Scan tool options

[jkesselr]

Hey guys,

I am looking to upgrade my scan tool. As it stands now, I have a snap on MT2500. I like the bi-directional controls, the vast array of data I can access, and the ability to scan multiple types of systems (engine, transmission, abs, etc.). I hate the need to buy new software (which is long outdated on the MT2500, as far as I know).

That leads me to where I am now. I want a system with the same kinds of capabilities, that will scan current vehicles, and does not cost an arm and a leg. I have looked at some of the newer snap on offerings, but they suffer from the same issues. What I would really like is something PC based that I can use a laptop to run. I have an older laptop to donate to this cause.

Do any of you know of a very solid, full-function, diagnostic scanner that is available for use with a laptop?

Thank you in advance for any information you are able to provide!

 

[slackdaddy1]

Looking too,
Hardware wise there is NOTHING to a scan tool that a tablet or laptop does not have.
And on the software end,, it's not rocket science,, I see dedicated "scan tools" going away in the next few years.

 

[Tallpilot]

Could be but the videos I have watched demonstrating PC based scanners have not been encouraging. The 3 main brands (Snap-on, Launch and Autel) which people recommend all require updates to fix old bugs and work with new model years.

The lower end tools without bi directional controls and relearns usually come with lifetime updates. The best 'deal' is the Ethos Tech since in includes updates for a number of years. The alternative would be a pass through interface and use subscriptions to the factory tools. The downside if you work on a lot of different makes is learning multiple interfaces and subscription rates that would rival the aftermarket update costs if you needed more than a couple.

 

[vssjim]

Autel Maxi-sys is my newest and favorite it is my favorite, it is the fifth scan tool i own.

 

[JD3020]

AutoEnginuity is PC based and pretty good, been a while since i've purchased or updated it but i believe i paid $350 for the software and Ford license, then another $125 later to add Chrysler. Unfortunately i haven't used the bi-directional controls on it very much as i upgraded to a Solus Pro updated to '15 with all keys for $300 last summer.

One nice thing about AE is its only key'd to the dongle so you can install the software on multiple devices, and just have to hook up with whatever device you want to use.

 

[lbhsbz]

For what you're looking for, AutoEnginuity is about the only one.

I happen to have one with the enhanced Domestic and asian software I'll sell for $350...it's updated to 2015. I have 3 other scanners that I grab first...so I hardly ever use it.

 

[mrjaw14]

I wish Autel would Sell a keyed VCI and release a PC, MAC, and mobile software. I really want an autel, but at the end of the day it and others like it are tablets. I get 3-4 years out of a tablet before the battery fails. If I’m going to pay for a scan tool, I want it to last longer than that. So I’m also looking for a Software scan tool I can use with a VCI

 

[dnschmidt]

mrjaw14, I think you're living in a dream. In four years things will have changed so dramatically that whatever you buy today is going to be obsolete anyway. If the battery fails, which seems to be your concern, why not simply replace the bad battery with another one? The Autel has screws on the case to hold it together. It appears to me to be serviceable.

 

[Fedwrench]

Any aftermarket scan tool is a compromise at best compared to the original factory tool regardless of whose name is on it.

Dedicated scan tools aren't going anywhere. However, their shape is changing. Ford, GM, and Chrysler all use laptop based versions IDS for Ford, MDI for GM, and Witech for Chrysler. None of them are really cheap and each requires a manufacturers subscription to operate that requires annual renewal. It's like buying new scan tools every year with the cost of updating.

Regardless of what aftermarket brand you choose, you need to factor in the cost of updating into whatever platform you choose. It also depends on what you're working on and what you want to do. Most aftermarket tools will work well on powertrain issues. However, they be found lacking when in comes to Body control functions, antilock brakes, antitheft, or srs issues where there's an awful lot of proprietary information.

On a side note, Bosch/OTC are great at coming out with new platforms but, often end product support in favor of launching a new platform. Scan tools aren't the long term purchases they once were. In fact the snap on red brick probably had one of the longest runs going until controller area network changes meant its platform couldn't meet the needs of newer vehicles. Solus pro was good too but, had a shorter run and is no longer supported.

Online research will help you determine what a particular scan tool or program is capable of doing on a given vehicle. Good luck in your quest.

 

[Wamsutta]

There's something about the Launch that seems so clear and easy to read. It'd be the one I'd consider if I was shopping for one. I don't know the model number, but Eric Obrochta uses one in his videos.

 

[Skin]

AE didn't last long with me. Laptops are clumsy on a test drive and its UI was really kind of trash as well as a lot of hit/miss bi-directional controls. Also commonly ran into self run diagnostic tests that didn't work. This was around 2015 though so maybe things have drastically changed (doubt it). You also completely lack any integrated troubleshooter. This can be offset these days with wifi/hotspots but its still more work than just clicking an option on a dedicated scan tool.

The laptop itself will get beat to hell right quick too, you really need something like a Toughbook ($$$$$).

For a grand or two i'd buy a used Verus or Modis and be done with it but that's me. No they aren't perfect either but at least everything is in your hand on one platform from day one. Autels look nice too but no experience with anything from the last 8-10 years.

 

[Tallpilot]

That’s the way I feel. I like dedicated scan tools in cases designed for the shop environment. Plus it is easier to grab.

The biggest problem with the laptop solutions besides durability is the driver/OS/Java incompatibility mess. You have to purposely run older less secure **** and different for each manufacturer to boot in order to make their tool run.

 

[brveagle]

For what it's worth, i was recently in your shoes. I am just a guy that works on my vehicles and my families. Went from a mt2500 to a snap on solus pro. Use the same keys and i was able to buy a version with 2013 software which will last me awhile as my family tends to fix our vehicles, rather than buy new.

 

[jkesselr]

Brveagle - What did you pay for the Solus Pro?

Skin - what snap on systems are still supported. The differences between the Verus, Solis, Modis, etc all confuse me. If I bought an older one, what am I looking at to upgrade to current software? Can I just buy the latest or close to latest software and be done, or do I have to buy all prior years as each update builds on the prior one?

 

[Tallpilot]

https://www.snapon.com/diagnostics/us/DiagnosticPlatforms.htm

If it says Software update only it is currently supported. The ones not listed may or may not still be able to be updated to the terminal version. Verify that before you buy a used one.

In my experience the price difference between updated models and ones with ancient versions is generally smaller than the update costs. I won’t speculate on the reasons for that; I would just encourage you to get one with a recent update unless you find a spectacular deal.

 

[brveagle]

Brveagle - What did you pay for the Solus Pro?

I got a good deal on craigslist from someone needing money quickly. They sell for 500-$1500 on ebay depending on what version the software is. If you are used to the mt2500 like i was, you'll love a solus pro. Don't get too caught up in the newer stuff if you are just a home mechanic. Easy way to spend alot of money on functionality you do not necessarily need.

 

[Skin]

Brveagle - What did you pay for the Solus Pro?

Skin - what snap on systems are still supported. The differences between the Verus, Solis, Modis, etc all confuse me. If I bought an older one, what am I looking at to upgrade to current software? Can I just buy the latest or close to latest software and be done, or do I have to buy all prior years as each update builds on the prior one?

Solus Edge, Modis Edge, and Verus Edge are the newest and all share the same scan tool software including the troubleshooter which has information on TSBs and pattern failures to be aware of. Solus and Modis are based on the same hardware but Solus lacks the scope/meter portion and the scope database (how to test components, specifications for wires and pinouts). I cant stress enough how handy this is unless you are extremely familiar with electrical diagnostics of any given make/model. Modis is equipped with a 2 channel scope, Verus a 4 channel scope with a larger screen.

There is also the prior iteration of each unit which is the Pro. I don't think much changed between the Pro and Edge other than the physical unit getting thinner and lighter.

Snap-On updates are expensive ($1k) so i'd suggest buying the version you need outright. Pro was released around 2010 and Edge 2016 so either are going to be fairly recent software versions. If you ever decided to update the software you do not need to retroactively purchase any missed updates, the only benefit to doing yearly updates is that Snap-On discounts every other update ~50%.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Do any of you know of a very solid, full-function, diagnostic scanner that is available for use with a laptop?

I have been on the same "grail quest" for several years now and have not come up with anything that is really above average and reasonably priced.

First, I can not image why all the major high end manufacturers are selling hardware ! By the time anything they have built for them hits the market it is "yesterdays mashed potatoes" ! After all, the real benefit for the end user is the software. How it gathers information and how it presents it to the user. Plus, what vehicles it can work with, WITHOUT expensive upgrades.

Second, I think the days of the laptop are fading fast. Modern tablets can do everything a laptop can do. Yes, a tablet need a good, gripy protective housing but a decent laptop is so much more expensive (and an old laptop is NOT a good starting point) !

BlueDriver got a lot of press when it came out. I have not heard a lot about it lately.

I would sure like to hear more feedback from people who use AutoEnginuity on a daily basis. Of course, maybe that means NO ONE is using it on a daily basis !

Last, over the past couple of years, Bosch has bought up a couple of the different scanner brands including OTC and Actron, besides their own brand. Some of the low end tools are clearly the "other" Bosch brand with different color housings and slightly different buttons. The big problem with the lower end tools is that some have no way of updating the software and even the ones that sell upgrades, the last revision was 2 or more years ago !


(Segue - I don't know how guys like Eric O. can afford to have multiple high end scanners unless the companies are giving them to him for free. He sure does not seem partial to one brand or another.)

 

[Tallpilot]

First, I can not image why all the major high end manufacturers are selling hardware ! By the time anything they have built for them hits the market it is "yesterdays mashed potatoes" ! After all, the real benefit for the end user is the software.

BlueDriver got a lot of press when it came out. I have not heard a lot about it lately.

I would sure like to hear more feedback from people who use AutoEnginuity on a daily basis. Of course, maybe that means NO ONE is using it on a daily basis !

Last, over the past couple of years, Bosch has bought up a couple of the different scanner brands including OTC and Actron, besides their own brand. Some of the low end tools are clearly the "other" Bosch brand with different color housings and slightly different buttons. The big problem with the lower end tools is that some have no way of updating the software and even the ones that sell upgrades, the last revision was 2 or more years ago !


(Segue - I don't know how guys like Eric O. can afford to have multiple high end scanners unless the companies are giving them to him for free. He sure does not seem partial to one brand or another.)

I suspect the hardware Snap-on puts in its scanners is already "yesterdays mashed potatoes" therefore increasing their margins on the product. The car is doing most of the heavy processing and the bus isn’t particularly fast so any reasonable hardware from this decade will do.

Bluedriver is very good for a few makes and mostly useless with others. No real bidirectional controls though. Any positive review of Autoengenuity always includes the caveat ‘I didn’t try the bi-directional controls’

Bosch should by all rights make the best scanners since at least half the automotive computers and communication standards have been developed by them. But they don’t support anything and they are more expensive than anyone else besides Snap-on.

Like I said earlier the PC based solution is clearly pass through at least until we move on to another standard. But that method increases geometrically in cost with each additional make you wish to support. Just doing one and a mongoose cable plus subscription gets you factory level capability for about $500.

Eric O doesn’t seem any tougher on tools than the average mechanic but he broke all his Milwaukee stuff (everybody else seems to swear by it) and his Verus several times. I am pretty sure he bought his big Autel before his channel exploded but all the others have been sent to him. He is absolutely Astro Pneumatic’s best salesman. But that is only because he isn’t a shill. The other tool ‘reviewers’ are mostly not worth watching.

 

[Skin]

Eric O doesn’t seem any tougher on tools than the average mechanic but he broke all his Milwaukee stuff (everybody else seems to swear by it) and his Verus several times. I am pretty sure he bought his big Autel before his channel exploded but all the others have been sent to him. He is absolutely Astro Pneumatic’s best salesman. But that is only because he isn’t a shill. The other tool ‘reviewers’ are mostly not worth watching.

Havent watched his vids in ages but he definitely bought that Verus and he pays for the yearly updates too. Before he got a pico it was his primary scope (and may still be, like I said haven't watched in a long time).

Like I said you cannot discount how handy Snap-Ons diagnostic libraries are. EGR fault? Knock sensor code? Battery not charging? You literally do a few clicks and have specs, wire colors with corresponding pins and voltage specs and it will even set up the meter or scope for you to test. I hardly champion their stuff but they do make very good scan tool software. The troubleshooter also becomes a great wealth of information if you regularly work on 10-20 year old stuff such as a certain make having coil shorting problems due to rain water run-off from the trim cracking.

 

[Tallpilot]

I agree. I have a Vantage Ultra with 17.4. Having firing order, connector pin outs and specs right there on the tool is a big time saver. I recommend Snap-on over other aftermarket scan tools.

Eric certainly did buy the Verus and has kept it updated plus the couple repairs. He most likely has as spent as much on updates as the original tool cost. I think it’s interesting that it kept breaking. You hear plenty of complaints about Snap-on diagnostic platforms but not that they are unreliable.

 

[jkesselr]

I have no doubt that the Snap-on offering is the best in the business. The issue for me is the cost. I am just a weekend warrior who like to have good tools. That said, I generally drive nice things these days, but still like to work on junk of all ages. I don't have a problem spending $500-$1000 (maybe as high as $1,500) to get up to speed with something that handles through all of the newer stuff, but I have no desire to spend thousands of dollars on the latest and greatest from Snappy. Given my price range what do you guys think is the best way to go?

 

[Tallpilot]

My Ethos Tech was $1,000 and my Vantage Ultra was $1,200. They compliment each other but you probably want the scan tool first; the scope can wait a year. Be a little patient and look for good deals but get something with a recent version. 17.4 is current; 18.2 on April 1st.

 

[Skin]

I have no doubt that the Snap-on offering is the best in the business. The issue for me is the cost. I am just a weekend warrior who like to have good tools. That said, I generally drive nice things these days, but still like to work on junk of all ages. I don't have a problem spending $500-$1000 (maybe as high as $1,500) to get up to speed with something that handles through all of the newer stuff, but I have no desire to spend thousands of dollars on the latest and greatest from Snappy. Given my price range what do you guys think is the best way to go?

Few options in the Snap-On camp. For 1-1.5k you should be able to get an old Modis which was supported up to 2016. Its the one with the 4 channel scope and keys. Its old school but all the info is there. Only thing to be aware of is the plastic shell got brittle and the push nuts break letting the case split a bit. More of a nuisance than a real problem.

Alternately that should also be the ballpark for a recently up to date Solus Pro or Edge. You lose the scope diagnostic library but you get a good scan tool with bi-directional.


Last option buy a Vantage Ultra and get something like a $100-$200 Autel or Launch for the scan tool portion. I'd personally recommend either the old Modis or Vantage Ultra + a decent cheap scan tool primarily due to the wealth of info in the scope library. Pull codes and use the Vantage to diagnose. If you do stuff in your driveway and have wifi this doesn't become as big of a deal with access to something like Alldata or Mitchell.

If you're just going to be doing things like resetting BCMs and brakes you're wasting your money and you should just stick with spending a few hundred on the Autel or Launch.

 

[Volvotechdude]

You ever look at Autoenginuity? We had those at school and I thought they were pretty good. They don't do Volvos and are weak on Nissans but are pretty close to OEM offerings. Plus they've announced you can get there Giotto scan tool on an iPad/iPhone and soon Android devices.

 

[pelletman]

I have been happy with Autoenginuty for the most part. I am just a high level weekend warrior though