Septic tank

[threeputt]

I have posted a few things about me trying to get a very old shop back going. I have a problem now that might be costly.

My dad built this place in 1961. I bought it in 1978 and never thought to ask him where the septic tank was located. I was young back then and just didn't know much about things like this..

I am not sure if my dad or me had the septic cleaned out because I don't where it is located. Bad memory of those days. Only one restroom has been used in years and only by me. Probably 10 times after I closed the shop 21 years ago.


This week I noticed it is getting slower when I flush but it does go down. I just noticed a difference when flushing and twice it has taken two times to make things go down Probably only used it 6 or 8 times in the last 6 weeks.


I have looked around this building many times and see no signs of where it might be leaking or located.

We once had a well on the side of this shop . Looking at this picture it would be on the left side about half way back extending about 30 feet. The well was filled in about 1972 so I do know where it is located. I would not think my dad would have installed a septic anywhere near a water well.

The picture shows where the restrooms are located in shop. There is concrete poured in front as we used to sell gas. As shown in picture there is asphalt in front next to concrete but it is getting thin. Maybe under it ?

The gas tanks were removed in 1986. They were close to the side of building on left and you can see where soil has sunk .

I would think my dad would not have installed a septic tank where large trucks or tractors could run it.

You think he might has put a septic tank under the concrete in front of shop to avoid anyone running over it ? My dad passed away in 1988 and there is nobody alive that would know anymore than me.

I just cannot remember if I had the septic system worked on or not. Long time ago and my memory of those days is a daze Anyway to locate this without being big $$$$$

 

[930dreamer]

https://inspectapedia.com/septic/Septic_Tank_Find.php

 

[Junkman]

You could run a snake down the toilet, and see how far it goes before it stops. That would give you a general idea of how far away from the building it is located. Also check with the local town government, because even back then, he might have needed to pull a permit, and show where it was located. I had a property that was built in 1932, and the town records of the permits, plans, etc. were still available.

 

[firebirdparts]

If you don't use it much, I guess you couldn't go by where the grass is greener. That usually will show out the field lines. The tank will be somewhat between the building and the field lines.

Don't worry about the expense. This is low-tech stuff that works forever, and it's not expensive to get it working or replace it. Be careful of hiring professionals, as always. They are likely to mess a lot of things up. I suppose every local jurisdiction is different, but here you better have a permit if you build a new field bed.

Field beds are required to be on undisturbed ground, and they aren't paved over, so that is another clue. That all assumes they were not totally improper, which is a big assumption.

 

[77Birdman]

The snake idea is a good one, if there is only one spot in the building with plumbing I would surmise that the tank is in close proximity just outside of the building line. Typically they are placed at the opposite side of the lot as the well, that may help you too. In my county they ARE expensive. Contractor must be licensed to do septics, one cannot do their own, but FP is correct, theres not much to doing one. May be worth while once you get a general idea to rent a small excavator and start scratching at the ground a bit at a time until you find something.

 

[brewchief]

Find a plumbing company with a sewer camera, they will be able to follow the camera head with a locator to find out exactly where your drain pipe leads, as a bonus you will also find out if there are other problems with the drain that may be causing slow drainage.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

 

[PCustoms]

Plumbers us a snake and a locator beacon to trace lines and locations. They will be able to find it.

Finding the field may be a different issue. I know where my tank is, and that leaves 2 options for the field, neither one is very good. Summer project (one of many) is to find my field and kill some trees.

 

[6768rogues]

Use a piece of 1/2" steel rod or rebar, sharpen the end and weld on another piece at the other end to form a Tee. Then probe the ground around where you would assume it to be. Usually with a little time you can hit the lid of the tank. They are usually close to the building and shallow.

 

[EOC_Jason]

You don't want to drive over a septic tank, you can collapse the lid and make an instant sinkhole...

Your leach field has to be a good distance away from any water wells...

The tanks should be (typically) at minimum 5' away from any concrete pavement / building.

You can always either rent a machine or hire a plumber where they can run a snake in the line and they have a handheld detector to find out where it is and mark the ground for you.

 

[kaymccampbell]

You could look on google maps satellite view. I can see all the septic systems in my neighbrhood by the difference in grass color. From there I can guess the locations of the tanks. My own tanks, once I found them, I put permanent manholes down to access them.

 

[Richard Cranium]

I would say calling a plumber with a camera and a locator would be your best bet, You kill two birds with one stone, you get to find the tank and see if there is a blockage or a damaged line at the same time. Good luck....

 

[cbacres]

You could look on google maps satellite view. I can see all the septic systems in my neighbrhood by the difference in grass color. From there I can guess the locations of the tanks. My own tanks, once I found them, I put permanent manholes down to access them.

Kay, what did you use for manholes? Buy them or build your own?
Thanks

 

[Pluribus]

Didn't see you mention it, but have you checked to see if your AHJ has "as-built" drawings? I can find the drawings for mine online. With an older system in a county that hasn't put everything online yet, there might be microfiche for records. Maybe it's even in paper files...or on stone tablets

Might as well go for the easiest approach first. If that doesn't work, I'd go for the snake with locator beacon option next.

 

[EOC_Jason]

Kay, what did you use for manholes? Buy them or build your own?
Thanks

On our septic tanks we used some large diameter HDPE pipe, with the corrugated outside and smooth inside. Leaving about 8" to 1' above ground, but whatever floats your boat. Just mixed up some thick sackrete and piled around the outside between the pipe & top of tank to form a seal, then backfilled the dirt once set. They sell caps for them that work great.

 

[EVOLVO]

https://tgwastewater.com/products-page/septic-tank-risers

 

[Lassen Forge]

There's a local company that pumps tanks, they were able to run a tracer line down our system, energize it, and use a signal detector to shoot our sewer system and find them pretty quickly. Once they found the tank, they did the same to the leach field. Once we knew where our tank and leach field was (we had a verbal description, so that helped a little), we made a map, and also put an access monument where the lid was, as well as the end of our leach lines (which run opposite to where our well is).

The Imhoff tanks at the Italian place have cast concrete "inspection holes", but they had to excavate to get to it when we had the same probs you're having. Seems when you have a system that's not used, things dry out and backups happen.

We were also told (on both) we should be getting one of those 3 packs of bakers yeast, mixing it with warm water, and running it down our system to keep the tanks charged.

 

[denis4x4]

Once you have located the tank, install risers so that the lid is flush with the ground and easy to find.

 

[threeputt]

Thanks for all the tips. I have two restrooms but have one that is not used. It has probably been forty years since that one was used. I have a cap over where the toilet was. That would be a good place to run the snake. Tom

 

[threeputt]

Being both restrooms were installed on the front side of building I would assume it would probably be under the concrete or asphalt pretty close to front.

No way would my dad have put a septic tank anywhere close to where someone could have ran over it.

I wish I had asked but I was young and never thought about it. Nobody is left alive that would know the location .

The toilet is working for now but I can sense it might start to give problems and I want to head it off before I have a backup

I can borrow a snake from my plumber friend. He could do this for me but he just had bypass surgery and it will be several weeks before he is up and around again.

Tom

 

[Radix2]

If the well is to the left, and the center is concrete, I'd look to the right. If the ground is not too hard, the probe method is quick and easy.

Tanks are usually as high as possible to leave a fall to the drain field, which doesn't want to be too deep.

Since you don't use it much, I'd not put much hope in looking for the field by the grass...if it has been dry though, you could run water for a while and get it to green up quick.

 

[jblnut]

My septic tank has a pump in it to pump the water/stuff out to the drain field. I don't understand why the access covers would be buried underground ?? Do some of your systems not have a pump or how do they work ??

 

[doctordirt]

Call local pumper he may have record or remember. They do this all the time and know what to look for if the need to probe.. A snake will not work, as snake goes into tank there is no stop and curls up in the tamk.

 

[58Yeoman]

My septic tank has a pump in it to pump the water/stuff out to the drain field. I don't understand why the access covers would be buried underground ?? Do some of your systems not have a pump or how do they work ??

Generally, the septic system is higher than the drain field, as mine is. They don't have to be much higher, but you want your drain tile to flow away from the tank. The solids sink to the bottom and get "worked" away, and the remaining water flows out the top to the drain field. Kind of a simplified explanation.

 

[B.C.Biker]

Looked for and found a leaking water line by using a steel rod and stethoscope.
Had good idea where line was which helped. Put the rod on the ground and put the stethoscope on top. You'll hear running water. Worked surprisingly well.
Leave a faucet running enough where it doesn't back up and go hunting.
Used a cheapo one like you'd find at a Harbour Freight for a few bucks.

 

[HoosierMark]

cbacres. You ask about septic access covers. I have a 1000 gallon tank with two access holes. I had a choice of either concrete lids under ground about a foot or a raised round plastic pipe that screws to the concrete tank and then has a plastic round lid screwed to it. The lid is attached by about 8 screws and is at ground level.
OP I have had a camera used before. If the snake does not work, use a camera. Our local water company also has a sound detector that can hear water running. They use if for leaks, if your line is open, they may be able to use this to hear the water running but maybe not. You are getting a lot of good advice here, my plumber would use a probe rod to push in the ground to find the line and simple trace it out. Ground penetrating radar will also work. I have also heard of people witching sewer lines and fields. I have seen it work but not sure why, but that is another story.

 

[grump]

You could unbolt the toilet, lift it off the mounting point and see which way your drain flows as a starting point. Once you know the direction of the tile you can use a tile probe to follow the tile to your septic tank. Definitely easier to use the probe if the ground isn't hard and dry.

 

[JRC3]

I agree, have it snaked and located.

I bought my house as a foreclosure. The black ABS pipe that enters the tank was broken and collapsed. Guess what year the house was built...1961. The sanitation plumbing in the house was copper that fed 4" cast through the foundation then transitioned to ABS.

You need to have it snaked and located. Then have it pumped. From there you can test the drain-field.

Attached are pics of the broken pipe and what it took to fix it. I later installed sealed risers to keep water out.

 

[JRC3]

Also a septic cleaner will easily find the tank. From there you might see a problem like mine when he opens it up. Either way, he will find the tank. It needs cleaned before it clogs the drain field...If it hasn't happened already. I would probably start there. He's seen it all.

 

[Junkman]

In 1961, they might have just installed a leach tank with stone around it. Considering that it hasn't been used but possibly 10 times in 21 years, it might be bone dry if it is a septic tank. If it is a leach tank, good chance that roots have grown into it, and that might be why the toilet is running slow. Too many variables, with out putting a camera down the pipe to see exactly what is going on.

 

[rlwhitetr3b]

We had to replace the septic system at the house we sold last year. While researching the topic I found that leach fields normally last about 25 to 30 years. With the your low usage your might last much longer.

 

[threeputt]

Thanks, I probably went 20 years and didn't use it.

I didn't even have the city water turned on for almost that long. I might be lucky.

I was in the military for four years in the late 60's so I couldn't tell anyone if my dad had ever had it pumped out. The way this shop was built I just would bet the septic was built top notch.

I would say it is out front somewhere. I will keep all updated on what I find. THANKS. Tom

 

[JRC3]

While researching the topic I found that leach fields normally last about 25 to 30 years.

Pro tip: Don't use powder laundry detergents, nothing but clay fillers. Even more, go concentrated with liquid detergants.

Also, one of these. I have one to install but it's been sitting for over a year. Next pumpout and I'll do it. http://www.zoellerpumpsupply.com/Septic_Tank_Filter.html Keeps out dog hair and lint.

 

[threeputt]

Is there a safe product one can buy to put in the septic that might help some ? Never been anything used since I owned this place which is 40 years. Tom

 

[JRC3]

Is there a product you can pour in a gas tank to clean an air or oil filter, or unclog a converter?

It's also common for concrete baffles to fail. Baffles keep the solids, fats and grease (scum) from entering your drain fried.

RidX is snake oil, btw.

 

[gahrajmahal]

You need to hire someone to inspect it. It is just not that expensive.

 

[Pluribus]

Is there a safe product one can buy to put in the septic that might help some ? Never been anything used since I owned this place which is 40 years. Tom

No.

But for the people who absolutely have to feel like they're doing something, use baking soda. It's cheap; It won't do a damn thing to help, but it won't hurt anything either.

 

[lkempf]

I use Bio-Clean in our septic system. Highly recommended by the company that services our system. Another idea for locating the tanks is to try the old fashioned "water witching" or "dowsing". Probably not enough water in the lines, but worth a shot.

 

[PCustoms]

yeast. Brewers or bakers, you can get a lot of it cheaper. Feeds the bacteria and keeps things breaking down.

Also minimize chemicals (bleach etc) going down the drain

 

[JRC3]

You know what feeds the bacteria...Your **** and piss. Everything else is wife's tales and snake oil.

Two exceptions, additives can start up and growa new septic bacteria faster and additives can help clean a drain field.


Beside additives and such don't apply to this scenario.

 

[kbs2244]

First I would check with the county building department;
They should have a lot layout.

If you don't want to get the government involved, call a pumping co.
Finding where to pump is the first part of the service.
Call one that has been around a while.
You might get the one whose granddad did the install and has drawings
It sounds like your are going to need them anyway.

(BTW, the old way to "reactivate" a tank was 2 or 3 day old road kill)