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Sharing and Leghorn Foghorn

SGKent

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Sharing and Foghorn Leghorn

Just sharing here about experiences today. Of course y'all are welcome to make a suggestion on my oscillating foghorn.

Have a foghorn outside the bedroom that is coming from the irrigation system. Been off and on for several years now and still haven't found it. It happens sometimes at a time that leads me to believe an irrigation valve (varies which) is shutting off and another just opening. Maybe I need to time the system for a few minutes closed on each valve before the next opens.

1) replaced some of the suspect sprinkler valves
2) replaced toilet flappers and valves with high quality ones. We never hear them run when this happens however.
3)Rebuilt the shower and kitchen faucet assemblies.
4) made sure the outside faucets are not leaking before or after this happens - no discharge.
5) rebuilt the PRV and set it to 55 PSI.
6)Added an expansion tank and a pressure valve where I can easily see it each time I go in the garage to see if it is climbing. Internal pressure set to 55 psi too with the water off and the plumbing pressure at zero.
7) Believe all the other air is out of the system.

And yet it does go off at odd times too that are unpredictable. So today I am going to replace all the sprinkler valves which leads to the second part of this post.

Had 6 valves and went over to Home Depot to get 6 more. 12 total. Last time I bought one not that long ago they were $14 each, up from about $8 each and now they are $20 each. Wow did Home Depot raise their prices on them. Making matters worse, when I got to the register - and I was just there several weeks ago - all, meaning ALL, the cashiers are gone. None. Just a couple people who move from self service register to self service register. The parking lot is full of people looking for work (mostly illegal aliens I would guess from the appearance). Many of the parking spaces are dedicated for high volume clients so if you are a lowly client like me you have to park way further out. No wonder the streets here in California are full of homeless who can't find work. I see no way this can continue and we have a livable society here. Off to have lunch then fix the valves and see if we can get rid of Foghorn Leghorn and be done with this. Maybe I should leave it in case a homeless person wants to sleep near there - of course the way the laws are here I'd probably get sued for not fixing a known sleep disrupter. Here is wonderful 100% Democrat run California. Wow have times changed since I came here in 1961, or graduated high school and college, or worked a whole career here. I guess Lowes or Ace Hardware will be seeing a lot more of me. The idea of buying hardware parts without a human being involved is way beyond what I can work with. Even the online places I buy from sometimes I can call and speak to someone about what I am buying. Sorry for the rant but whomever saw this environment as a place I would want to be is on hallucinogens. Lowes and Ace here I come.

Foghorn_leghorn.png
 
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SGKent

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Wow. 12 hours later and I checked the price for a couple more valves at the other big box store. Not only did I have to check myself out at Home Depot - meaning I had no choice of cashier or self-checkout, but the other big box hardware store has the same part for $7 less each. That means Home Depot not only raised their prices 30% over the other big box on that item, but they no longer have cashiers. Wow is all I can say. They have lost a long time customer. I bought 4 units so that cost me $28 more than the other big box store. Just letting ya know. No wonder there was a long line of customers that looked pissed off at the customer service counter. I can't imagine someone buying 150 of an item like fence slats and having to scan each one rather than scan 1 then hit x 150.
 
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Attackcammel

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Re: Sharing and Foghorn Leghorn

I can usually find a cashier at the pro desk if I can’t find one there I drop my stuff on the closest flat surface and leave I don’t work there. I refuse to use a self serve register no matter what store I’m at. I just have to start remembering to check and make sure someone is working a register before I go grab my things.


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Attackcammel

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Re: Sharing and Foghorn Leghorn

Maybe that’s how you can get the prices to match or come close to other stores. Grab the nearest phone, call a manager over and tell them them you want the employee discount. Hahaha


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Falcon67

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I love self checkout at HD. In and out quick, no waiting on someone returning something, price check from a missing bar code or the generally confused customer. They keep their units up to date and usable, unlike Lowes where it takes a lot of time to check out. My time is not free, saved time = saved money. You guys can wait behind the old lady trying to wrote a check while I get on with life.
 

ratdoggy

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I love self checkout at HD. In and out quick, no waiting on someone returning something, price check from a missing bar code or the generally confused customer. They keep their units up to date and usable, unlike Lowes where it takes a lot of time to check out. My time is not free, saved time = saved money. You guys can wait behind the old lady trying to wrote a check while I get on with life.

Lot of truth in that. The only time I use self checkout is if I think I'll get out of the store and on with my life quicker. All depends on what I'm buying.
Cart full of stuff = Person checking out.
Box of nails where the barcode is legible = Self checkout
Assorted hardware = Person checking out
Some times I'll just swing by customer service if there are lines and I have one or two things if they aren't busy...Usually the quickest way out of store
 

MarlynOC

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Reading the opening line, I thought you had a real foghorn outside your home. I lived with a real 142 db foghorn attached to our house for 2 years and know how it can drive you batty.
 

GMCGarage

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I find things go better without human interaction. usually the self checkouts are free of older folks who really dont know what they are doing. I saw a cashier the other day have to swipe a mans card in the card reader. How can this be their first time using this?

If not a card issue, its then the person who writes a check, or digs in their purse for 58 cents change because they dont want to break a dollar.

For you using the other stores, we salute you.
 
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SGKent

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FYI - there are no cashiers in this store anymore. That is the point. You have no choice whether you want to use a cashier or not. There is no cashier to use if you don't want to use self-checkout. I verified it with staff as well in case I was missing something. She confirmed - there are no cashiers in that Home Depot anymore. Self-Check out only. This is a very large Home Depot too, it is not a small store.

On the sprinkler foghorn. I replaced 8 of the 12 valves yesterday. Will replace the last 4 today. It never does it during the day but only at night. While I have been attacking this as a water pressure or valve issue I realized a few minutes ago that the timing could be a ham radio operator talking at night - causing the sprinkler controller to send voltage spikes to the valves causing them to chatter. If replacing the last 4 valves doesn't stop it the next thing to do is to unplug the controller and see if that stops it. If it does then finding a solution could be hard. No way am I running shielded wires and building Faraday cages to protect sprinklers and controllers.
 
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teamextreme

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This has turned into a self-checkout/cashier debate/*****-fest, yet the original post/question regarding a "foghorn" I still have no earthly idea WTF OP is talking about. Apparently I need to google foghorn. The only one I know is the picture that was posted and something on a lighthouse.
 
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SGKent

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This has turned into a self-checkout/cashier debate/*****-fest, yet the original post/question regarding a "foghorn" I still have no earthly idea WTF OP is talking about. Apparently I need to google foghorn. The only one I know is the picture that was posted and something on a lighthouse.


When water hammers occur in sprinklers they sound like a foghorn. They are loud and wake you from your sleep. I went by Lowes and picked up three more valves. The guy on the floor was walking me over to water hammer arresters when I mentioned to him it was for a sprinkler system. He said he has seen a lot of it lately and had it himself with a different kind of valve than I have. His solution, and that which a friend just did for the same thing was to build a large water hammer arrester out of 2" PVC pipe about a foot long and put it near the sprinklers. I have that on the agenda if it does not stop. The original problem that took me to Home Depot was to buy valves to replace the ones I have because the foghorn awakes us sometimes all night long at random times. Sorry you could not follow that. If you have never heard one they sound like this video I found online. Usually a toilet is at fault but in this case I have already replaced the toilet valves and flappers.



.
 
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GMCGarage

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This has turned into a self-checkout/cashier debate/*****-fest, yet the original post/question regarding a "foghorn" I still have no earthly idea WTF OP is talking about. Apparently I need to google foghorn. The only one I know is the picture that was posted and something on a lighthouse.

I guess the OP had us all confused on his agenda.
 

WAS Jr

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FYI - there are no cashiers in this store anymore. That is the point. You have no choice whether you want to use a cashier or not. There is no cashier to use if you don't want to use self-checkout. I verified it with staff as well in case I was missing something. She confirmed - there are no cashiers in that Home Depot anymore. Self-Check out only. This is a very large Home Depot too, it is not a small store.

On the sprinkler foghorn. I replaced 8 of the 12 valves yesterday. Will replace the last 4 today. It never does it during the day but only at night. While I have been attacking this as a water pressure or valve issue I realized a few minutes ago that the timing could be a ham radio operator talking at night - causing the sprinkler controller to send voltage spikes to the valves causing them to chatter. If replacing the last 4 valves doesn't stop it the next thing to do is to unplug the controller and see if that stops it. If it does then finding a solution could be hard. No way am I running shielded wires and building Faraday cages to protect sprinklers and controllers.

Just curious. Could this have something to do with the minimum $15 wage?
If your local elected officials just mandated it recently this could explain why it’s self checkout.
Bill S
 
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Jazzman442

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I have to chime in here. Home Depot and Lows are 2 or many customers. They are all in favor of Higher wadges to make them politically correct. Then they get ride of employees. Walmart is doing this as well. High wadges for a started job will never work.:headscrat

Get use to it.

Can you post a picture of how you constructed you fix?
 
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SGKent

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I have to chime in here. Home Depot and Lows are 2 or many customers. They are all in favor of Higher wadges to make them politically correct. Then they get ride of employees. Walmart is doing this as well. High wadges for a started job will never work.:headscrat

Get use to it.

Can you post a picture of how you constructed you fix?

Yes as soon as I do it. It will be a couple adapter to take 3/4 thread to 3" PVC, a vertical 12" to 14" piece of PVC and then a cap. This will be placed next to the last sprinkler in the line. A friend told me last night he did the same in his house to stop water hammering but he added a 2' capped vertical copper line at each end of the house. I already have an expansion tank on the water heater so it should be damping this already.
 
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SGKent

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Boy, I say Boy, I don’t know! ��

:) funny. Made me smile. Thank you.

I replaced the last 3 of 12 valves a short while ago. It went off at 3:30 am last night which is the period the front system is just finishing, and the 3 valves just replaced were in the front and old. It did not do it randomly last night. If it does it again tonight then the last bullet is the water hammer arrester. We shall know more tomorrow.
 
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teamextreme

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Thanks for the video Kent. That is a really strange example of water hammer that I've never seen (heard) before. My experience with water hammer is usually just a loud bang/shudder. I'm also curious to see your solution when you've finished it.
 
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SGKent

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no solution yet. Replaced all 12 sprinkler valves and the exterior faucets. Still does it but less. Unplugged the controller 2 nights and it stopped. Rainbird says that means it is probably caused by the controller so I replaced that with an upgraded model. The plumbing supply looked over pictures of the system and the design is fine.They suggested running all the faucets and appliances, sprinklers etc. at the same time rather than one by one because sometimes that will just move air in the system around. So at this point I am completely out of bullets short of replacing the water heater too. I may just build a water hammer air stand pipe at the end of the sprinkler line but I want to be sure that all the bases are covered first.
 
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SGKent

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From what I understand the capped stand pipes have to be charged once a year or so. I'll probably go by the plumbing store again tomorrow and buy a couple large ones to install in the system at each end of the sprinkler run. The plumbers in that shop seemed to think that the expansion tank should be stopping any hammer. I don't know - the 1" run to the back yard is like 110' so I probably need something there. I bought a 2" PVC pipe and fittings to make one but then I read that the air slowly goes out of them. Of course I drain that line in the winter so that might recharge it once a year. Engineered ones have a piston or diaphragm in them.
 
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SGKent

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new controller, all new valves, every faucet in or outside the house has been rebuilt or replaced, toilet valves replaced with a different high end brand, water pressure set to 50 psi after rebuilding PRV with new parts, all the house plumbing flushed of air following the supply house plumber's suggestion, every wire on the sprinkler system checked and all connections soldered, and the new controller set. Foghorn went off again last night at 11:47 pm at a time no water in the house was running and everyone was in bed. Now to add a water hammer arrestor to see if that at least tones it down, and ferrite beads on all the wires in case it is radio interference. 25 years this same system has been in of which 23 it worked perfectly then about 2 years ago this started. Almost always between 10 pm and 2 am, never during the day. Sometimes the valves coming on or turning off will cause a short chatter but none of them came on at 11:47 last night.
 
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SGKent

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Thanks. Sounds like this youtube faucet video but it is the sprinkler valves and they do it when they feel like it. Mostly random hours at night.

I wish to install a water hammer arrester on the line near the valves to see if it helps. The PVC lines are 4 to 6 inches underground. The best way is to put a tee in and then thread the arrester into the tee. Standoffs are not recommended. Can I bury the copper water hammer arrester if it is wrapped in poly or water tight tape, and then maybe put some sand around it instead of dirt? Any plumbers out there who know?


What I have done so far:
replaced toilet valves
replaced toilet flappers
rebuilt Wilkins PRV with Wilkins part kit - twice to be sure
replaced all 12 anti-siphon sprinkler valves
replaced sprinkler controller
rebuilt or replaced all indoor faucets
added water hammer arrester to dishwasher
turned off ice maker
added expansion tank and made sure it is pressured right
Lowered PRV to 50 PSI, verified pressure drops within Wilkins flow rate chart
Soldered all sprinkler wires to be sure no corrosion in connections
Purged all air from house per plumbers specific instructions
Looked for leaks
Replaced all outdoor bibb faucets
Flushed 15 year old water heater, again. Everything appears to work fine with it.
Added pressure gauge near expansion tank. It always reads 50 PSI unless water is running somewhere.

This exact same system did fine for 22 years with no problems so I don't think it is design.
 
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SGKent

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yes they are but I have an update. We have two kinds of foghorn. One is very short and often random as a valve cycles off - never the same valve - maybe 3 to 4 seconds max. Then we have one that sounds the same sound like that youtube faucet that goes for 10 - 15 seconds and sometimes repeats one time. By the time we get out there it is over. Tonight we were right by the door and made it out there in time. The long foghorn is something in the AC system bleeding down. They are side by side. So - a water hammer arrester should stop the short bursts, and an AC guy hopefully can find the long one. So very happy to finally catch it after 2 years of this randomness foghorn of different lengths and times of the night. And for you AC buffs, it wasn't the AC turning on - it is some pressure release internally. Thermostat was 72/72 and once I lowered it afterwards the unit came right on as usual. It is something bleeding down anywhere from 10 minutes to an hour after the unit turns off. Hallelujah!

All the things that I have done to the sprinklers has made them quieter and more reliable but the still chatter a little sometimes so I picked up 2 water hammer arresters today - one for the front and one for the back. Mystery solved I hope.
 
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mattygee

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Many people had the same reaction to self serve gas as the current uproar by some over selfcheckout. Times change; people adapt.
 
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