security options

[cmc76]

I am doing some planning and thought i would put together my first actual post and see if anyone has ideas.
I am planning a build of a garage/shop structure.
I live in a " ok" area. But there are still lurking hobos, **** birds, drunks, clowns, assholes and general thieves.
So during planning, i want to be realistic. For overhead doors, i am wondering what options are out there short of using industrial style coiling OH doors rather than sectional. Can an opener that works directly off the torsion spring still be popped open?

For the man doors. Ive got a clear idea in mind. I will grout in a hollow metal frame, commercial door. But im concerned it will be kicked in. So ive been thinking up a vault type system. Basically weld tabs to the frame on the inside, then put together a system on the interior that will engage 4 pins into the locking tabs. What is holding me up is how to lock it from the exterior?

I do have some sketches i could add , in the event none of this makes sense....

But the real question is, for those of you with shop/garage space in a larger city. how are you protecting your space. I refuse to be one of those who leaves the garage wide open with nothing in it just to deter people from bothering to try breaking in.

 

[dave89iroc]

as for the man door, when forced, what usually fails is the jamb, so a commercial dead bolt into a reinforced jamb should stop 99.9% of forced attempts, but then, other than finessed entry(picking/defeating the lock), your vehicle door and walls are next

 

[Cougar]

Subscribed

 

[JimVonBaden]

For the man door there are many commercial options for bolt on "vault" type locking mechanisms that have key locks on the outside, and the bolts on the inside.

If you are really security conscious, there are electromagnetic bolt locks that you can use on your roll-up doors, note I didn't say partition type garage doors.

 

[Showkey]

I live in a " ok" area. But there are still lurking hobos, **** birds, drunks, clowns, assholes and general thieves.

So what kind of characters live in the bad areas ???

 

[bczygan]

You're gonna need something like this...

 

[bczygan]

Seriously....

Hide

Underground?

False walls

Hidden rooms

Camouflage

Misdirect

Junk for them to steal

Easy entry to avoid damage to building

Layers of protective barriers

Layers of quality recording

Methods for identifying

Let them in, but not back out

And.....

They can't steal what you don't have.

Bill

 

[cmc76]

as for the ones in " bad" areas. pretty much the same buy put " hyper" in front.
I had to chase off two drunk hobos who i think were eyeing my mower last year. So i really havent had an issue. Surprising what a reputation as a " crazy white dude with a shovel" will do as theft deterrent. But If i build a structure, move all my tools in. I want to go the extra mile.

It pisses me off when people get ambivalent about it. Like ' oh, you should have known". Nope, its my property. If I thought i would get away with it. Id be using bear traps.

 

[Ole Slewfoot]

 

[Mr_B]

9mm works nicely ... pretty easy secure side door via good 3 point locks, metal jam and engagement pin lugs on hinge side. solenoid controlled bolts on good sturdy roller door are not bad and easy live with via remote fob, needs be proper quality door though and frames need proper securing too. would have alarm with messaging system if you got means do it . Main thing is make it look normal on outside as visual high quality locks and military looking doors attracts attention .

 

[ddawg16]

I have NEVER taken a burglary report at a house that had a big dog.....

With that said....keys to not being a victim....

Don't let people know what you have. If your garage looks like an automotive shop...they will think you have lots of tools....they will want them. Make the garage look like a man cave....a lot less interesting to dirt bags.

Dogs....big dogs...that make lots of noise. Dirt bags will find a place with no dogs.

Motion lights....nothing says "Hello" better than a motion light.

Security cameras...visible. Lets you see what is going on...and lets the dirt bag know your watching.

If they want in bad enough....they will get in....it just usually means they do more damage in the process.

 

[Kaizen]

Man door swinging out not in so in addition to other deterrents it won't be kicked in. I won't be using my roll up doors much so toying with putting a steel cage on the inside so after they get through the door they hit a steel cage.


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[CN Spots]

Everything ddawg said + Insure everything. Record your SNs and keep photos. Keeping out mischievous teenagers is one thing but a tweeking crackhead is a whole different animal.

They'll back into the corner of the roll up door (and cage), bust it off the hinges and slither inside.

I saw a commercial last night for a motion light with a camera on it that sent live video to your phone. The user could even talk to the intruders via the phone. Seemed like a pretty good idea.

A PTZ with an integrated pellet gun would be more fun though.

 

[CN Spots]

This thing:

https://ring.com/floodlightcam

 

[theoldwizard1]

Motion lights....nothing says "Hello" better than a motion light.

On ALL exterior walls !

 

[bczygan]

 

[RegeSullivan]

Ddawg pretty much said it all. I can only add be sure you have and understand insurance before you need it. Figuring out what is and isn't covered after the loss *****.

A business near where I grew up had a block building with bars on windows, gates on both the man door, garage door and loading dock. Dirtbags went through the wall on a wooded side of the building with a sledge hammer. Next day the alarm company said they heard a truck backingfiring but no broken glass or voices.

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[theoldwizard1]

Side note : Watching a few YouTube videos, a good lock picker can open your average lock in under 1 minute. Under 30 seconds if he has seen it and picked it before. The good news is, this is more of an art (lots and lots of practice) than a science.

Almost no locks can stop the best, if given enough time. Most tubular locks are not any better. There are a few tubular locks that will re-lock once or twice during the rotation of the pick, but that just means he has to pick it again.

Your common padlocks are some of the worst. Some have internal parts made of zinc. A few minutes with a propane torch and the guts melt. Many cheap locks can be "shimmed" open (every high school kid knows this one). Just because it is big and heavy means nothing to a lock picker.

 

[-Brent-]

Not mentioned is window security. I like 3M security film - not the imitators. They're going to make a hell of a racket and it'll take a while to get through.

 

[theoldwizard1]

A business near where I grew up had a block building with bars on windows, gates on both the man door, garage door and loading dock. Dirtbags went through the wall on a wooded side of the building with a sledge hammer.

There is a video floating around about a couple of guys who broke into a liquor store in Detroit with nothing more than a sledge hammer. It took them about 5-10 minutes to bust a hole in the cement block wall ALL WHILE STANDING ON THE SIDEWALK UNDER LIGHTS WITH A SECURITY CAMERA POINTED AT THEM !

 

[theoldwizard1]

Man door swinging out, not in, in addition to other deterrents

I saw another video of a liquor store break in. They smashed through the front doors with a vehicle, but the owner kept all of the "good stuff" in a separately locked room. Commercial steel door in a steel frame, SWINGING OUT !

5+ minutes of beating on it with a sledge hammer and it did not open !

 

[Stuart in MN]

I hate these threads, because inevitably people start posting pictures of dogs and guns.


As mentioned, the first thing is a decent lock on the man door, along with a strong door jamb - more often than not they'll try to kick the door in, and typically the jamb breaks first. They're not going to be trying to pick the locks - that takes too much time and I'll guess the average burglar doesn't have a clue on how to pick them anyway. If you have windows, come up with a way to block entry there as well; some people use bars, I have pieces of plywood on the inside of mine that I normally leave in place but I can remove easily if I want. Liftmaster door openers have an optional lock that goes in the rail, other manufacturers may have something similar. Exterior lights are good; one can argue whether motion sensors or photocells that keep them on from dusk to dawn are better (motion sensors will turn them on whenever a cat or dog goes by.) If you have a home security system, add the garage to the system with sensors on the doors and windows (and include a rate of rise heat sensor, to alert in the event of a fire.)

Of course, if someone wants to get in bad enough they will but burglars tend to be opportunists - if they can't break in quickly they'll move on.

 

[EOC_Jason]

Best advise is "Out of sight, out of mind"... If people don't see your garage driving by, then they won't think to come rob you...

A fence / gate around your property, and some perimeter lighting is probably one good deterrent, and again keeps people from just driving up and taking a look around.

You can reinforce the man door all you want, your weak point is going to be your big door, be it roll-up or sectional, won't matter... A thief will steal a truck then come to your place, back right into the big door ripping it off the track. Load up truck, and drive off...

 

[rburke65]

I like. Little 120 volt to the door knob.....

 

[crewchief888]

Best advise is "Out of sight, out of mind"...

A fence / gate around your property, and some perimeter lighting is probably one good deterrent, and again keeps people from just driving up and taking a look around.

^^
"out of sight,out my mind"

if nobody knows whats inside....

theres probably been 3 people (that dont live here) that have seen the inside of my garage, and all are my friends, that i'd trust with my life.

my garage sits far enough back on my property, that it's hard to see in from the street, if the door is open, theres a vehicle parked in front blocking the view.

i have 2 small windows in the back wall, but the inside of my garage is still relatively dark, and i seldom have the lights on. if a vehicles slows down in front of the house, the dog will go to "investigate" , and that gets my attention.
i keep my boxes along the sides of the garage, (hard to see until you are within 20 feet of the door), welder is covered, DP is in a "dark" area between the windows.

being "that crazy guy with a shovel" works for me....

 

[Pathfinders]

I swiped a pack of gum as a child. My father asked me if he could have a piece of gum. The next question was how I got a pack of gum. I had to tell the manager of the store I had taken it without paying. I spent that night mopping the floors and taking out the trash. Last thing I ever touched that was not mine. I was 12.

 

[cmc76]

I appreciate the good ideas. Keep them coming. In reality, its not THAT bad of an area. If anything, getting better by the day. Allot of property improvements. Yuppies parachuting in from space. But in the meantime. I still want to protect what is mine. I love dogs. But what i love even more is other peoples dogs. The spot i have is in plain sight. No way to hide it. I think I am leaning towards concrete or grouted block around any openings. Commercial steel doors. I will weld up window protection. Maybe a few cameras, real or not. Maybe making up the vault type system can be a hobby down the road. I am insured, so thats handled. I think part of me wants it to be so solid, that even the most ambitious meth tweaker feels defeat before even trying. Once i actually get the ball rolling. perhaps i will document the build. I am in the business so im currently negotiating how many beers per hour i need to pay to get people to come help.

 

[pcmeiners]

"Security cameras...visible. Lets you see what is going on...and lets the dirt bag know your watching."
With video saved to an Internet server for a min. of 30 days. Couple of well hidden infra red cameras eye level within the garage.

Territorial German Shepard

Fox door lock....
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Progressive...067546?hash=item3f6424b79a:g:m20AAOSwR5dXRcZB

 

[NORTON'S SHOP]

I hate these threads, because inevitably people start posting pictures of dogs and guns.


Nothing deters a burglar more than the growl of a German Shepard or the cocking of a shotgun.

 

[Stuart in MN]

Nothing deters a burglar more than the growl of a German Shepard or the cocking of a shotgun.

Guns and dogs work if you and your dog are sitting there watching the garage 24/7 waiting for intruders. If you're away from home, or sleeping, or otherwise somewhere where your eye or your dog's eye isn't on the garage you're not going to stop a burglar.

 

[NORTON'S SHOP]

Guns and dogs work if you and your dog are sitting there watching the garage 24/7 waiting for intruders. If you're away from home, or sleeping, or otherwise somewhere where your eye or your dog's eye isn't on the garage you're not going to stop a burglar.

You're correct. But if you're at home it is the best deterrent. If I'm at home and some a$$hat breaks into my home or garage they will either be bit, looking at the business end of a 12 gauge, or get a face full of baseball bat.

 

[EOC_Jason]

If you are going to put up cameras, might as well make them real, they aren't that expensive. Also spend the money for decent IR cameras and DVR that at minimum you can set motion detection and send you an alert so you can check on your phone what is going on. Motion activated lights are also good... Or dusk till dawn lights are better if they won't bug you or your neighbors.

Since you can't hide it... A fence / gate (with a lock) is also a good deterrent... The longer it takes a thief to get in & out the less likely they will want to hit the place.

 

[Trey T]

Security is the secondary protection method. The primary method is to protect your identity from public space (online forum, social media, etc...). If you have a name and location, people can find where you live and steal all your stuff you posted.

Many people on here (and other places) are so complacent with telling the public their full name and where they live. It's pretty easy to find out where people live w/ a certain amt of info. Don't think that thieves aren't on here. All I'm saying is to minimize the exposure on the front-end and don't show-boat, keep everything discrete!

 

[NORTON'S SHOP]

It's a sad world that we live in that we even have to implement what we're discussing here to protect what is ours.

 

[joe--h]

Hobo is no longer an allowed word. Same with bum.
Joe H

 

[-Brent-]

I have a StrikeMaster II Pro coming, even though I have other security measures. I'd like them to struggle a bit more before (and as) they get their pictures taken and the alarm sounds. I do wonder if the alarm would sound with just the sound of the door being kicked?

I was doing a couple dishes late at night and dropped a bowl I was drying. The glass break sensor set off the alarm instantly. That'd be neat if a kick could set it off, too.

 

[Stuart in MN]

It's a sad world that we live in that we even have to implement what we're discussing here to protect what is ours.

Yes, it's too bad that we have to take measures to protect what is ours, but people have been stealing from each other since time began - it's not a new development by any means.

 

[NORTON'S SHOP]

Yes, it's too bad that we have to take measures to protect what is ours, but people have been stealing from each other since time began - it's not a new development by any means.

You're right, stealing is not a new development. But; I'm sure you'll agree; the punishment from long ago doesn't compare to the punishment of today. Long ago; if you were caught stealing; you would probably have your hands cut off. This probably kept many people from becoming thieves. Today thieves/criminals have more rights than the victims. That's really sad, and we have no one to thank for this but us.

 

[Jimi]

As already said... if someone wants in, they will get in. But once they do, have everything locked up to the best of your ability. Crazy how many people have things with unlocked locks.

Get creative inside. Time is a scarce quantity when you're wanting to move fast and steal something. If you're inside, I'm already coming for you.

 

[Falcon67]

From having lived in a "bad" - no question or waffling on that - neighborhood, LIGHT. Either on continuously or triggered easily. And lots of it. Around the perimeter and elsewhere if possible. Also gates, decent fences, etc as at least a minimal impediment. Doesn't have to be 10' tall, 4' works as well. Locks and such are secondary level defense. First order of business is to be less attractive than other places. Sad but true - bear eats the slower runner of the group. Given a light place and a dark place, the dark place will be the first choice. The place we had back then was lit 24-7. I had circuline flou bulbs outside that had no off switch. They can run as much as two years like that LOL.

Note - man door swing out is good. But be prepared for sticker shock. They ain't cheap.