to thirty and leave it for 15 minutes and you'll know. Fix any leaks, if it holds leave it for 24 hours and any leaks are likely valve packing nuts. Caution: do not use water line ball valves in your system. You or someone else will die!

You can also use roll copper and flare it. Inside or out, it's much easier and faster, but does require a good flaring tool. I have a ridgid $50 model. The investment is worth it and the learning curve is short. Remember to put the nuts on first! Happy flaring. Pressure test is the same process and without any appliances hooked up.

Also, make sure any appliances you use must have a regulator. Countless explosions come from a stove or furnace being piped direct with a full two pounds coming direct to the flame.

 

[fireguy]

That tool ***** is the only one who seems to know of which he speaks. NFPA 54 or 58 is code for fuel gas in most areas. I am too lazy to walk out to the van and check. You are probably required to have a green wire above the gas pipe also. To make sure, visit the local building codes inspectors office. They may even print what ever code they claim to follow in your area. I have been told teflon tape is not for gas, the gas is supposed to disolve the teflon. That said, I often use like the blue dope, again, I am too lazy to go look in the van. After all, it is 10 feet from the motel room door.

 

[fflintstone]

In my area we use black pipe from the regulator (just outside the building) to the inside, then a gas shutoff valve, a tee with a dirt leg, a gas rated flex line to the appliance. From the regulator back to the tank it is usually flexible copper buried a minimum of 18”. the nice thing about the copper is there are far less joints to leak.
Listen to tool *****; he seems to have the most correct answer.

 

[robertlynk]

Something to think about. Are you ever going to install any other equipment that uses propane. Water heater tank/ tank less a dryer. if so you need to call calculate the possible cubic foot needs before hand and size piping accordingly

Gas Line Sizing For Gas Tankless Water Heaters

http://www.tanklesswaters.com/ed_select_gas_GasLineSizing.asp

 

[e-tek]

One thing to remember when everyone chimes in about "having someone else (or a "pro") do it: Pro's can eff it up too!! I had a line moved and they put in a flex section. The next spring I could smell gas (just outside the door). It may have hve been leaking all GD winter!! When it was taken apart the union was installed backwards.....No way it could have passed a leak test - so the "pro" was a friggin' idiot.

 

[Kevin54]

Around here a propane line is just a roll of 3/8" soft copper buried a foot or so into the ground. When it gets to the house it gets hooked to a regulator then hard line the rest of the way to the appliance. I would check with your propane supplier to see how they do it.

 

[robertlynk]

In Socal the tank is out by the street and the regulator is next to the tank. This is why larger lines are needed

 

[Daniel Dudley]

A sure test for leaks is a spray bottle and a few drops of dish washing liquid. You can test for leaks anytime you like after the gas is on, or the pipe is pressurized.