Shop Made LED "Fixture"

[soj]

First, some background:

I have been converting 8' two tube fluorescent lights to LED tubes, and getting brighter light using only one LED tube per fixture. I still have some dim spots, since the fixture layout is lacking. I wanted to fill in using the same size/type LED tube, since I had a few extra. I could not find a 8' single tube fixture. Not saying there is none, but I couldn't find any. Plenty of dual tube fixtures, but most with ballast, and the LED ready ones I found were about the same price as one with a ballast. Most in the 35-40 dollar range, some more.

Some of the bulbs I bought were the Hyperikon from Amazon, and they come with tombstones, but I didn't need them with the fixtures I had. So, being cheap and having more time than money, I started figuring how to make a fixture using the tombstones I have.

What I came up with:







This is what I used, with approximate cost. Cost can vary with vendor and quantities per package.

Single Gang Handy Box: 0.94 X 2 = 1.88
Plain Handy Box Cover: 0.60 X 2 = 1.20
Conduit Connectors: 0.35 X 2 = 0.70
FA8 single pin Tombstones (pair): 3.42 (I had these, but this price is from Lowe's)
1/2" conduit (10'): 2.85
My time: Priceless

Total: 10.05

I have no idea which, if any, sections of the NEC I have violated, but I have faith that I will soon find out.
Edit: I do know that the 8' of conduit between the boxes needs to be "supported" or "attached", or whatever the proper term is, but it doesn't sag, so...

I do know that it works:





jp

 

[Lelandwelds]

Good one! If you build a non approved fixture by assembling approved components is it approved?

More light is better. Smoother light is better. Cheaper is better. Why 8 footers?

 

[soj]

Good one! If you build a non approved fixture by assembling approved components is it approved?

More light is better. Smoother light is better. Cheaper is better. Why 8 footers?

No, since I didn't use the components for the intended, approved purpose. But, the fixture IS approved... by me.

Because that is what was installed by the previous owner.
jp

 

[Platonic Solid]

Nice. With a single end powered lamp you wouldn't even need the conduit.

 

[soj]

Re: Shop Made LED "Fixture"

Nice. With a single end powered lamp you wouldn't even need the conduit.

Wow, I never dreamed I would get an endorsement from the GJ lighting guru! Now my goal is to get included in "The best light fixture ever". I should get in on price alone[emoji16]

The single end advantage crossed my mind, but I was working with what I have.

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[Lelandwelds]

No, since I didn't use the components for the intended, approved purpose. But, the fixture IS approved... by me.

Because that is what was installed by the previous owner.
jp

I once moved into a place with an orange livingroom with black trim and a blue hallway. The master had a mural of a mountain stream.

I changed it to something that made more sense.

Convert existing fixtures to LED? Oh, yes! New home brew eightfooters? Why? Like to create and solve problems in the neatest, weirdest way? Cross posting to MAKE magazine? Lose a bet? Rich, retired and struggling to fill the hours?

Inquiring minds want to know.

 

[Lelandwelds]

Just for artistic balance or something? Some electrical thing I don't understand? Coin flip?

Letting go and walking away doesn't come easy for me.

 

[Norcal]

Good one! If you build a non approved fixture by assembling approved components is it approved?

More light is better. Smoother light is better. Cheaper is better. Why 8 footers?

UL or other NRTL's do not "approve" anything, they list them, and assembling listed parts does not make a listed fixture, and the NEC does require listed fixtures.

 

[cybrdyke]

As long as your not getting inspected, or trying to sell these, you dont even need the conduit. Just use romex.
CD

 

[soj]

As long as your not getting inspected, or trying to sell these, you dont even need the conduit. Just use romex.
CD

Agreed, but the conduit maintains the spacing between the tombstones. I can't imagine trying to get the spacing right working overhead on a ladder. If the spacing is off the tube either won't go in or could fall out.

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[Falcon67]

I approve of your unapproved use of approved products.

 

[soj]

I approve of your unapproved use of approved products.

Thanks for your endorsement, but I have learned (thanks to Norcal) that nothing is approved,only "listed". I am confident that my use of listed products will never be listed. I am also confident that my unlisted contraption is safe. All the wiring is enclosed in components listed for wiring, with listed wires. And the tombstones are mounted just like they are in a listed fixture.

I am encouraged that no one has pointed out a specific safety hazard, which is one reason I posted it, for the GJ scrutiny & review process. If anyone can show me how it will burn my shop to the ground, I will take it down
Until then I am enjoying light in a former dark (well, at least dim) corner of the shop.
jp

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[aka Larry]

I am also confident that my unlisted contraption is safe.

SOJ, you have been on GJ long enough to know that it is impossible to do anything electrical that would be safe, but against the NEC.

 

[Platonic Solid]

Odds are that all the steel you used is heavier gauge than required for a budget strip light housing. In other words - it's probably safer.

 

[markhm]

You need to consider what type and gauge wire you connected to sockets. They are on recognized for specific combinations. Florescents are usually solid fixture wires in 18 ga.

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[cybrdyke]

Safety could depend on which sockets, exactly, you used. Some sockets aren't rated for bypass tubes, but this would also be true in any fixture, not just yours.
CD

 

[soj]

You need to consider what type and gauge wire you connected to sockets. They are on recognized for specific combinations. Florescents are usually solid fixture wires in 18 ga.

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I used short 18GA solid wire pigtails into the tombstone push in terminals, salvaged from a fluorescent fixture. All other wire is 12GA stranded THHN.

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[soj]

Safety could depend on which sockets, exactly, you used. Some sockets aren't rated for bypass tubes, but this would also be true in any fixture, not just yours.
CD

The tombstones (sockets) are the ones supplied by the tube vendor with their bypass tubes. So I guess I am trusting the vendor.

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[markhm]

I used short 18GA solid wire pigtails into the tombstone push in terminals, salvaged from a fluorescent fixture. All other wire is 12GA stranded THHN.

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It seems that you did things ok but it is still not a labeled fixture and the NEC requires labeled fixtures. Without a label it will fail an inspection; but you don't seem to need an inspection.

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[soj]

It seems that you did things ok but it is still not a labeled fixture and the NEC requires labeled fixtures. Without a label it will fail an inspection; but you don't seem to need an inspection.

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I can fix that. I have a label maker[emoji48].

On a more serious note, I understand how & why a label gets on a listed fixture.

And right, no inspection needed, but I still don't want to do anything unsafe.
jp

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[soj]

SOJ, you have been on GJ long enough to know that it is impossible to do anything electrical that would be safe, but against the NEC.

Larry, once again your insightful wisdom rises to the surface.

What WAS I thinking.

 

[dfiler2]

I often wonder if there aren't "different" rules for lamps. They are constantly making different fixtures on HGTV shows and they make them out of old car parts and sell them for hundreds. Steampunk lamps can be found everywhere and none of those are listed.

 

[soj]

I often wonder if there aren't "different" rules for lamps. They are constantly making different fixtures on HGTV shows and they make them out of old car parts and sell them for hundreds. Steampunk lamps can be found everywhere and none of those are listed.

I am guessing here, but the difference is, lamps are plugged in, not permanently installed. But, AFAIK, the cords, switches, sockets etc. are UL listed.
jp

 

[dfiler2]

Maybe, but many of the ones they make are fixtures for kitchens and dinning rooms.

 

[markhm]

NEC says that all lighting fixtures must be approved. There is one set of standards in America. They are written by UL. There are a bunch of labs that can certify that fixtures meet the standards. UL is one such lab and ETL is probably the second best known lab. UL is the only one that writes the standards and can certify that fixtures meet the standards. The others like ETL can only certify that the fixtures meet the UL standards.

There are separate standards for portable lamps, decorative lighting, commercial lighting, fluorescent lighting, etc. The LED standard is applied on top of the underlying lighting standard.

The standards have sections with specs for mechanical and electrical construction. Mechanical requirements are to make sure that fixtures are strong enough to support themselves, that there are no sharp edges to cut wires and that compartments will contain possible fires. Electrical specs spell out how electrical parts are used and rated. All electrical parts must be UL approved or more commonly UL recognized. They must be used per their own approvals (ie: a wire nut can't just be recognized, but must be used with a combination of quantity, gauge and type of wire specifically listed in its approval.) There is also a performance and testing section. Fixtures must be tested for temperatures, etc. They also need to survive drop tests without affecting integrity (like a wire nut coming off or a diffuser popping out). And they are tested that live power is not accessible under any possible maintenance.

When it is built to these standards, it is tested at one of the approved labs (or custom fixtures can be tested in the field (expensive!). If it is passed, it gets labeled.

There are many subtle points to consider and it is not unusual for very experienced manufacturers to submit new fixtures for approval and have them fail for something the manufacturer didn't take into account.

 

[markhm]

I forgot to add one more comment in my above post. UL is very concerned with line voltage being accessible in lighting. If a led strip has line voltage on it, it must be enclosed in a fire rated enclosure. That means it must have a glass diffuser or a relatively expensive 5VA fire rated plastic diffuser. If your LED stip is low voltage, this is not a problem.

Depending on the construction of your LED tubes, your fixtures may not qualify for approval.

 

[Platonic Solid]

Depending on the construction of your LED tubes, your fixtures may not qualify for approval.

If the tube is UL Classified Type B retrofit then there is no issue.

 

[Crazyjake8493]

Very clever, I like it!

 

[cybrdyke]

If the tube is UL Classified Type B retrofit then there is no issue.

There sure could be.
Type B are either UL recognized or UL classified as a retrofit kit, not as a lamp, therefore they are supposed to be installed into a fixture that was originally intended as a lighting fixture. Here is the wording from Maxlite on theirs:
WARNING - RISK OF FIRE OR ELECTRIC SHOCK. INSTALL THIS KIT ONLY IN LUMINAIRES THAT HAVE THE CONSTRUCTION FEATURES AND DIMENSIONS SHOWN IN THE PHOTOGRAPHS AND/OR DRAWINGS AND WHERE THE INPUT RATING OF THE RETROFIT KIT DOES NOT EXCEED THE INPUT
RATING OF THE LUMINAIRE.

THIS RETROFIT KIT IS ACCEPTED AS A COMPONENT OF A LUMINAIRE WHERE THE SUITABILITY OF THE COMBINATION SHALL BE DETERMINED BY AUTHORITIES HAVING JURISDICTION.
I'm not sure the AHJ will approve the homemade luminaire to be used with a Type B kit, but ya never know....
CD

 

[aka Larry]

Like I said SOJ, your non-UL listed non-NEC approved DIY light fixture is going to kill you.

Can you leave me your yellow cabinet in your will?

 

[cybrdyke]

Like I said SOJ, your non-UL listed non-NEC approved DIY light fixture is going to kill you.

Can you leave me your yellow cabinet in your will?

hahaha....
He's gonna burn down the whole GJ forum!

I think his xULxNEC+DIY is pretty awesome!
CD

 

[Platonic Solid]

For ultimate safety you could open a UL file and have your fixture properly listed for somewhere around $12,000. Or you could send it to me and I slap a couple labels on it and you're good to go since I have UL LED general coverage.

 

[soj]

There are many subtle points to consider and it is not unusual for very experienced manufacturers to submit new fixtures for approval and have them fail for something the manufacturer didn't take into account.

Or... maybe they did take that something into account, but were trying to cut corners.

 

[soj]

THIS RETROFIT KIT IS ACCEPTED AS A COMPONENT OF A LUMINAIRE WHERE THE SUITABILITY OF THE COMBINATION SHALL BE DETERMINED BY AUTHORITIES HAVING JURISDICTION.
I'm not sure the AHJ will approve the homemade luminaire to be used with a Type B kit, but ya never know....
CD

This post is not directed at cybrdyke, I only quoted him because of the reference to AHJs.

The AHJ has granted a temporary approval for my fixture, not realizing it was a luminaire and not knowing what type the retrofit LED tube is. The temporary approval is subject to review by the members of GJ. During this approval process all references to NEC, UL, etc. will carry less weight than a good, fact based, common sense opinion on whether it is SAFE or not. I appreciate all input based on any code, standard or listing, etc, because they do matter.

The bottom line is: Every part of the prototype fixture is a UL listed, code approved component. Box, box cover, conduit, conduit connectors, wiring, wire nuts, tombstones. All except the box cover are unaltered and used for their listed purpose. The box cover is modified to mount the tombstone, which is mounted exactly like it is in a listed fixture. I tried to watch for anything unsafe while building it, but still posted it here for input. So far I have received plenty of input, and nobody has said it is unsafe.

The temporary approval stands, and the review process is ongoing.
jp

 

[soj]

Like I said SOJ, your non-UL listed non-NEC approved DIY light fixture is going to kill you.

Not a problem Larry, I have survived worse.

Can you leave me your yellow cabinet in your will?

Get in line behind two son-in-laws.

 

[soj]

For ultimate safety you could open a UL file and have your fixture properly listed for somewhere around $12,000. Or you could send it to me and I slap a couple labels on it and you're good to go since I have UL LED general coverage.

Lets save on shipping. Send me the labels and I can do the slapping.

 

[cybrdyke]

soj, I cant see anything unsafe about it. I actually applaud your creativity. You could even do it in PVC and it would be cheaper, lighter and paintable.
CD

 

[Platonic Solid]

Lets save on shipping. Send me the labels and I can do the slapping.

That's against the rules

 

[soj]

That's against the rules

Sorry I suggested it... I wouldn't want to lead you into a life of crime!

 

[gayler]

soj, I cant see anything unsafe about it. I actually applaud your creativity. You could even do it in PVC and it would be cheaper, lighter and paintable.
CD

No PVC! It will explode, sending shrapnel flying for miles!