Simple wall recepticle question

[vern1]

Heres a pic of my switch. The switch on the right is only showing around 20v at the wires and not turning on the lights. The one on the left shows over 100v and is fine.

The working one has the 3rd red wire screwing in to that switch on a screw on the left side of the switch. The non working switch does not have the 3rd wire nor the screw on the side

Any ideas

Thank you

 

[cmanningjr]

The one on the left is a 3 way switch.... The one on the right is a single pole..

Sounds like you've lost a neutral somewhere...

 

[KevinMB]

Your picture shows both a three way and two way switches. The switch with three wires is a three way most likely controlling a light from two or more switches. The one with two wires controls the light from this switch alone. How did you measure the voltage for the two way switch (two wires)? Thanks

 

[cmanningjr]

Your picture shows both a three way and two way switches. The switch with three wires is a three way most likely controlling a light from two or more switches. The one with two wires controls the light from this switch alone. How did you measure the voltage for the two way switch (two wires)? Thanks

To measure voltage on the "two way" or single pole switch, you would put your red lead on one of the screws to find your hot and your black lead on the neutral. In this case the neutral is the two white wires twisted together behind the switch on the right.....A single pole...lol

 

[vern1]

I originally measured just between the 2 wires on the switch. So is there something wrong here or is the issue somewhere else ie with the light itself?
Thanks

 

[vern1]

Your picture shows both a three way and two way switches. The switch with three wires is a three way most likely controlling a light from two or more switches. The one with two wires controls the light from this switch alone. How did you measure the voltage for the two way switch (two wires)? Thanks

And yes the 3 way can be turned off/on from 2 different switches and the 2 way controls just 1 light (although none at this point as its not working)

Thanks

 

[Slowgsr]

It's hard to diagnose a situation being explained when the person explaining it isn't giving the needed information. Which is common since the asker can't figure out the problem.

You need to open up the light.

Try this first.
Turn on the left switch - should be 0V between the black screws.
Turn off the switch - go from the box (ground) to the top of the switch, and then to the bottom of the switch. One will have 0v one will have 120v identifying line/load.
Turn the switch on - check from your load screw to the box, should be 120v

If that passes, your switch is OK. Repeat checking to neutral instead of the box. Make sure the neutral joint is good.

This will tell you if your neutral is good at the box. If not, you need to find what device is feeding this switch. If not fed directly from the panel.

If your neutral is good at the box, and the joint is good. Check for power, and neutral at the light. You always check for power by going from hot wire to ground, then you can check for neutral by going from hot to neutral once you've established you have 120v.

If your neutral to hot voltage is wacky like.. 87v or 102v you have a failed neutral.

 

[cmanningjr]

I originally measured just between the 2 wires on the switch. So is there something wrong here or is the issue somewhere else ie with the light itself?
Thanks

Ok, With your Volt meter set to AC Volts...Unscrew the wire nut on the 2 white wires twisted together. Take the RED lead and touch it to ONE screw on the switch on the right. Touch the BLACK lead to the 2 white wires twisted together. This will tell you the voltage AT the switch....

If the switch is turned ON, You should be able to read voltage on BOTH wires/screws.. If you don't, then the switch is bad....

 

[Slowgsr]

Ok, With your Volt meter set to AC Volts...Unscrew the wire nut on the 2 white wires twisted together. Take the RED lead and touch it to ONE screw on the switch on the right. Touch the BLACK lead to the 2 white wires twisted together. This will tell you the voltage AT the switch....

If the switch is turned ON, You should be able to read voltage on BOTH wires/screws.. If you don't, then the switch is bad....

Until proper voltage from line to ground has been established you should not use the neutral to reference if the switch is live.

 

[Zeke]

Ok, With your Volt meter set to AC Volts...Unscrew the wire nut on the 2 white wires twisted together. Take the RED lead and touch it to ONE screw on the switch on the right. Touch the BLACK lead to the 2 white wires twisted together. This will tell you the voltage AT the switch....

If the switch is turned ON, You should be able to read voltage on BOTH wires/screws.. If you don't, then the switch is bad....

Until proper voltage from line to ground has been established you should not use the neutral to reference if the switch is live.

Well, he could do the same by touching the bare neutral.

 

[cmanningjr]

Until proper voltage from line to ground has been established you should not use the neutral to reference if the switch is live.

 

[cmanningjr]

Well, he could do the same by touching the bare neutral.

You mean ground......

 

[vern1]

Thanks, will tackle this next weekend as I ran out of time today

Slowgsr, you said left switch but I presume you mean the right one in the photo ie the 2 way switch with the 2 wires? Am not having a problem with the 3way

And yes apologies of I am not providing the right info

Thanks

 

[wyliesdiesels]

I originally measured just between the 2 wires on the switch. So is there something wrong here or is the issue somewhere else ie with the light itself?
Thanks

That wont tell u anything. One wire is the feed and the other is the switch leg. When the switch is on, theyre the same wire.

As has been said U need to measure from the feed wire(one of the black wires) to the metal box.

If u get nothing with the first wire, try the second.

If u get no voltage on either, then theres a problem with the feed into the box.

How did u measure voltage on the 3-way switch?

 

[theoldwizard1]

The 20V could be just "ghost voltage".

 

[Milton Shaw]

Where are you measuring the 20 volt. Are you measuring from the black wires to the two neutrals in the wirenut. That or to the ground is the only place you should be connecting to . Otherwise you are not really measuring between hot and neutral. The other two whites connected to the other switch are not neutrals.

 

[justsam]

Has this light circuit ever worked to your knowledge?

Does the three way work properly at each of the locations?

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Where are you measuring the 20 volt. Are you measuring from the black wires to the two neutrals in the wirenut. That or to the ground is the only place you should be connecting to . Otherwise you are not really measuring between hot and neutral. The other two whites connected to the other switch are not neutrals.

He said he measured between the 2 wires on the switch- the feed and switch leg which is the wrong spot to measure.

Has this light circuit ever worked to your knowledge?

Does the three way work properly at each of the locations?

He said the 3-way works.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

I originally measured just between the 2 wires on the switch. So is there something wrong here or is the issue somewhere else ie with the light itself?
Thanks

You can check the voltage on the single pole pretty easily as long as the switch is in the off position and the bulb is good it will show voltage.
On the 3w it depends on having 1 lead on the common and the other on the right traveler to read voltage,again the bulb needs to be good to read the voltage on the circuit.

 

[Mustang51js]

Looking at the pics,looks like a diy-er did that electric. Looks like the wires arent twisted in the wirenuts so i would put money on a loose nuetral in one of the boxes. What do these switches control.

 

[Mustang51js]

Also looks like they are using the neutral as a common for the 3 way,so you wont get any readings on that unless switch is off

 

[justsam]

I see nothing wrong with the wiring on the 2 way switch. Leave switch connected, measure voltage between either of the switch terminals with the switch ON, and the metal box, you should see 120VAC. If hot good, then check wiring and light fixture. If not hot, check power feed into box which should be one of the blk/wh Romex next to the switch.

 

[CJ7VFR]

Have you checked to see if there is continuity between the two terminals of the 2-way switch when the switch is in the "ON" position?

You may just have a bad switch with internal problems. Do a simple continuity check by disconnecting the two black wires from the 2-way switch and check to see if you get continuity between the two terminals when you flip the switch on and off.

It is very uncommon for switches to go bad internally, but it CAN happen, and sometimes the simplest check can avoid a lot of headaches looking other places for the problem.

Jim

 

[Zeke]

You mean ground......

Yes. I goofed.

 

[vern1]

Just an update. There is no power when testing both wires to the box. I also replaced the switch just to make sure and the light does not come on so its not the switch.

Could the issue be with the 2 white wires screwed together in the box? Otherwise it would seem that the wire is not getting power from the panel or wherever it is coming from. If that is the case then its beyond my capabilities and I will have to live without the light or get a professional.

And yes the light did work before and the 3 way continues to work

Thanks for the help

 

[Dustball]

Have you checked the circuit breaker for that switch? I wouldn't be surprised if the 3-way and the 2-way switches were on different breakers.

 

[vern1]

Yes no breakers have been tripped

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Just an update. There is no power when testing both wires to the box. I also replaced the switch just to make sure and the light does not come on so its not the switch.

Could the issue be with the 2 white wires screwed together in the box? Otherwise it would seem that the wire is not getting power from the panel or wherever it is coming from. If that is the case then its beyond my capabilities and I will have to live without the light or get a professional.

And yes the light did work before and the 3 way continues to work

Thanks for the help

So u tested from 3-way to grounded box and got 120v?

And then from each of the black wires of single pole switch and got nothing?

If so, then the white wires dont matter. Its an issue with the supply upstream...

 

[vern1]

So u tested from 3-way to grounded box and got 120v?

And then from each of the black wires of single pole switch and got nothing?

If so, then the white wires dont matter. Its an issue with the supply upstream...

Yes I tested the 3 way and got 120 and nothing on the 2 way

 

[lonestarky]

Yes I tested the 3 way and got 120 and nothing on the 2 way

If you have no voltage difference from either black wire on the right switch to the box itself, you are not getting 120vac to those wires. Means the power to that switch is disconnected somewhere. Have you pulled any other receptacles if you have no tripped breakers?

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

 

[Bigbandguy]

Suggest using a neon tester at the point where power is supposed to exit the breaker for that circuit. First cycle the breaker. Sometimes they are tripped and do not look tripped... Then see if power is present on the switch side of the breaker. If so then it is either a connection (likely ) or a broken wire. Probably a twist connection inside a wire nut that was not properly tight and not making good contact. I'll bet you find that it is something simple.