Sears Roebuck Radial Arm Saw

[Freshmeat]

As a kid I remember helping my grandfather build picture frames from driftwood at our camp as well as pot hangers from fresh lumber. He had this amazing saw that seemed to do absolutely anything he wanted it to do…

Fast forward about 20 years and I'd long forgotten about the saw… until a discussion with my uncle a couple days ago. We were talking about cleaning out our camp after it flooded during Hurricane Isaac. Two of my uncles had cats out there for over five years (one's a vet and will rescue anything he can) in the base floor so there was cat funk and poop all over the place (despite having six litter boxes that were cleaned weekly). We'd been meaning to get out there and clean it throroughly since they got rid of the cats and the flood gave us the reason to do it.

So back on topic… we were discussing what all we needed to throw out, setting up a game plan since we only had one day to do most of the primary clean-out. My uncle asked if I wanted Papa J's old table saw that was hiding under all the tools and fishing stuff piled up on top of it.

My wife and I have a baby on the way. I've been wanting to start doing carpentry stuff so I can build shelves in the baby room and my garage, so I tossed out a, "Sure…" not really thinking much of it. Got out to the camp and we started throwing out junk on top of junk… rotted boards, old fishing gear, every single life jacket we had was left floating in the muck of the flood…

and eventually we uncovered the table saw (which is actually a radial arm saw). The water had come up JUST high enough to soak through the platform and it was bloated and crumbling apart. We tore off most of it so it didn't get the bacteria-infested pieces in our faces while we were loading it into the truck. Plugged it in just to see if it even still works, as it hasn't been used since at least 2004, and it whirred to life like it had never stopped running. It's SIGNIFICANTLY quieter than my year-old circular saw.

So here it is…

The plan is to remove the saw assembly from the stand. I'll media blast and repaint the stand and clean up the assembly as thoroughly as possible. The wheels are all seized so I drenched them in industrial penetrating oil and will hope they free up since I've never seen a design like these- they're able to raise/lower to make the table stationary. Once it's all cleaned up and the base is repainted I'll cut a new platform and start building! As it was, the shelf/cabinet plan was to keep everything super simple, but now that I have this saw available I'll be able to step up the construction game big time.

I'm very curious about just how old this thing really is. Is there a way to look up the model number or any other indicator to find the vintage?

 

[signcrafter]

There should be a model number and serial number on the back of the frame if it isn't wore off. They had a HUGE recall on these saws and depending on the model/serial number they will either send you a new table top and gaurd or will give you 100(I think) dollars if you send in the saw head. If you fall into the table top/gaurd group you will get a nice thick table top for free. Google craftsman radial arm saw recall.

 

[mbatarga]

I've got the motorized version of that model - or very similar to it - as many of the parts look identical to yours. I've had mine since 1986.

 

[Freshmeat]

There should be a model number and serial number on the back of the frame if it isn't wore off. They had a HUGE recall on these saws and depending on the model/serial number they will either send you a new table top and gaurd or will give you 100(I think) dollars if you send in the saw head. If you fall into the table top/gaurd group you will get a nice thick table top for free. Google craftsman radial arm saw recall.

Wow, I'll have to look into that. Thanks for the information!

I've got the motorized version of that model - or very similar to it - as many of the parts look identical to yours. I've had mine since 1986.

What do you mean by motorized version?

 

[andywander]

I've got the motorized version of that model - or very similar to it - as many of the parts look identical to yours. I've had mine since 1986.

"Motorized" Version????

 

[Freshmeat]

That wasn't hard to find! Now to investigate...

 

[Freshmeat]

There should be a model number and serial number on the back of the frame if it isn't wore off. They had a HUGE recall on these saws and depending on the model/serial number they will either send you a new table top and gaurd or will give you 100(I think) dollars if you send in the saw head. If you fall into the table top/gaurd group you will get a nice thick table top for free. Google craftsman radial arm saw recall.

Wow!! Sir, if you are EVER in the Baton Rouge area, please let me know- I owe you lots of beer!

I found the official site, punched in my model number, and ordered my retrofit kit, which includes a brand new table top!!

I'm beyond myself right now!

 

[signcrafter]

Glad I could help!

The table top is pretty nice. I never did put the improved guard on.

Now get that saw back to working and make grandpa proud!

 

[Justanoldguy]

I'm beyond myself right now!

Any pics?
I've always wondered what that looked like.

 

[RCStocker]

Don't get to excited. They are hard to set up and keep aligned.
They are not good for ripping or mitering corners. They are a cut off saw. I know they were sold as multi purpose. Your saw is worth about $50. Now that we have sliding compund saws these have been put to rest.

I have a nice cabinet shop and machine shop. I have a 3 thousand dollar Dewalt saw and the only think I use it for is to cross dato. It has a 17 inch slide. I put a dato set on it and use it for cross datoing. I have a pannel router that works better. They use them in the lumber yard for cutting lumber and if you have random lenght framing lumber or are cutting rafters on the job they work but as I said the get out of wack just by moving them.

I know it was from the family but if you want to do wood working get a table saw and power miter box. The radial arm saw has a lot of kick back and lifts the wood. The angle cuts are only good for framing.

You can buy the big expensive ones for $200 to $300. I buy and sell machiner and tools. Not as my living but to make extra money. I have had a dozen of the sears saws or more. I gave my last 2 away when I bought out the whole shop. I did not want to take them back to the store. Sorry but that is how I feel about the ****** things. A good 10 inch saw blade will cost more than the saw is worth. Try Forest blades.

 

[ATC]

Funny this thread should pop up. My father just picked up a Sears Craftsman radial arm saw a couple weeks ago. From the serial number, it looks like it was made in the early '60's!

Just this afternoon, I helped him tear it down to clean/oil/lube/wax/never-sieze every moving part. She's good as new, ready for another 50 years of service!

 

[jamesemery728]

Sorry to rain on your parade, and this is only my opinion, but I would sell that ASAP or leave it in the corner as a family heirloom. As was said above, radial arm saws are extremely unforgiving and dangerous in my opinion. If your workpiece that you are cutting is not perfectly positioned against the fence it will kickback and scare the beejeepers out of you. My Dad had one of these when I was a kid and it was my least favorite tool. Before I put a lot of effort and expense into restoring that saw I would get a good table saw. You may find the saw useful after a lot of practice with it but to me they are not worth the risk and learning curve. Sorry if this post offends you or anyone else but I would rather you knew the risks involved with these saws than see you lose a finger or a hand.

 

[woody 73]

I only wish I could show you fellows some amazing youtube videos of what those saws can do. Yes all power tools are dangerous, yes the RA has been replaced by the compound saw, yes the cheap RA saws can go out of alignment very easy, yes all power tools are unforgiving....

Once the Horse is down it is not nice to keep kicking it ; to the op clean up that old girl see if it was recalled,paint it and use it. Somewhere on the net (not sure where), but there must exist a site that tells how to read the code on that label, keep looking and if you find out please share it with us.

 

[Outlawmws]

I only wish I could show you fellows some amazing youtube videos of what those saws can do. Yes all power tools are dangerous, yes the RA has been replaced by the compound saw, yes the cheap RA saws can go out of alignment very easy, yes all power tools are unforgiving....

Once the Horse is down it is not nice to keep kicking it ; to the op clean up that old girl see if it was recalled,paint it and use it. Somewhere on the net (not sure where), but there must exist a site that tells how to read the code on that label, keep looking and if you find out please share it with us.

A significant (and often ignored) factor is the blade in the RA saw, and the rake of the teeth. RAS's generally do better with a 0 or negative rake blade. Table saws are the opposite and do better with positive rake. Using a T saw blade in a RAS is going to be more entertaining at times...

Moral of the story: Get the right blade for the saw.

 

[zkling]

X 1000 on the proper blade recommendation. Unfortunately the craftsman radial arm saws gave a bad name to all radial arm saws. Due to their lack of rigidity, multiple design flaws, and improper blade.

I personally think a properly adjusted radial arm saw is much safer and at sometimes more useful than a small table saw. I have a old Delta 14" multiplex that is really a work horse, but it weighs ~4x of that craftsman. One thing that is really nice with the radial saw is that you can see the blade at all times.

Back to the blade. Look for a blade with a negative rake angle. I like the LU91R series from Freud. The cutting mechanics of a radial arm saw are completely different than that of a table saw. Basically a radial arm saw is like feeding a table from the back. This cutting action requires different cutting geometry.

Even with the proper blade and good tune, it is best practice to NEVER place anything you would like to keep in one piece in line with the blade, in a radial direction.

 

[gpalmer77]

I have this exact model, I should check out the recall.

Thanks also for the blade recommendations.

For those people who are poo-pooing the RAS, maybe they're not great if you have a well kitted out tool shop, but for guys like me that have limited resources, they are golden. It might not be the best way to do "something", but you can do more "somethings" with the RAS than a lot of "unitasker" tools. Once I learned how to use it correctly, I'll take it over a table saw any day in terms of safety.

I "remodeled" our house down to studs and car-siding, and I've used the RAS more than any other electrical tool bar my drill/driver.

 

[camarotoolman]

They are extreamly dangerous. If you are going to keep it, you can make a new table out of some scrap plywood and save your money for something more usful.

 

[Major Ramifications]

Camarotoolman,
He doesn't need to make a new table, they will send him a free one in the recall kit.
As soon as I saw this was a Craftsman RAS thread, I clicked on it to tell about the recall. It's a pretty nice box of parts for FREE!
As others have said, it is important to select the correct blade for these saws, you may have to go to a tool supply house or Grainger, MSC or McMaster.
The other thing is that they are made to cut in one direction.

As far the motorized version, they had a dealie that moved the motor/blade along the carriage for you. Didn't they also have a motorized up/down as well?

The RAS is quieter because your circular saw uses a universal motor and the RAS uses an induction motor.

Dehmam Springs is a nice area, BTW. I used to drive up there to got to Bass Pro Shops and ride the NASCAR simulator.

 

[neonnblack]

They are extreamly dangerous. If you are going to keep it, you can make a new table out of some scrap plywood and save your money for something more usful.

Radical Harm Saw. I was thinking of putting a metal cutting blade on theone we have. dont know if thats a bad idea, its one thing to have a wooden board shoot across, but a 1/8 thick piece of steel

 

[Freshmeat]

The warnings are appreciated, but most pretty well negated your arguments with the extremities of the statements. While this may not be the best piece of equipment out there it will still be great for the intended purpose. Further, I already have all the cleaning supplies and paint I'll be using… and the retrofit kit will come with a new tabletop, so this will be a VERY minimal investment on my part. I don't see where I can go wrong as long as it's used in as safe a manner as possible. That said, please don't take me as blowing you off. Your points are taken and if/when I begin to expand my projects into more complex creations I'll likely start looking for something more versatile to handle more precise jobs.

For those who offered constructive suggestions they are greatly appreciated. It's going to be a very long 8-10 weeks waiting for the retrofit kit, but at least it does give me time to get this thing all cleaned up and ready for the new table.

I believe this will be a great tool for me. Would I be able to do more with a full-on cabinet shop? Absolutely! However, for someone just getting started with this stuff, this is going to do very well. I've been reverse-engineering a lot of the shelving, benches, and pot racks my grandfather built WITH THIS SAW and can't wait to get started in replicating his work for family members. I realize it may never produce high-end commercial work, but I'm not looking to make money on the stuff I build.

It'll just be something to do that's cheaper than buying more parts for my Jeep.

As far as the safety issues go… can someone explain to me how I can utilize this saw in the safest fashion? I'm guessing I don't want to be standing parallel to the blade, judging by all the references of kicking. Further, I saw someone mention using a wood "pusher" stick instead of having a finger near the blade… that seems pretty damn wise and I'll absolutely keep that in mind when the time comes.

Further… regarding a new blade… does anyone care to explain the references you guys are tossing around? If you know of a site that explains different blade designs I'd be happy to read up for myself, too. I've been working on automobiles since I was five so I can tell you plenty of things related to them… but I'm lost when it comes to carpentry. This will be my first real venture into wood working, so please be patient with me as I go through this.

 

[kc-steve]

There should be a model number and serial number on the back of the frame if it isn't wore off. They had a HUGE recall on these saws and depending on the model/serial number they will either send you a new table top and gaurd or will give you 100(I think) dollars if you send in the saw head. If you fall into the table top/gaurd group you will get a nice thick table top for free. Google craftsman radial arm saw recall.

Yeah, but the recall has been around for a long time. I wouldn't go buy one thinking it comes with a $100 from Craftsman because they likely have already paid the money out for most of them, if not all of them.

In fact, I think the gov has a legal thing about selling something with a recall on it.

Steve

 

[Outlawmws]

Yeah, but the recall has been around for a long time. I wouldn't go buy one thinking it comes with a $100 from Craftsman because they likely have already paid the money out for most of them, if not all of them.

In fact, I think the gov has a legal thing about selling something with a recall on it.

Steve

It's about a 50-50 proposition in my experience. I've sent in two of them that no kit was available for (a third is in the wings) but a couple al you could get was the kit. the make you send in the motor and motor carrier, and provide a prepaid shipping box if yours is one that has no kit available. (It's not an optional thing for the owner, its either or...)

As to someone selling one that has a recall on it, you have to be aware of it for it to be a problem, and if anyone pays more then $100 for one of these they ain't too bright to begin with. (I've gotten 2 of them for free, paid $25 bucks for one just to get its motor to fix one that died...)

 

[Lkdelta]

A significant (and often ignored) factor is the blade in the RA saw, and the rake of the teeth. RAS's generally do better with a 0 or negative rake blade. Table saws are the opposite and do better with positive rake.

Sorry for the hi-jack, but while we're here...
got a pic of some of my 10" blades... an 18 tooth and a couple 40 teeth..
The top 2 have a different tooth arrangement. Is that what the Rake of the teeth is referring to?

 

[Outlawmws]

Those are all Positive rake blades:

Does this help?

 

[Lkdelta]

In that drawing, we would draw another line to the left of Y line for a negative rake measurement?

From the pic.. the bottom blade is getting "closer" to a zero rake than the top 2?

Just need to keep going "back" so that the "cutting tip" is behind the "carbide tip weld joint" ... right?

And yes, we do have a R-A-S in a garage in the family..
always keep a good strong grip on that saw handle for any kind of cross-cut/Dadoing

If possible, I use the Circular saw or Table saw for ripping

 

[mbatarga]

Okay - to explain my motorized version - it has a digital display at the user end of the arm. That display alternates between "elevation", "bevel" and "miter" settings.

For the bevel and miter settings, the LED readout changes and displays the angle of miter angle as you manually swing the arm left/right and/or displays the bevel angle as you pivot the motor/blade assembly. This readout is accurate to 0.5 degrees.

For the elevation setting, the readout displays the height or a distance. As an example, lets say I want to cut a dado .5 inches deep on a 2 inch thick board. I lay the board on the table with the blade raised above the board height. I then press the down key on the keypad and the motorized arm is activated and starts lowering. Once I get close to the board surface, I can toggle the down button on/off to sneak up on the board surface so that the lowest blade tooth is just touching the board. I don't care what the display indicates at this time, as that's not relevant. I now press the Reference button and the display updates to read 0.0 (inches). I push the blade/motor back behind the fence (away from/off the board), enter -0.5 and then the Act button. The motorized arm then activates and is lowered 0.5 inches. The blade will now cut a slot/dado that is exactly 0.5 inches deep referenced to the top surface of the board.

 

[jtbinvalrico]

OP......clean the saw up, fit the new parts to it and use it. I've got several old and impractical tools that I keep around for various reasons - some of them sentimental. That said, be careful and respect the tool as the old guy did, and you'll make him proud.

 

[turbowoodworker]

When you call for the upgrade set/recall stuff, ask them to send you an owner's manual. I just picked up a similar model on CL and got the recall set and manual. The manual is excellent on the safety issues peculiar to RAS and it is not a simple xerox of the 1975 manual but an up to date issue. One point about the RAS is that most of the bad press came from accidents occuring during rip operations. This saw is a great tool for crosscuts but remains dangerous for rip cuts because your hand can actually be pulled into the blade. I have a good table saw for ripping and the RAS is used for crosscut and as a dedicated dado set.
Just read and follow the safety recommendations and never lose respect for that whirling blade.
And congrats on restoring such a good tool and family legacy.

 

[Freshmeat]

Dado
Cross cut
Rip cut

All words with which I apparently need to familiarize myself.

Thanks for all the information, guys! You've all been a great help. Maybe Sunday I can sand and repaint the stand...

 

[Justanoldguy]

OP......clean the saw up, fit the new parts to it and use it. I've got several old and impractical tools that I keep around for various reasons - some of them sentimental. That said, be careful and respect the tool as the old guy did, and you'll make him proud.

Ditto.

Way too much over thinking in this thread.
Just get out and use it.

 

[WWIIjeep]

Dado
Cross cut
Rip cut

All words with which I apparently need to familiarize myself.

I strongly suggest that you buy a book on radial arm saw techniques.

This one is fairly popular:

http://www.mrsawdust.com/contents.php

Or one of these:

Getting the Most Out of Your Radial Arm Saw, Rockwell Manufacturing Co., Cat. No. 33-047, 1969 (out of print, but commonly available on eBay, Amazon, and other sources of used and out-of-print books)

Cliffe, Roger W., Radial Arm Saw Basics, Sterling Publishing Co., 1991 (good basic book, may still be in print)

Cliffe, Roger W., Radial Arm Saw Techniques, Sterling Publishing Co., 1986 (more detailed than his basic book and was still in print as recently as 4 years ago)

DeCristoforo, R.J., How to Choose and Use Power Tools, Arco Publishing Co., 1960 (has been reprinted many times, may still be in print in a new edition)

DeCristoforo, R.J., The Magic of Your Radial Arm Saw, Scharff Associates, 1985 (also has been reprinted many times, more detailed than his older book)

Scharff, Robert, The Complete Book of Home Workshop Tools, McGraw-Hill, 1979 (has a short and well-written section on radial arm saw use)



Set up properly, with a good-quality saw blade, radial arm saws can excel at crosscutting operations and are more versatile than a "chop" type miter saw. If I could only have one saw in my shop, it would be a radial arm saw.

One of the best and most readily-available blades is the Forrest Woodworker 1, which is ground properly for radial arm saw use and available from amazon.com, often on sale for a decent price compared to the manufacturer's list price. Freud also makes several blades appropriate for radial arm saw use.

Along with the other words you mentioned, you need to familiarize yourself with the word "push stick" which was mentioned somewhere upthread. Normally on a radial arm saw, you only need a push stick if you are ripping lumber, a job for which a radial arm saw is not ideal to begin with, especially for an inexperienced woodworker. Push sticks are normally used on table saws or other saws for small or narrow work where otherwise, your fingers would be too close to the blade.

 

[Freshmeat]

WWIIjeep- thanks for the references. I'll definitely check into those books and get at least one.

 

[Lkdelta]

One of the best and most readily-available blades is the Forrest Woodworker 1, which is ground properly for radial arm saw use and available from amazon.com,

Freud also makes several blades appropriate for radial arm saw use.

I searched Forrest woodworker over on amazon, lots of FW II series, but didn't see much in F-W1... 10", some where around 40 teeth?

also looked for some 20ish teeth blades for more rough work, didn't see anything in that range


Would miter saw blades be appropriate for RAS?

 

[WWIIjeep]

I searched Forrest woodworker over on amazon, lots of FW II series, but didn't see much in F-W1... 10", some where around 40 teeth?

Forrest WW I 10" blades are 60T, which is a good choice for high-quality crosscutting.

http://www.forrestblades.com/woodworker_1.htm

Don't let the list prices scare you, they can be had in the range of 30% to 40% off of that, but not all the time. Amazon tends to run blade sales on various brands including Forrest WW I once in a while, and that's the time to pick them up.

also looked for some 20ish teeth blades for more rough work, didn't see anything in that range

You mean like construction framing work or green lumber?

Ideally, you'll want two blades if you're planning to do that and trim or fine finish work too, because it's a bit of a waste to use an ultra high-quality cabinetmaking blade like the Forrest WW I for rough framing.

Would miter saw blades be appropriate for RAS?

Yes, conditionally. Miter saw blades usually have a negative hook angle appropriate for radial arm saw use, but high-quality ones can be almost as expensive as the WW I. Cheap ones like you'll find at the big orange retail giant are just that--cheap, and consequently made with low-quality carbide that neither comes well-sharpened , nor holds a good edge for cabinet-quality finish work (regardless of whatever hype is on the packaging). They'd be a good choice for your "rough work" IMO.

Here's one that might be OK as a compromise between Forrest or Freud and the BORG:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003XREDZK/?tag=atomicindus08-20

I've never tried that particular blade, but it's got decent specs.

BTW, the more readily available Forrest WWII blades aren't recommended for radial arm saw use as packaged, but Forrest will custom-grind a blade any way you want one. However, by the time you do that, you're at or above the price of a WW I, which comes ground for radial arm saw use to start with.

 

[matthew]

I've got a similar saw, and got the recall kit. I believe it came with a complete manual in the box, although I had the original manual anyways (if you don't get a manual in the box, I think it's on the recall website, or drop me a PM and I'll scan it for you).

The new guard is significantly better than the original, but can make changing blades a bit of a pain. You may also want to put a layer of 1/4" plywood on the new table, to use as a sacrificial tabletop that you can replace if necessary.

I'm planning on installing a set of hold-down clamps on mine, to make sure my fingers stay safe and so work is held firmly. Also keep in mind the saw doesn't have an electric brake, and doesn't have the on switch in the handle. Respect the saw, and remember that good safety habits are what keep you safe, if you don't make it a habit you'll let down your guard sometime and slip up.

My dad has done some ripping with the RAS, but I've got a table saw now, and it's better set up for that. The RAS is better suited to crosscuts than ripping.