Seized tie rod bolt

[norakat]

I went to do a wheel alignment and when the mechanic went to make a tie rod adjustment, he found the bolt was seized so he instantly went to the torch and started torching the bolt.

Then he tries to break it with a short handled adjustable wrench and short open end wrench.

I told him that has to be the wrong tools, you have no leverage. He didn’t agree.

They gave the car back without an alignment.

Anyone have any tips on how to break the bolt?

I’m thinking one of those wrenches that’s like a boxed wrench with a piece cut out to put over the rod for the big bolt and use a pipe for leverage. Then use regular open end for the rod side that I can hopefully wedge on something to keep it from turning. Maybe hammer it if I have to?

 

[65ranchero]

Are you talking about the tie rod lock nut?
What kind of vehicle , picture of the "bolt"

 

[Wrench97]

Torch and pipe wrench.

 

[norakat]

Are you talking about the tie rod lock nut?
What kind of vehicle , picture of the "bolt"

Yes.

 

[norakat]

Torch and pipe wrench.

Just a regular short open end on the bolt and pipe wrench on the tie rod end?

The problem w open ends they’re a little bigger than the actual bolt. I’ll prob just strip it.

 

[norakat]

I thought they had specialized tools for this problem.

 

[CJM8515]

a good long pattern wrench would easily break that free. that aint rust lol, its barely rusted. hell a pair of vise grips if you really wanted to get into it.

 

[Wrench97]

Well you don't need to hold the outer tie rod end it's bolted to the car, if inner will not turn with a open end it will with a 24" pipe wrench it is round after all. If it still does not come loose cut it off and replace both inner and outer.

 

[norakat]

a good long pattern wrench would easily break that free. that aint rust lol, its barely rusted. hell a pair of vise grips if you really wanted to get into it.

Yeah I feel like somebody put loctite on it. Last guy who did the last wheel alignment..

That’s not rust, that’s actually discoloration from two mechanics, from two different garages who failed to loosen it with a torch.

 

[norakat]

Well you don't need to hold the outer tie rod end it's bolted to the car, if inner will not turn with a open end it will with a 24" pipe wrench it is round after all. If it still does not come loose cut it off and replace both inner and outer.

Ok I’ll try that. Thanks for the advise.

 

[65ranchero]

Yes.

As others have said pipe wrench, heat, penetrating oil and patience

 

[CJM8515]

Yeah I feel like somebody put loctite on it. Last guy who did the last wheel alignment..

That’s actually discoloration from two mechanics from two different garages who failed to loosen it with a torch.

2 mins with a torch, spray with pblaster and wait 10 mins and it shoulda popped right off. red loctite or not

 

[Wrench97]

Yeah I feel like somebody put loctite on it. Last guy who did the last wheel alignment..

That’s actually discoloration from two mechanics from two different garages who failed to loosen it with a torch.

Loctite breaks loose with heat.
Keep in mind you do not need it to be red hot, just hot enough to expand.

 

[cannuck]

I can't believe a torch would not expand that enough to easily break loose. Loctite of ANY number would not do that - in fact prevents corrosion from locking threads. DO NOT turn that against the ball stud end, hold the tubular part with a really good open end on the flat provided. Heat is with a torch, but that is vital is to do it FAST with a large flame so the nut gets hot, not so much the male thread of tie rod end. You can try a flat on it, but looks as if the previous abusers have damaged the hex, so you might have to resort to a large vice grip. Should not be a big problem.

 

[65ranchero]

Yeah I feel like somebody put loctite on it. Last guy who did the last wheel alignment..

That’s actually discoloration from two mechanics from two different garages who failed to loosen it with a torch.

Heat should of loosened up the Loctite and should of loosened the lock nut,
Are you sure it is not a left hand thread?( turn to the right to loosen) just a thought

 

[Jswain]

I believe it's a geographic thing...

If you brought that to a mechanic in the rust belt he would have a nice break.

Bring it to the ones in the rust free/brand new car areas and they don't like to touch.

 

[norakat]

I can't believe a torch would not expand that enough to easily break loose. Loctite of ANY number would not do that - in fact prevents corrosion from locking threads. DO NOT turn that against the ball stud end, hold the tubular part with a really good open end on the flat provided. Heat is with a torch, but that is vital is to do it FAST with a large flame so the nut gets hot, not so much the male thread of tie rod end. You can try a flat on it, but looks as if the previous abusers have damaged the hex, so you might have to resort to a large vice grip. Should not be a big problem.

Thanks for the replies.

I was trying to avoid the torch and use leverage or a hammer, but it seems a consensus on the torch.

I was thinking use something like this to hold the nut if that’s even necessary -
(but better brand and longer if it goes over the nut)

 

[norakat]

I believe it's a geographic thing...

If you brought that to a mechanic in the rust belt he would have a nice break.

Bring it to the ones in the rust free/brand new car areas and they don't like to touch.

Nope they tried.

One guy tried almost 30 min.

 

[Wrench97]

A line wrench is not going to work on that, it probably won't fit over the inner tie rod and a cheap one will only spread open.

 

[PCustoms]

I'm in the camp of they turned it the wrong way....

That should loosen right up.

 

[AldeanFan]

That looks like an easy job to me but I live in the great white north and know how to deal with rust.

Try a wrench extender if you need more leverage.

 

[MadMechMaster]

Gotta do it today? if not, spray it occasionally for a few days before you try it again.

There are flats on the tie rod for a backer wrench if you need it.

That looks barely wrenched on. keep trying.

 

[MadMechMaster]

Oh yeah, Kroil.

 

[Jswain]

Nope they tried.

One guy tried almost 30 min.

Sorry, but not very hard.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Flare nut wrenches typically will not fit over the inner. I use wright grip wrenches, which are fairly short. If it's stuck, make it glow orange. If making it glow won't make it move, quench it and then spin it slowly with an air hammer. If THAT doesn't work make it glow and hammer the nut around bit by bit. Don't turn the inner so much as you're trying to jiggle the nut the tiniest amount so when you retighten it it will be "in". If it's really out and seized, you sometimes just need an inner/outer.

FWIW if you came and told me how to do my job on the alignment rack, I'd ship you and your car unaligned as well. Probably with less than polite language. What's amusing is you whined about his wrench being too short with no leverage, yet a flare nut wrench is typically even shorter than a standard combo wrench.

 

[619DioFan]

3 foot pipe wrench and the longest piece of pipe you have over the handle for more leverage. Either the nut comes loose or your car flips on its side.

 

[PCustoms]

Right or wrong the lat ones I did (I'm no pro by any means) involved an adjustable and a BFH.

Clamp the adjustable on the nut, hold the back wrench and a few swift hits to the adjustable broke it loose...

Torch would have burned down the barn I was in.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

3 foot pipe wrench and the longest piece of pipe you have over the handle for more leverage. Either the nut comes loose or your car flips on its side.

That stuff doesn't work. It's not a leverage problem on tie rods, ever. I can rip the steel off the corners with a standard length 17mm wrench. You do really need to even try to rip the steel off the inner if you break the jam nut free off the outer but it's frozen to the inner. It's not a wrench quality issue.

It's a "more force is required to rotate/separate these two fasteners than the size of the driving faces allows" issue. Use all the leverage in the world, it won't make a difference. You'll just round it off - snap on, wright, matco, mac, cornwell, HF, gearwrench, sunex, tekton, it doesn't matter. Pipe wrench just rapes and shreds the thing into a spiky rounded mess.


I get jam nuts glowing orange, the entire 24mm nut, 100% of the thing glowing. And they will not move. Usually when they do finally let go they puff out the blackish "rust smoke" as the creak free. It's like a bolt seized in a bushing, more cheater pipe won't fix it.

 

[jack stand]

Are you talking about the tie rod lock nut?
What kind of vehicle , picture of the "bolt"

 

[like2wheel]

FWIW if you came and told me how to do my job on the alignment rack, I'd ship you and your car unaligned as well. Probably with less than polite language. What's amusing is you whined about his wrench being too short with no leverage, yet a flare nut wrench is typically even shorter than a standard combo wrench.

Especially a customer that clearly doesn't know the difference between a "nut" and a "bolt" telling you how to do it.

Before the picture arrived, I assumed he was talking about a tie rod sleeve clamp bolt.

 

[dougf]

Soak it with any penetrating fluid overnight. Tomorrow take a wrench on it, hit the end with a brass hammer or put a pipe on it to get the torque needed. It'll come off easy. If not, get red hot, when it cools spray with penetrating fluid and take a good pair of vise grips and tap it off with a hammer/pipe.

 

[norakat]

Especially a customer that clearly doesn't know the difference between a "nut" and a "bolt" telling you how to do it.

Before the picture arrived, I assumed he was talking about a tie rod sleeve clamp bolt.

I wasn’t telling anyone how to do it. I just thought in my head that he wasn’t getting enough leverage with a short adjustable wrench. I still think I’m right. Like someone said here maybe using a wrench extender/pipe, pipe/plumbing wrench or BFH, might of helped.

At the time I was just imagining there was a longer specialty wrench made for the job and asked if a longer wrench with more leverage would help.

 

[norakat]

Thank you for all the replies.

 

[Walkers]

I can’t see anything there that would require more than 10 minutes effort to get loose no matter if it was overly tight, rusted, seized, galled, etc. from looking at the marks on the nuts they were trying to turn in in the right direction, just not enough force.

 

[npp]

Heat it up to almost red and then cool it down with cold water. Been working in the rust belt for over 50 years. Certainly seen worse from that picture.

 

[kaymccampbell]

You've got some weak-*** mechanics in your neck of the woods. I'd use the red wrench and then the pipe wrench to break it loose. Maybe with a cheater.

 

[nbpt100]

I had a tire shop tell me they cound not do a full alignment becasue they could not free up a bolt or a nut. I have heard of shops just plain refusing to do alignments based on the appearance of rust. I do not blame them. something breaks or stripps and it turns into a nightmare.

 

[The Cobbler]

in my opinion, that does not look like it would be difficult to loosen. is there more to the story?

 

[jsaw]

I usually rattle them with an air hammer. I have a flat hammer bit that works good

 

[MBfreak]

HF induction heater . Rust oil, 50 % ATF and Acetone.
Ready in 20 minutes

Ola