Screwdrivers...

[bareass172]

I really hope I'm not beating a dead horse here, but I did quite a bit of searching and reading on here and I didn't want to hijack anyone else's thread. It was harder than you might think to find good, concrete data on who makes a darn good screwdriver. Perhaps it's because so much of this is subjective.

So here's where I'm at. I've been using the same old mix of screwdrivers for years. Some Craftsman (soft tip ones), some Proto, and a mix of nothing else of consequence. I must admit that you guys are a bad influence on me, and the more I read the more I realize some of my tools changing from "somewhat adequate" to "woefully inadequate and needing replacement".

After a lot of reading it sounds like the ones to consider are Craftsman Pro series, Felo, and Wiha. I'll be up front, I seriously doubt I'd be willing to spend SO money on drivers unless they can cook me dinner too. I don't have a problem with SO at all, so please don't flame me, I just like making money with my tools rather than taking out a second mortgage to buy them.

So who falls where in this discussion? Any brands besides those 3 worth mentioning? I'm weary of Cman after the problems I've had with them in the last few years - failing business, warranty hassles, discontinued products, etc, but would still consider these if they shine above the rest.

Please include a reason besides just saying "I use 'X' brand" - I want to know why you prefer them.

Thanks so much for the advice!

 

[steveo3002]

what kinda work do you plan to use them on?

i have a hard handle ratchet snapy , was expensive but ive used the hell out of it , feels right in your hand and i would miss it alot , ends can be replaced as need be

 

[carterbeauford]

any of the three you mentioned are going to be better than Cman. Look for Felo on Amazon for your best bang for the buck.

 

[NathanB]

Wera, Williams hard handle, and vessel are also great quality.

 

[bcradio]

After a lot of reading it sounds like the ones to consider are Craftsman Pro series, Felo, and Wiha. I'll be up front, I seriously doubt I'd be willing to spend SO money on drivers unless they can cook me dinner too. I don't have a problem with SO at all, so please don't flame me, I just like making money with my tools rather than taking out a second mortgage to buy them.

I think you missed a bit of reading on here then... Virtually every thread I've read mentions how great the Williams black hard handles are. They are just like the old Snap-Ons. I would take a very serious look at these.

 

[methomas70]

Williams makes a set that I've read is identical to Snap-On's old hard-handles, which are a favorite of many people on this site.
Amazon has a set of 8 listed for $48.48 shipped!
No, they won't cook you dinner, but less than 49 bucks is definitely NOT second mortgage territory neither.
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002NH5F30/?tag=atomicindus08-20

There was a thread here back in July '13 titled, "Are Snap-On screwdrivers that much better?"
Here's a link:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=208672

I posted THIS on that thread:
"Re: Are Snap on screw drivers that much better?
24 years ago, after high school, I worked, for a while, in an auto repair shop. I wasn't a pro mechanic then, and I'm not now. But I do wrench my cars, motorcycles, & other stuff a few times a week. When I started, I had Craftsman stuff, about half was my grandfather's, the other half I bought. Every now and then, when I couldn't get a screw loosened, the mechanics there would loan me one of their Snap-on screwdrivers and I'd be able to loosen a fastener I couldn't before. In my little world, that's what I consider scientific proof.
They explained to me that it's simply a better engineered tool made of better materials than what I was using.
Is it 10 times the price? Yes.
Does it cost 10 times as much to make? No.
But it was better than what I owned at the time.

A lot of the better mechanics I worked with gave me the same advice. They said even if you don't do this stuff 40-80 hours a week, you should still spend about a hundred bucks on a set of pro-quality screwdrivers. It'll be one of the most commonly used tools in your lifetime, and a rounded fastener can ruin more than just your day."

And now, more than 24 years later, those old mechanics were right.
The Snap-On set of screwdrivers I shelled out a hundred bucks for are my go-to's. If only I knew about the Williams set then, I'd have two sets.

Mitch

 

[pauls_workshop]

See also this good recent thread over in hotdeals:

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=228799

This has an interesting review near the end of a screwdriver magazine shootout. Note, many not in that shootout for comparison. I recently ended up picking up a set of the Craftsman Professional on sale but haven't used them much yet. Channellock's Taiwan COO set scored 2nd in this shootout but many elsewhere on GJ did not like these, so the jury is out on that. The criteria used in the shootout and individual scores in different categories is not available, which whould have made it more useful. Still worth reading i think. - Paul

 

[relic7680]

My buddy bought a set of the Williams hard handles a while back and a I would recommend them. I'd have some myself if not for the fact that I already have Matco, Craftsman, Napa, and other drivers.

 

[NathanB]

IMO any of these brands are great, you just have to find which handle you like best

 

[Steevo]

I love my SK green handles:

They are fully comparable to any Snap-On hard handle.
(and Made in USA)

 

[IndyGarage]

As soon as I used a good soft handle, I gave up on all hard handle screwdrivers.


My favorites now are Felo's, Wera and Wiha.

 

[RRmech]

IMO, best screwdrivers I have ever owned were made by ENDERES.

 

[oldldh]

I bought the Proto Classic Professional "Yellow" handle screwdrivers...

I probably went a little overboard...

www.store.harryepstein.com/cp/Proto/PROTO-LG-SET.html

That link will get you 18 Proto drivers for $ 65.00!!!...Or $ 3.61 a piece!!!

Amazon sells the 19 piece set Proto # J9600C for $ 96.95...

If you have a brain fart, and want them all, Proto #J9900C will get you the 36 piece set pictured...the drawer picture is my Proto "brain fart"...

I love them...best screwdrivers I've ever used...

 

[AndrewH]

I just got these in the mail and they're very high quality, I'm so impressed that I just ordered the other 2 sizes to finish out the set!

 

[AV tinker er]

I have the old school red hard handled MAC drivers. We're my first quality set and I love the way they feel in my hand. Hard to find now-a-days though. But if you can get a screw gun or hex impact where you are working those beat out a driver any day of the week.

 

[speed bump]

Since a #2 Philips is likely your most used screwdriver buy one of each of the 3 brands you mentioned in that size (you can never have to many and if you do put them somewhere where kids or women can access them and you will no longer have that problem). Buy more or the brand you decided you liked best.

Or buy a 12v impact driver and rarely use screwdrivers unless it's really delicate or you can't fit the impact then your motley set will be just fine for every once in a while.

 

[1950mercury]

I bought s set of the red/black handle snap on on ebay that were new for about half price. Love them. I also have older snap on hard handles that came in a tool lot i bought a an estate sale and cant stand the square handles.

 

[tyndall]

I just got these in the mail and they're very high quality, I'm so impressed that I just ordered the other 2 sizes to finish out the set!

Yeah, they're great if you don't have a butter knife around.

 

[Hpozzuoli]

I love my SK green handles:

They are fully comparable to any Snap-On hard handle.
(and Made in USA)

Good taste

 

[Hpozzuoli]

Otherwise SO. If i left everything stacked in the drawer i dont think you could even see the screwdrivers. Around the house I use Klein.

 

[AndrewH]

Yeah, they're great if you don't have a butter knife around.

Shall I post QC issues from every other brand that exists today? **** happens and out of millions of screwdrivers they make a handful of isolated incidents doesn't mean they're all ****. And are you positive that person wasn't abusing the tool or doing something out of the ordinary besides driving a few screws? Was that Screwdriver fresh out of the box and those were the first and only screws driven? Or had he/she been using it for a year of daily abuse and it finally twisted? Please do let me know.

 

[kippieland]

I have set of Blue handled Wiha that I have used for a quite some time. They are great for the price. I have a set of Felo torcs that are awesome to. Very similar to the Wiha but a better handle. For Christmas I got a set Williams hard handles (same as SO.) I don't like the grip as much as the Wiha and Felo, but they are far better with very soft screws. Just my take.

 

[Bruce57]

I have Snap-On for work and the Williams for a home set. The Williams are about as good as the Snap-On, and you can't beat the price. If I were looking at another set for work I would consider the Williams.

 

[Wamsutta]

Get the Williams black handle drivers from toolsdelivered.com

 

[bareass172]

Just wanted to pop in and say thanks so far for all the feedback. Just reading this thread and the threads linked in it, and threads linked in those threads and so on I've been reading all day. It's a bit of overkill for a set of screwdrivers, I know, but I'm a "buy it once" kinda guy. Obviously in this situation I'm buying twice, but when my folks gave me that first Cman set years ago I'm sure it was whatever was on sale.

bcradio - you were right, I did forget some of the names I'd read when I started this post.

methomas70 - what you stated is the exact kind of feedback I'm interested in - real world. It's one thing to buy a tool and talk about it sitting in your toolbox, it's another to be able to give examples from use.

I want to reiterate that I don't have a problem with SO, and I agree that if it was clearly superior to everything else out there then I'd drop the coin on it. After reading and reading and reading though, there are 4 names (besides SO) that KEEP popping up over and over again as near comparable quality. Felo, Wiha, Wera and Williams. I must admit that I may rule out the Williams only because I've used hard handles for years (Cman, Proto) and I think I want to try a set of the softer handles. I'm going to check out the Felo, Wiha and Wera and weigh them against each other. My factors will be (in no certain order):

-Cost
-Function (hex bolster, strike tops, etc)
-Availability
-Warranty convenience (just in case)
-Access to matching drivers in case I want to expand into torx, hex, etc

Out of curiosity, where is Williams website? I searched for "JH Williams Tools" and several variants and only found them on 3rd party sales websites.

Thanks so much for the feedback so far, please keep it coming.

 

[ihateminimumwage]

Out of curiosity, where is Williams website? I searched for "JH Williams Tools" and several variants and only found them on 3rd party sales websites.

Thanks so much for the feedback so far, please keep it coming.

http://www.snaponindustrialbrands.com/30/home.htm

 

[oldldh]

I hate to get "bombed and strafed" by all the Craftsman haters here, but...

Craftsman Professional Screwdrivers ain't half bad, and they're on sale!!!

If you want a "non-hard handle", they'll do...

 

[bonneyman]

I bought the Proto Classic Professional "Yellow" handle screwdrivers...

I probably went a little overboard...

www.store.harryepstein.com/cp/Proto/PROTO-LG-SET.html

That link will get you 18 Proto drivers for $ 65.00!!!...Or $ 3.61 a piece!!!

Amazon sells the 19 piece set Proto # J9600C for $ 96.95...

If you have a brain fart, and want them all, Proto #J9900C will get you the 36 piece set pictured...the drawer picture is my Proto "brain fart"...

I love them...best screwdrivers I've ever used...

Gotta agree. I've been trying to assemble a set of the older Proto yellow handles. If the new ones are as good as the old ones, they'd be hard to beat for hard handles. They are not acetate material, so don't start stinking like other drivers do. Rounded 4-sided profile really fits well for a hard handle.
Enderes is also a stout tool, and they've come back from the brink, so, I'd consider supporting them.
Have been given a Wiha comfort handle driver, but haven't used it yet. Looks very weird, but it supposed to be comfortable.

 

[d.mcfarland]

The Williams SO copies have a ton of people on here hooked ... definitely worth looking into, especially coming from a group of people very very picky about tools.

 

[jvitez]

I never realized how deficient I was in screwdrivers until I started on GJ! I've tried multiple brands as I like variety, and to me the biggest thing is handle shape. I've got medium size hands, so what fits for me might be the exact opposite for a 6'6" guy.

What I use for woodworking/around-the-house use is different than garage/automotive/machinery work. If things can get greasy or oily, then something with a rough finish is best. My two favorites are the Williams Snap-On clone, and Wiha Soft Finish.

For cleaner work, it depends if you need to use a lot of torque. If so, something with fluted handles will work well and not need a death grip on the handle. Pratt-Read, Wilde, or the yellow handled Protos in the above pics are good examples.

For gentler work, smooth hard handles are nice, like the green SK in Steevo's post. These are smaller diameter too.

For my hands, the most comfortable handles are PB Swiss, Wiha 3K, or Felo Ergonic. I don't find the Wera handle to be comfortable at all, though they do look very cool.

What type wor work do you mostly do? That's how you'll pick what's best for you, and why you see so many differing opinions here.

An awesome multi-bit screwdriver in addition to a full set of individuals is Picquic. I'll toot my fellow Canuck's horn as the handle is made in Canada, bits in Taiwan, but they're very popular here for a good reason, available to you via Amazon.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0018IYTYQ/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[spotco2]

My go to is a ratcheting SO with changeable tips.

My heavy use and abuse is a mix of old SO hard handle (like the Williams) and the green handle SK.

Strangly, my favorite in my hand (it's the only phillips head screwdriver that stays inside the house) is a Facom. I love the way it feels and it is extremely well made.

 

[bareass172]

To answer the question (I forgot to earlier) I am a motorcycle mechanic by trade, but like many of you I'm handy and will use them for just about everything.

There is such strong sentiment for the Williams hard handles that I may end up with 2 sets by the time I'm finished... The basic Williams set is only about $50 on Amazon, so it might not be that bad to have 2 good sets around for different things. With that said, the idea of a ratchet style w/ bits was floating around in my head as a separate purchase. I have some old junky ones but nothing I'd depend on day in and day out. I see guys consistently refer to the SO ratchet driver as "the best" over and over, and I've seen guys say they have "both" of them. On SO's website I only see a simple black handle one and a T-handle version. Are those the 2 types I've seen guys talking about?

jvitez - thanks for the feedback on the handles, that is specifically something I'm interested in. I'm a big guy and my hands are typically bigger than everyone I know, it's one of the reasons why I was thinking the ergo style handles - they look bigger.

Still reading, still learning...

 

[ihateminimumwage]

I see guys consistently refer to the SO ratchet driver as "the best" over and over, and I've seen guys say they have "both" of them. On SO's website I only see a simple black handle one and a T-handle version. Are those the 2 types I've seen guys talking about?

The ratcheting screwdriver is one of those tools I viewed as a gimmick until I actually used one. The Snap-On one is my go-to if I can't fit my impact driver.
They are also sold under the Williams name at a fraction of the cost.
Regular:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002NI1LZK/?tag=atomicindus08-20
T-Handle:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B001DNT68U/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[jdmstr]

I would go for the craftsman pros i really like mine. I have a set of sk suregrips(new us made) too and they are the same shanks as the craftsman pro but the craftsman have a better handle. Either is a good choice though.

 

[jvitez]

Bare: if your hands are big, you'll probably really like the Williams. They're hard handled but have some type of fine texture to the surface so they don't slip much when oily. The Wiha Soft Finish are the best for oily grip, but the Williams do have larger handles than many. They feel "chunky" in my hands (size 7-7.5 gloves), so I'd bet you'd like them. Plus they're USA made and a very good price. I liked them enough I bought 2 sets to fill out every size and type I could get. The first set didn't have all the Phillips sizes and length I wanted so I bought the second set. I've got more slotted screwdrivers now than I need, but it was cheaper to buy the two sets than to try and piece them together individually.

Now, about ratcheting screwdrivers. I too thought they were a gimmick, but then I got a Toptul ratcheting one, and boy it comes in handy at times. I liked it enough I sprung for two Snap-On ratcheting drivers. After I got them I do realize what all the hype is about, they're excellent with great tips, smooth ratcheting action, and a nice precise direction mechanism, but I had buyers remorse when I realized what I paid. Here are the ones I bought:

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...4148&group_ID=675083&store=canada&dir=catalog

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...3055&group_ID=681248&store=canada&dir=catalog

They both have large handles. The soft grip one is actually really too big for my hands, bigger than the plastic handle one.

One more point: the Williams ratcheting screwdrivers are made in Asia (China IIRC), definitely not USA. The Snap-On ratcheting drivers are USA made.

 

[ihateminimumwage]

One more point: the Williams ratcheting screwdrivers are made in Asia (China IIRC), definitely not USA. The Snap-On ratcheting drivers are USA made.

The Williams ratcheting screwdrivers I linked are USA made, as well as their other T-handle drivers (WRST1, WRST4, WRST8). Just look in the Snap-On Industrial catalog.

 

[SS5150]

I really like the Witte drivers (which are rebranded everywhere), they have a bunch of different handle styles and the tips are awesome. I use the old Napa versions by far the most (unfortunately not available at Napa anymore) but I have Matco, Cornwell, & John Deere rebrands floating around too. They all have different style handles but they are all great.

I have (had) Snap On hard handles, soft grips, and instincts, and the instinct (soft) handle is good but they've lowered the quality of the shank compared to my old SO hard handles. I ended up trying the Napa drivers a few years back after reading up on them on here and I personally really prefer them. I did keep my SO hard handles at home, sold my soft grips and my instincts are backups now but they're green so I may ebay them for some extra money. Witte offers a wide variety of tips, grips, and handle shapes. Well worth your time to look into them.

 

[jdmstr]

I hate to get "bombed and strafed" by all the Craftsman haters here, but...

Craftsman Professional Screwdrivers ain't half bad, and they're on sale!!!

If you want a "non-hard handle", they'll do...

+1 ill back you up on the craftsman pro

 

[1cargarage]

Since a #2 Philips is likely your most used screwdriver buy one of each of the 3 brands you mentioned in that size (you can never have to many and if you do put them somewhere where kids or women can access them and you will no longer have that problem). Buy more or the brand you decided you liked best.

^This^​

A 4" #2 is and forever will be the most often reached for screwdriver in the box. If you don't want to commit to a full set of a particular brand for $$$ reasons, then just buy the individual 4" #2 to get a feel for the brand (style). If it doesn't work perfectly then throw the offending driver in the pickup or in the kitchen drawer for infrequent use until you find the one.

IMHO Bahco and Mac drivers have the most comfortable handles if you're into soft grip handles. Both species feature large hard plastic grips with soft rubber sections where you need them, "oversize" handles that are easy to grip, and the ends of the handles are rounded which makes putting excessive downward pressure less stressful on your palm. In my experience, this is where the handles of Snap On Instinct drivers fall very short. The Mac drivers have a "tri-lobal" grip, i.e. the grips are like a very rounded equilateral triangle, and are VERY comfortable. The Bahco driver grips are circular and are also very comfortable.
For my money, both are equally good. Bahco does you the favor of color coding their drivers for tip style which is a nice feature if you store them in a manner that conceals the tips. Bahco was originally a Swedish company that was renowned for the quality of their steel (their logo is a fish because their company's genesis occurred in fish hook manufacturing (I think...)). Bahco was acquired by Snap On a few years back and, to my knowledge, has not cut corners regarding the quality of their tools. The Mac drivers are made overseas, which (understandably) is an automatic red flag for some. Those two are my favorites.

Get a 4" #2 of each and see if they work for you.

.02

 

[ibedayank]

N.O.S. SK made by Facom
$59.90 for 15 piece set free shipping
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SK-Tools-15...S_Srewdrivers_Nut_Drivers&hash=item461af0336f