RV plug?

[ForceFed70]

I plan to put an exterior RV plugin on the side of my shop for future RV. Last time we had friends bring their RV over they couldn't run the AC because it would trip the breaker when using a standard 120V 15A circuit.

Someone told me that an RV plugin uses a 120V 30A circuit. Is that correct? Since it is exterior, will I require GFCI protection? Do they make GFCI RV plugs?

 

[Norcal]

I plan to put an exterior RV plugin on the side of my shop for future RV. Last time we had friends bring their RV over they couldn't run the AC because it would trip the breaker when using a standard 120V 15A circuit.

Someone told me that an RV plugin uses a 120V 30A circuit. Is that correct? Since it is exterior, will I require GFCI protection? Do they make GFCI RV plugs?

30A is a common configuiration for RV's, there are RV power outlets made in a 3R can that can be purchased for around $30 (Try HD or Lowes). & no GFCI protection is required for 30A.

 

[mrb]

the 30 amp rv receptacle is called a TT-30 its a 30 amp 3 wire straight blade 125v receptacle. Not to be confused with nema 5-30

 

[green.bubbly]

30A is a common configuiration for RV's, there are RV power outlets made in a 3R can that can be purchased for around $30 (Try HD or Lowes). & no GFCI protection is required for 30A.

Out of curiosity, why would no GFCI be required?

 

[Norcal]

Out of curiosity, why would no GFCI be required?

15 & 20A receptacles are required to have GFCI protection, 30A is not, the answer why would be in the NEC code committees minutes, but a 30 ampere circuit is not a general purpose use, IMO.

 

[ForceFed70]

Thanks guys!

 

[nehog]

15 & 20A receptacles are required to have GFCI protection, 30A is not, the answer why would be in the NEC code committees minutes, but a 30 ampere circuit is not a general purpose use, IMO.

Which is not to say that having GFCI protection would not be a good idea! (Yea, I know, GFCI breakers are expensive, but well worth the investment if they do their job...)

 

[VHF]

There are two standards for RV shore power:

• 30A 120V (using the TT-30 "travel trailer" outlet previously discussed).

• 50A 240V (which I believe is the same 4-prong outlet used for an electric stove)

In the RV world people just talk about 30A or 50A and don't mention the voltage. 50A doesn't sound like that much more than 30A but because it is 240V it actually increases the available power from 3,600W to 12,000W.

(Most RVs don't actually have any 240V loads. They run the 240V into a panel with 120V branch circuits. Major 120V loads, like rooftop air conditioners, are balanced between the two legs.)

Some fancy RVs have power management that makes the most of what is available. For example, if connected to 50A it will allow both rooftop A/C units to run at the same time, but if only 30A they will be interlocked. Or run one off of shore power and one off the generator. Seems silly to me to run the generator when shore power is available, but I guess on a big rig you sometimes need more power than the shore connection can provide.

 

[hdossett]

I plan to put an exterior RV plugin on the side of my shop for future RV. Last time we had friends bring their RV over they couldn't run the AC because it would trip the breaker when using a standard 120V 15A circuit.

Someone told me that an RV plugin uses a 120V 30A circuit. Is that correct? Since it is exterior, will I require GFCI protection? Do they make GFCI RV plugs?

2nd question first... No GFCI! RV's have them, and they don't work with more that one in a circuit!

Some older Class As, and trailers use 120/30. All newer Class As, and larger trailers use 240/50.

I have two RV hook ups! Both are the 240V/50 amp, four wire sockets. On one I use a 30 amp DP breaker because of the wire size and distance, the other I use a 40 amp DP breaker, same wire but about 1/3 the distance. I put the 40A at the garage when I had two brothers coming at the same time. Now I use it when working on my own RV! Worked out great for that! A 240/30 will actually give you 60 amps worth of 120V, enough for all but the largest RVs with everything running at once! (if not downsized with a "dog bone" adapter to work with a 30 Amp cord and plug)

If you go with the 120v/30A plug, (which is enough for most RVs, unless it is very hot and both AC units are needed) be careful who you let wire it! Believe it or not, some electricians will wire them as 240V , not good! can fry every thing in the RV! Some parts of RV wiring very different from regular house wiring!

H

 

[79firebird]

If you can do a 50 and a 30 amp ive seen thoes dog bone adpaters melt. Then this way if you need to weld you can out side if you use 220.

 

[willy3486]

I have two campers and I built a cover for both of them. I added water lines and electrical to the cover. I can go camping anytime I want to without having to pull them anywhere. Its really nice in the fall to go out there and relax on weekends. Plus the campers are covered. You will enjoy it if you hook up a plug to use onsite. Here is my campers in the cover.

 

[ishiboo]

Do a 50A so you can back-feed your generator through it!







Kidding, of course

 

[midnite kid]

30 amp is plenty,dont overthink it

 

[ket-tek]

Like mentioned the 30amp 120v rv twistlock plugs are available at HD and Lowes.

The whirlpool combo I installed in the master bathroom a couple years back needed 120v 30amp GFI for the internal water heater, Lowe's/HD didn't have either the outlets or breakers in 30amp with GFI. I went to a supply house and they had a 120v 30amp GFI breaker for $20, I didn't think that price was to bad (if you only need 1)..

 

[Norcal]

Like mentioned the 30amp 120v rv twistlock plugs are available at HD and Lowes.

RV plugs are not "twistlock" they are a crowfoot configuration, BTW "Twistlock" is a registered trademark, if it's not a Hubbell brand, it's just a locking plug.

 

[ishiboo]

Like mentioned the 30amp 120v rv twistlock plugs are available at HD and Lowes.

The whirlpool combo I installed in the master bathroom a couple years back needed 120v 30amp GFI for the internal water heater, Lowe's/HD didn't have either the outlets or breakers in 30amp with GFI. I went to a supply house and they had a 120v 30amp GFI breaker for $20, I didn't think that price was to bad (if you only need 1)..

$20 for a 30A GFI breaker is dirt cheap.

As Norcal said, RVs use a straight blade non-locking plug.

I have two L5-30's installed outside, as that's the standard shore power plug (like RVs, boats have 30A and 50A, however 30A/dual 30A are more common.) Real nice to be able to plug the boat in when it's stored here and run the battery charger/AC to work on it.

I sold my welder/plasma cutter, but when I had it it was usually easier/cheaper to run the generator if I had to do something outside, though I could easily make an adapter and cord for the L5-30.

 

[Aceman]

Why in the world would anyone want to put their RV recep on a GFCI?

All that electrical on one breaker! That's just begging for nuisance tripping!

 

[harley rider]

Why in the world would anyone want to put their RV recep on a GFCI?

All that electrical on one breaker! That's just begging for nuisance tripping!

around here it is code for outside aplications.

 

[Stuart in MN]

around here it is code for outside aplications.

Where is 'here'? There may be local regulations that do require them, but as mentioned earlier the NEC doesn't require GFCI's for 30 amp receptacles.

 

[Alchymist]

around here it is code for outside aplications.

Generally not put on a GFCI - most newer RVs have a GFCI already, two in series usually causes problems.

 

[mrb]

theres nothing wrong with GFIs in series. If that were true, no hairdryers would work.

 

[malibu101]

theres nothing wrong with GFIs in series. If that were true, no hairdryers would work.

I know the plugs that you mean.
I must totally agree with MRB's statement because at work we plug in a GFI protector ANY and EVERY time an extension cord is plugged in and used outside. It is not uncommon to plug the GFI module into a GFI outlet and we have no problems at all.
Unless of course there is a faulty cord in use and left out that the morning dew settles on it and trips one of the GFI's.

 

[hdossett]

I know the plugs that you mean.
I must totally agree with MRB's statement

I will defer to malibu and MRB on this. Make sense!

A couple of years ago I had a problem with my RV being plugged into a CFGI that I had installed outside my garage. I thought I remembered reading in the instruction sheet that you should not wire two in series, but, maybe not! Taking the cord inside, and plugging into the same circuit, ahead of the GFCI, everything worked fine! Have also used the GFCI for other thing with no problems! ...I don't know!

H

 

[Alchymist]

While it won't "hurt" anything to have two GFCI's in series, they are susceptible to nuisance tripping. Some of the older GFCI's just plain wouldn't work in series. Been there done that. Additionally, it's added cost for two - like wearing two pairs of boots on a rainy day. And anyone running freezers and sump pumps on GFCIs, well, let's just say I wouldn't. So if occasionally a plugin type winds up on another GFCI, well, if it doesn't trip, it works - otherwise......

 

[ishiboo]

While it won't "hurt" anything to have two GFCI's in series, they are susceptible to nuisance tripping. Some of the older GFCI's just plain wouldn't work in series. Been there done that. Additionally, it's added cost for two - like wearing two pairs of boots on a rainy day. And anyone running freezers and sump pumps on GFCIs, well, let's just say I wouldn't. So if occasionally a plugin type winds up on another GFCI, well, if it doesn't trip, it works - otherwise......

There is no technical reason two GFCIs in series would present an issue tripping. They're very simple devices; measure current in, measure current out. If the difference is > 4-6ma, trip. They wouldn't be any more susceptible to nuisance tripping having the two, it'd just be a pain because you'd have two to deal with.

All my sump pump outlets I have converted to GFCI with no issues, and I have family with garage freezers on GFCIs as well with no issues. If my sump pump starts leaking current and tripping the GFCI, it's thrown out.

 

[ishiboo]

BTW, I don't know about RV plus, but boat plugs are typically double-GFCI'd in all current code I believe. Your 30A has a breaker-based GFCI on it, because you could get shocked moving a wet cord, dropping it into the water, etc. prior to the boats GFCI protection.

The boat itself has GFCI on many of the outlets, like an RV.

 

[Wackerjr]

Funny I just finished this very installation....

Ended up getting my breaker from superbreakers.com ($8)

and the "rv" panel from homedepot or lowes (sorry can't remember which) comes with the correct 120 outlet, and the outdoor box....

have had it plugged into the GFI protected outlet for a week now, have ran the a/c, microwave, vaccum... etc works like a champ....

I personally would GFI protect it.....Why not extra protection does not hurt a thing...

 

[harley rider]

Where is 'here'? There may be local regulations that do require them, but as mentioned earlier the NEC doesn't require GFCI's for 30 amp receptacles.

it is not because it is 30 amp it is out side.

 

[Norcal]

it is not because it is 30 amp it is out side.

Totally irrelevant. There is no requirement for a 30A 120V RV receptacle to have GFCI protection.

 

[harley rider]

Totally irrelevant. There is no requirement for a 30A 120V RV receptacle to have GFCI protection.

irelivant or not .I dont care what the NEC says they are not the one signing off on my building inspection.when the inspector says you need it in a wet location that is what you do.

 

[SuperSocket]

Go with your 50A connector and then run something like this:

http://boattrailersforsale.blog.com...-30-amp-and-1520-amp-female-connector-3-feet/

Gives you many options.

 

[Alchymist]

Go with your 50A connector and then run something like this:

http://boattrailersforsale.blog.com...-30-amp-and-1520-amp-female-connector-3-feet/

Gives you many options.

Converted our 50 Amp on our RV to a 30 Amp some time ago. Only reason a 50 is needed is if running a second air conditioner.

Any one needs one of the adapters linked to, PM me, I have one I'll let go cheap. Takes a 50 Amp plug and runs in to 2 separate 30 Amp receptacles.

 

[Alchymist]

irelivant or not .I dont care what the NEC says they are not the one signing off on my building inspection.when the inspector says you need it in a wet location that is what you do.

Yep, local AHJ has the last say, right or wrong.

 

[mrb]

irelivant or not .I dont care what the NEC says they are not the one signing off on my building inspection.when the inspector says you need it in a wet location that is what you do.

where are you located? I would like to look and see if your local jurisdiction has a code ammendment requiring GFI on 30 amp. I want to see how its worded.

 

[Norcal]

irelivant or not .I dont care what the NEC says they are not the one signing off on my building inspection.when the inspector says you need it in a wet location that is what you do.

A inspector is not allowed to make up code rules, sticking their finger in the crack of their **** & making up a rule is not legal. No adopted code rule, then no need to comply.

 

[harley rider]

I think you guys are missing the point that this outlet is out doors and therefor is a wet location. why would you not want a gfci .

 

[mrb]

I think you guys are missing the point that this outlet is out doors and therefor is a wet location. why would you not want a gfci .

you wouldnt want it because there will be so much wiring and so many different devices on the load side it could trip. Since the 30 amp receptacle isnt directly supplying loads people will be touching some feel its not necessary.

 

[Cobra6]

Midwest electrical has a line of RV hookups - I recently looked at one of these -
http://www.midwestelectric.com/product/rv.htm

 

[harley rider]

you wouldnt want it because there will be so much wiring and so many different devices on the load side it could trip. Since the 30 amp receptacle isnt directly supplying loads people will be touching some feel its not necessary.

not sure what you meen by so much wiring and so many different devices ?

 

[mrb]

not sure what you meen by so much wiring and so many different devices ?

from Fluke:

In any electrical installation, some current will flow through the protective ground conductor to ground. This is usually called leakage current. Leakage current most commonly flows in the insulation surrounding conductors and in the filters protecting electronic equipment around the home or office. So what's the problem? On circuits protected by GFCIs (Ground Fault Current Interrupters), leakage current can cause unnecessary and intermittent tripping. In extreme cases, it can cause a rise in voltage on accessible conductive parts.

The causes of leakage current

Insulation has both electrical resistance and capacitance – and it conducts current through both paths. Given the high resistance of insulation, very little current should actually leak. But -- if the insulation is old or damaged, the resistance is lower and substantial current may flow. Additionally, longer conductors have a higher capacitance, causing more leakage current. That's why GFCI breaker manufacturers recommend one-way feeder length be limited to 250 feet, maximum.

Electronic equipment, meanwhile, contains filters designed to protect against voltage surges and other disruptions. These filters typically have capacitors on the input, which adds to the overall capacitance of the wiring system and the overall level of leakage current.