Should I Be Concerned?

[FarmerPete]

Two weeks ago, I started replacing a bunch of electrical outlets on our main floor. Primary reason was to install TR outlets, because I hate the plastic baby covers that my wife insisted we needed. Upon pulling out the old outlets, I noticed that my 60's built house had what I believe may be semi unique wiring. Apparently, the electricians didn't like to use wire nuts. Instead, they stripped a section of jacket off and soldered the other cable to it. They then directly attached the cable to the outlet. Hopefully the picture will give you a better idea of what's going on. The cable on the left is what was attached to the outlet. The cable on the right split off to the source on on cable and the next outlet on the chain on the other side. The splice was covered in electrical tape.

I've removed this...functionality...out of the outlets where I've encountered it. I didn't have any nuts of the appropriate size when I started the project (I didn't think I'd need them), so the first few I did I just attached both wires to their own screw on the outlet. I know that's not the preferred way to do it, since any outlet that goes bad will be hard to troubleshoot, but I don't think it will be a safety issue. My main concern is that I've been unable to find much specific info on the web about this technique. I have seen plenty of people who state that solder has no place in home AC wiring. Should I be concerned? Was this a common technique in the 60's? Should I go through the house and fix every outlet? As you can see, there does appear to be some burn marks on the wire jackets near the splice.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

That type of conection was used way back into atleast the 20s around here anyway,nothing wrong with soldering as long as the joints are taped really good to protect them.

 

[5mall5nail5]

Ugh.

Fix it all unfortunately.

 

[FarmerPete]

That type of conection was used way back into atleast the 20s around here anyway,nothing wrong with soldering as long as the joints are taped really good to protect them.

So, since my house was built in the mid 60's...?

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

It was just an electrician that had been wiring for a long time,or learned the trade from an older journeyman.
Up till a few years ago before I quit doing bigger jobs I was still soldering lots of joints on the habitat for humanity houses I was wiring.
Had a younger inspector tell me I couldnt do that across the bridge years ago.
I told him to show me where it said in the code that I couldnt,After he talked to his boss he came back and told me that he guessed I could do it!
Ive got a couple of basement finishes that I could talked into doing this week,Ill solder everything up and post pictures up here after I do it.

 

[FarmerPete]

What is the benefit of doing that over just using wire nuts? It seems like that would be faster and easier. The problem I've run in to is that if I cut out the section, I lose several inches of wire. Depending on how much wire is in the box, it may or may not make my life very difficult to rewire.

So, I shouldn't be concerned about the burn marks?

 

[Highbeam]

The burn marks were probably from the heat source used to melt the solder.

Probably a torch?

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Wire nuts in the '60's were probably a luxury that was used only on more expensive jobs (commercial) and not so much on residential. At that point in time, there was a lot of transition going on from the old wrap and twist and "diaper wrap" with electrical tape, vs those "new fangled" wire nuts.

Code does not allow solder to be used for a mechanical joint, however nothing prevents the solder from being used to "improve" the electrical connection of a mechanical joint.

Either daisy chain from receptacle to receptacle, or pigtail the receptacles by adding a pigtail with the incoming and outgoing wires and wirenut the three together.

Twisting one wire around the other, like the one in the pic, as opposed to twisting both wires together, is a poor mechanical joint, hence the added solder.

Charles

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Wire nuts in the '60's were probably a luxury that was used only on more expensive jobs (commercial) and not so much on residential. At that point in time, there was a lot of transition going on from the old wrap and twist and "diaper wrap" with electrical tape, vs those "new fangled" wire nuts.

Code does not allow solder to be used for a mechanical joint, however nothing prevents the solder from being used to "improve" the electrical connection of a mechanical joint.

Either daisy chain from receptacle to receptacle, or pigtail the receptacles by adding a pigtail with the incoming and outgoing wires and wirenut the three together.

Twisting one wire around the other, like the one in the pic, as opposed to twisting both wires together, is a poor mechanical joint, hence the added solder.

Charles

http://search.yahoo.com/r/_ylt=A0oG...://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?t=65502
Ive been soldering wires on residential jobs for 30 plus years.

 

[MrMark]

Learn something new every day. I wouldn't trust the workmanship or the taping job though. It looks bad and I consider it substandard to rely on a twist for a mechanical connection over a nut and tape over the protection of the nut.

I would get rid of all that in a heartbeat.

To answer your question: yes.

 

[FarmerPete]

Okay guys. I feel a bit better knowing that this is much more common than I anticipated. I'm also much relieved to know that the burn marks were most likely caused by the soldering process. I'll continue to remove the feature as my time and motivations continue.

 

[Rookie2]

I would be more concerned with the friction tape they wrapped the solder joint with especially the hot wire.

also, triple check those TR outlets before you install them ! I had two out of six jam up after i installed them. junk !

 

[FarmerPete]

I've tested them all. 10 for 10 as far as functioning. It takes a bit more to push a plug into them, but it's worth it to be rid of the cheap plastic covers.

 

[FarmerPete]

I didn't get the most expensive ones or anything. It was a box of 10 for $10-$20 (I forgot the exact cost).

 

[Charles (in GA)]

http://search.yahoo.com/r/_ylt=A0oG...://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?t=65502
Ive been soldering wires on residential jobs for 30 plus years.

Didn't say you could not solder the joints. Just that the code does not allow solder to make a mechanical joint. The solder has to be secondary. If the joint is not capable of holding itself together and making a proper connection without the solder, you cannot add solder for mechanical purposes of holding it together.

You find similar statements several places in the code. For example, 110.14 B. Electrical Connections - Splices, "Soldered splices shall first be spliced or joined so as to be mechanically and electrically secure without solder and then be soldered."

or

"230.81 Connection to Terminals. The service conductors shall be connected to the service disconnecting means by pressure connectors, clamps, or other approved means. Connections that depend on solder shall not be used"

Charles

 

[digdug18]

What is the benefit of doing that over just using wire nuts?

The benefit is the electrician can get high off of the lead solder.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Didn't say you could not solder the joints. Just that the code does not allow solder to make a mechanical joint. The solder has to be secondary. If the joint is not capable of holding itself together and making a proper connection without the solder, you cannot add solder for mechanical purposes of holding it together.

You find similar statements several places in the code. For example, 110.14 B. Electrical Connections - Splices, "Soldered splices shall first be spliced or joined so as to be mechanically and electrically secure without solder and then be soldered."

or

"230.81 Connection to Terminals. The service conductors shall be connected to the service disconnecting means by pressure connectors, clamps, or other approved means. Connections that depend on solder shall not be used"

Charles