Security camera wiring advice needed

[1233user]

I want to run some wiring for security cameras before I close up the walls in my garage, and I would like advise as to what type of wire to run. I don't have any cameras or any other equipment yet, so I'm not already married to a certain type of system.

I have a motion light outside each entry door, and my plan is to install a camera outside each door to cover the entrances. Ideally those cameras will be hidden somewhere close to the light, maybe even in something attached to the light, but that will be figured out later. For now I just want to make sure I get the wiring run.

From what I have seen the 2 popular options are cameras that run off either coax, or POE using cat5 or cat6 ethernet cable. Which one of those would be the best platform to use? Or is there another better option?

My knowledge of security cameras is very limited, so I would really appreciate any advise on the best route to take.

Thanks!

 

[keelan]

Re: Security camera wiring advise needed

Run cat-5e. If you go with IP cameras, they will use ethernet, and be powered via PoE. If you decided to go with analog cameras, you can use a balun to put the video on one pair, and then gang the remaining 3 pairs for power. For a security camera, cat-6 is beyond overkill.

 

[pmiranda]

Re: Security camera wiring advise needed

The only reason I'd use cat-6 instead of -5e is if it's become so common in your area that it's cheaper. I was surprised to find Cat5 cheaper than Cat3 until I thought about the fact that almost nobody bothers with Cat3, and I think -3 has thicker conductors with more copper in them.

 

[wssix99]

Re: Security camera wiring advise needed

Run the Cat6. I did the Coax o. The recommendation of a security installer and now regret it. All the new stuff seems to be exclusively on the Cat6 and that's the only way to get the higher definition options. (Coax has limits.)

 

[nh_yota]

Re: Security camera wiring advise needed

Run Cat6 because you can use it for lots of different things besides security cameras.

 

[2CWG]

Re: Security camera wiring advise needed

I'd respectfully suggest that Cat6 is preferred for new installations. It does better in 'noisy' EM environments, provides significantly more headroom than previous standards (if you get 550MHz-rated cable) and the cost difference is usually trivial in the overall scope of a project. Installing the connectors properly on each end can make a huge difference in performance, so make certain that's done right and leave enough slack in the runs for a few attempts. Since the interior of Ethernet cable can theoretically provide a path for airflow (moisture issues), you may want to consider sealing the end that's exposed to exterior conditions once the connections are complete. As was mentioned earlier, current generation security cameras don't require significant bandwidth so if the cost is prohibitive then go with a *quality* Cat5e option.

Regardless of which you choose, how about installing some type of conduit w/pull-string before you close up the walls? Could make future changes/upgrades easier. If not for the entire run, you could install conduit where it is tough to make runs later (perpendicular to joists, through stud runs and such).

Another option to consider while doing runs is one to the center of garage ceiling for a hemispheric dome camera. Having that 360deg overview of your garage interior is a very nice feature.

Let us know how it works out. Sounds like a great project.

 

[rayra]

POE / Cat6. You can use the wire for a wireless router / extender, too, streaming media to a garage TV, and for High Def cameras.


This is what I consider to be the 'Garage Journal' of security camera info -
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_10_17/...ble_of_Contents_in_OP____Updated_24_July.html

 

[Pardigital]

Definitely Cat6 for use with an IP camera system. Lots of good info at the IPCamTalk forums for this type of situation. I'm running 4 Hikvision IP cameras into a Network Video Recorder (NVR). I have access to my cameras via a web browser or my iPhone from anywhere.

 

[1233user]

Thanks everyone for all the replies!!

I have a spool of Belden cat 6a shielded cable that I am running in the garage for my network, tv, and phone so I will use that same cable to run to my camera locations.

I am happy to hear that the ethernet cable is the preferred way to go. It will make it easier for me using the same cable for everything.

 

[knobby]

POE / Cat6. You can use the wire for a wireless router / extender, too, streaming media to a garage TV, and for High Def cameras.


This is what I consider to be the 'Garage Journal' of security camera info -
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_10_17/...ble_of_Contents_in_OP____Updated_24_July.html

Good link

 

[1233user]

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_10_17/6...d_24_July.html

Good link

I agree! I am up to page 12 so far. I will keep going as I have time.

 

[Sage55]

Definitely Cat6 for use with an IP camera system. Lots of good info at the IPCamTalk forums for this type of situation. I'm running 4 Hikvision IP cameras into a Network Video Recorder (NVR). I have access to my cameras via a web browser or my iPhone from anywhere.

I just installed some Hikvision cameras on the house as well. I bought the 4MP models and am blown away by video quality.

@1233user if you have CAT6 then run it, otherwise CAT5e will also work just fine.

 

[ishiboo]

Cat 5E is just fine for even the next generation of cameras. Even the new HD cameras are still 10/100.

I just installed 8 Reolink 4MP cameras via a POE switch... the quality is amazing and it's so nice to be able to backhaul them from the barn to my house over GigE . If you purchase IP cameras make sure they are ONVIF compatible.

 

[ddawg16]

Cat6

Cost difference is not much, but the wire gauge is 23g vs 24 for Cat5/e

What this really means is you will have less voltage drop when doing POE (Power Over Ethernet).

One of the nice things about POE is you don't need and AC recept at the camera.

 

[Keel]

monoprice.com is a good source for cable,

 

[ishiboo]

monoprice.com is a good source for cable,

This.

Monoprice is very competitive on high quality cables. I got pissed at them due to issues with a Christmas gift, and ordered a bunch from Amazon and they were awful.

Whatever you do, buy pure copper cable.

 

[RoyBell]

If you live in a cold climate, some cameras need 12v in addition to the POE to run the heater.

 

[PeterT]

Cat6, but be sure you get the better quality, I personally like the solid. The cheap stuff from china off Amazon is pathetic. I shopped around and paid a little more for the USA made stuff and it is very good quality

This is what I would buy if I were to need more.
http://www.monoprice.com/Product?p_id=8108&gclid=Cj0KEQjw75yxBRD78uqEnuG-5vcBEiQAQbaxSDrf3H-PmhuSALl7dH0dHbf5zulmoBPsoKAr_QpDK0QaAtUa8P8HAQ

 

[Sage55]

Cat6, but be sure you get the better quality, I personally like the solid.

Regardless of CAT6 or CAT5e, solid should be used for all your cable runs. Stranded should really only be used for short cables, such as hooking your computer up to your keystone jack, router, etc - or patch panel to switch.

 

[Trey T]

From my experience, everybody, even in the commercial market is moving toward IP camera. I believe HD-SDI and coaxial cables are pretty irrelevant these days in the surveillance market as they were the main medium for commercial use.

The shift in the commercial market to move to completely toward IP cameras is due to ability to liveview or playback smoothly now (compare to HD-SDI) with the h.264 codec that the camera spit out.

No doubt in my mine that ethernet and POE is the way to go for residential and commercial security cameras.

 

[RoyBell]

The cost has come down significantly, along with the yearly subscription costs pretty much all eliminated. My only gripe is you can't plug and play like analog (different brand cameras to nvrs). Plus, most everything needs updating right out of the box...which requires logging into each camera individually and upgrading firmware manually. At least this has been my experience. We have decided to sub this kind of work out now.

 

[1233user]

Cat6, but be sure you get the better quality, I personally like the solid. The cheap stuff from china off Amazon is pathetic. I shopped around and paid a little more for the USA made stuff and it is very good quality

This is what I would buy if I were to need more.
http://www.monoprice.com/Product?p_id=8108&gclid=Cj0KEQjw75yxBRD78uqEnuG-5vcBEiQAQbaxSDrf3H-PmhuSALl7dH0dHbf5zulmoBPsoKAr_QpDK0QaAtUa8P8HAQ

I have a spool of Belden Cat6a solid copper wire that I will run to each possible camera location. This is the same wire that I am using for my network drops, and probably even my phone if I have enough left.

Thanks a lot for all the replies!

 

[ishiboo]

The cost has come down significantly, along with the yearly subscription costs pretty much all eliminated. My only gripe is you can't plug and play like analog (different brand cameras to nvrs). Plus, most everything needs updating right out of the box...which requires logging into each camera individually and upgrading firmware manually. At least this has been my experience. We have decided to sub this kind of work out now.

ONVIF cameras, which most of the new IP cameras are, are close to being pretty much plug and play these days. In BlueCherry I only have to enter a path (single character /) because they're not in the system.

Yeah, firmware updating *****. Many of the cameras only support IE for things and that's an even bigger pain.

 

[RoyBell]

ONVIF cameras, which most of the new IP cameras are, are close to being pretty much plug and play these days. In BlueCherry I only have to enter a path (single character /) because they're not in the system.

Yeah, firmware updating *****. Many of the cameras only support IE for things and that's an even bigger pain.

No kidding. I was on the phone with the tech support for an hour trying to update them. He kept telling me what I should had seen on my screen. I kept telling him I don't see that and the little that does display wasn't doing anything. We finally figured out I was on Firefox and needed to be on IE. People still use IE?

 

[XS29L9B]

Definitely Cat6 for use with an IP camera system. Lots of good info at the IPCamTalk forums for this type of situation. I'm running 4 Hikvision IP cameras into a Network Video Recorder (NVR). I have access to my cameras via a web browser or my iPhone from anywhere.

Please, more on the system, as I am in the market. Thanks

 

[Whiskeymike]

I know different areas may have different code, but generally speaking, should you run cat6 in conduit or is there a sheathing that is recommended when running it in an attic or open wall metal building?

 

[Trey T]

Although cat5e (350Mbps) can carry the bandwidth of a $100K cinema camera out there but I think there are more to it than speed, the quality of the content it transmit and I believe Cat6 is a good investment. Cable is just a small fraction of your system, I mean for a really really good system, it's probably like 5% or less of your budget.

The other aspect of a good surveillance system is video recording specs.

1. Video compression - two common ones are mJPEG (moving JPEG) or h.264, and h.264 is the most popular.

2. Frame rate - this is the most undervalued criteria. For a decent surveillance, it should be recorded at 30fps, for better surveillance record it at least 48fps. This will allow better opportunity to catch thieves at a given situation

3. Bitrate (Mbps) - this is what determine your quality of the video. the higher bitrate (aka bandwidth), the higher picture quality, but also the larger storage capacity it requires; it's a balancing act.

• For h.264 1080p 30fps will require about 5Mbps for decent picture. step it up to at least 10Mbps for better picture. Even better, go for 20Mbps+. A 20Mbps+ recording cost several thousand for a NVR.
• A network video recorder (NVR) (a very important product in this industry) bandwidth should always be considered. A 100Mbps 8channel NVR is not 100Mbps per channel, it's more like 100/8=12.5Mbps/ch or even less; it's very misleading. System out there that can produce 1080p but only 15fps, it's probably because of the max bitrate per recording channel, not the camera.

4. resolution. I put this at the bottom of the list because it's not very important, most cameras out there output at least 720p, which is plenty clear. the quality of the video merely important if bitrate and frame-rate isn't considered a high priority.

5. ONVIF - if you buy a kit system, then you dont need to worry about this. If you piecing together a system, then this is very important.

• ONVIF profile 1.0
• ONVIF profile 2.0
• ONVIF profile S (latest profile, IIRC) and backward compatible with 1.0 and 2.0

 

[PeterT]

Can anyone recommend a decent quality residential IP camera, I plan on buy 4 of them for my property. Also, I assume they make a special 'DVR' that these plug into, via the RJ45 (cat6 wire)? Is there a kit that anyone can recommend? I would like to install it myself but have decent quality picture resolution, maybe 1080 quality..

 

[ishiboo]

Can anyone recommend a decent quality residential IP camera, I plan on buy 4 of them for my property. Also, I assume they make a special 'DVR' that these plug into, via the RJ45 (cat6 wire)? Is there a kit that anyone can recommend? I would like to install it myself but have decent quality picture resolution, maybe 1080 quality..

Reolink RLC-410.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B010LH48F4/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Really nice picture quality for a fantastic price.

 

[PeterT]

Reolink RLC-410.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B010LH48F4/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Really nice picture quality for a fantastic price.

Excellent, so what does the POE mean? I would of thought that meant you didn't need anything other then the cat6, but you need a separate power run?

 

[A**holes Garage]

I'm putting a Hikvision 8) POE, 3mp, camera system in now. Using solid core Cat 6.
Going to run the cable next week, fabricating camera brackets, NVR lockbox bracket and wall plate first.

http://overseas.hikvision.com/us/products_10533.html

ADI Global carries the product line in the U.S. I've seen some on Amazon but some seem to be knock offs.

https://adiglobal.us/Pages/results....&dm=g&s=b&rf=MSxhZGl4YnJhbmRpZCwyLDEsMzMyMA==

 

[ishiboo]

Excellent, so what does the POE mean? I would of thought that meant you didn't need anything other then the cat6, but you need a separate power run?

POE is Power Over Ethernet. It can be powered by a POE switch (which some NVRs have built in) or via a 12v wall wart which is included. I run all mine POE.

 

[PeterT]

POE is Power Over Ethernet. It can be powered by a POE switch (which some NVRs have built in) or via a 12v wall wart which is included. I run all mine POE.

Ok, I got my POE switch and two of the Reolink RLC-410 cameras connected. I downloaded the PC based reolink software, I can find and view the camera's ... Good suggestion Ishiboo, the picture quality is outstanding.

Now i want to integrate an NVR unit for recording and viewing, in house and remotely via iphone. Can you suggest a decent one of those? Or can anyone chime in with advise?

 

[Kaizen]

timely discussion. I got robbed over the weekend and when I went to get footage found my garage dvr had died at some point in the last month. so if I get poe cameras what do they connect to? most off the shelf dvr's I see have the old connections. if I have 8 do they run to a hub and that goes wirelessly or does it go to my computer router? you guys talk about amazing detail can anyone put up a pic? one thing that has always bothered me is no matter how great my cameras I never get detail over ten feet away - and I've spent hundreds on a few of them.

 

[PeterT]

The benefit of the POE camera is you don't need to run a separate power cord, just the CAT5 (or CAT6).
You need to either get a NVR (similar to DVR) that has POE ports, or you can buy a 4 port POE switch off amazon for about $30.
I had planned to have 4 IP/POE cameras connected to a POE switch, then a cable from the POE switch to the NVR, but I am looking for recommendations on an NVR system.

 

[Kaizen]

but I can send data over a network to a home pc instead of a dedicated nvr? or is it an issue then due to the data streams. any suggestions on a decent router? sorry I'm lost on ip stuff.

 

[Davi]

When I used to be into reading up on home automation I believe they mentioned geovision for network based cameras. May be worth running a search on that and seeing what it brings up

 

[Trey T]

The benefit of the POE camera is you don't need to run a separate power cord, just the CAT5 (or CAT6).
You need to either get a NVR (similar to DVR) that has POE ports, or you can buy a 4 port POE switch off amazon for about $30.
I had planned to have 4 IP/POE cameras connected to a POE switch, then a cable from the POE switch to the NVR, but I am looking for recommendations on an NVR system.

I'm running a Linksys NVR which works well but has a slight bug with the web-UI. It's simple to use... I mean it should be, because half of the operations are done on the POE camera. I'm using the NVR as a central file server which made it attractive investment. There's no NVR mobile app like other systems (QNAP or residential systems).

I'm also using an 8-port POE (all ports) switch by Netgear.