Skipped Size Rant

[Downwindtracker 2]

Again I'm annoyed with a tool company. This time it's Gearwrench/Canadian Tire. I bought a set of stubby ratcheting wrenches on sale for 60% off , $35. Good price. It's missing 17mm and 19mm. In over 50 years of pulling on wrenches, 17mm has been one of the most commonly used metric. It'll cost me $50 for a couple of Jet ones to my door. Last time it was Williams with the plain stubbies, again Jet made the sizes. BTW a full Jet set of stubby ratcheting wrenches is $153.Rant off.

 

[BrandoJames]

Hmmm, $35 is really cheap for a wrench set. Did you simply not check the size range, or did they not ship the full set. I’m thinking that 17mm & 19mm are large fasteners for a stubby wrench. You don’t have a lot of leverage with that length. Anyway, sorry this happened to you.

 

[jdewitt]

I'm guessing they are designed with skips in order to make a set for a lower price point and/or so you have to buy the singles later.

 

[Downwindtracker 2]

My guess, too. They did include 16mm? and 18mm. Oh that $35 was even cheaper. those were .75 Canadian dollars.

 

[n8n]

Agree with your comment however 17 and 19 are old DIN sizes and are now obsolete. Having started off working on 80s VWs however I have probably used those in my life far more than the modern ISO 16 and 18 and in fact those latter two wrenches in my toolbox probably have next to no use on them

 

[bwringer]

It's a common "gotcha".

I was considering some inexpensive sets yesterday, but they had no 12 or 14mm. I mean, WTF?

Maybe this stuff sells primarily around Christmas to the well-meaning but ignorant relations of tool-using primates.

 

[n8n]

It's a common "gotcha".

I was considering some inexpensive sets yesterday, but they had no 12 or 14mm. I mean, WTF?

Maybe this stuff sells primarily around Christmas to the well-meaning but ignorant relations of tool-using primates.

Again, I have never used 12 or 14mm mostly working on old German cars that use DIN standards. You may need them however if you work on Japanese stuff (JIS) or more modern cars using ISO standards.

I thought metric was supposed to simplify things LOL

this illustrates the issue

https://www.boltdepot.com/fastener-information/bolts/metric-bolt-head-size.aspx

the only truly useless sizes appear to be 9, 15, 20, 23 out of a common set by 1mm

 

[Don1357]

This is not uncommon. I have never bought, even though I have lusted for them for decades, a set of ratcheting wrenches because every set I have ever seen at a decent price had these holes in the series. I do old school VW stuff, 17mm is an extremely common size and there are 19mm nuts here and there.

 

[ssdave]

....

 

[englishsam]

the only truly useless sizes appear to be 9, 15, 20, 23 out of a common set by 1mm

Easy...

I use 9mm more than you'd think. Brake calliper bleeders are common. I use it for other stuff as well.

 

[Wrench97]

I bought the Tekton 1/2" impact sockets for use at the house not realizing their was no 16mm.................................it seems to be becoming more popular for 10mm nuts.

 

[GrantCee]

At the moment I have an '87 Mitsubishi Montero, a 2006 Saab, and a New Holland (Shibura-made) tractor. In the past I've had Fiats, Moto Guzzis, Suzuki 4wd cars, and Volvos. Over the years I've needed almost every socket in my non-skip sets (including 9mm.)

I don't buy sets with skips, because a) every maker skips different sizes, and b) I'm likely to have a vehicle that demands exactly the size they skipped, no matter what it is!

 

[Downwindtracker 2]

A point about 10mm bolts, a very common size. Think 3/8". You have 15mm (a logical size), 16 mm and 17mm. Boy

I started out working on French Simcas with their 11mm, then Italian Fiats, Swedish Volvos and then German Rabbits. They are really Audis, not VWs. At work, it was machinery from around the world. 17mm in all of them.

 

[M6erfan]

I'd be lost without 9mm. Try to take out a Mikuni needle valve seat without one...

 

[joel63]

At the moment I have an '87 Mitsubishi Montero, a 2006 Saab, and a New Holland (Shibura-made) tractor. In the past I've had Fiats, Moto Guzzis, Suzuki 4wd cars, and Volvos. Over the years I've needed almost every socket in my non-skip sets (including 9mm.)

I don't buy sets with skips, because a) every maker skips different sizes, and b) I'm likely to have a vehicle that demands exactly the size they skipped, no matter what it is!

Even 20, 23, and 26mm?

 

[Fedwrench]

the only truly useless sizes appear to be 9, 15, 20, 23 out of a common set by 1mm

Try working on a late model domestic vehicle without a 15 mm

 

[American Locomotive]

I was gonna say, 15mm is a very common size used in European and American equipment and vehicles.

17 and 19mm are extremely common on Japanese vehicles. Seems really short-sighted to not have a 17 or 19mm.

Also, FWIW: 19mm cheats with 3/4 almost perfectly.

 

[GrantCee]

Even 20, 23, and 26mm?

Funny you should ask. A couple of weeks ago I was working on the windshield wipers of the Montero. Had to take the whole linkage out to free up the passenger side shaft. Guess what size the retaining nuts on those shafts are?

Yep — 23mm.

 

[Don1357]

One super power worth having is not giving a damn if one or more of your sockets are not the same brand as the rest of your set. I have both mm and SAE on both 6 and 12 point sockets. If you look at my sets you may notice that some are slightly different in size, because the original got misplaced and eventually got replaced with whatever (quality) socket I was able to source.

On the big sizes I only have what I actually needed from whatever (quality) brand was available. For instance on the large sizes of mm I have/needed 27mm, 36mm, and 42mm. No point getting the in-between sizes I'm not likely to ever need.

 

[Kscardsfan]

One super power worth having is not giving a damn if one or more of your sockets are not the same brand as the rest of your set. I have both mm and SAE on both 6 and 12 point sockets. If you look at my sets you may notice that some are slightly different in size, because the original got misplaced and eventually got replaced with whatever (quality) socket I was able to source.

On the big sizes I only have what I actually needed from whatever (quality) brand was available. For instance on the large sizes of mm I have/needed 27mm, 36mm, and 42mm. No point getting the in-between sizes I'm not likely to ever need.

I try to maintain continuity as much as I can within my sets, but they get completed and filled out with whatever is priced right and available.

 

[BlakeTheCarGuy]

I use 17 and 19 on a daily basis. I just finished doing some suspension work and used both of those sizes so that would drive me crazy also use 14 regularly too.


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[BrandoJames]

I own two Toyotas and a Ford truck: 2002 Camry, 2010 Corolla, 2009 Ranger.

Sizes I use (in mm): 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 17, 19 and 20-21 for lugnuts.
Sizes never used: 9, 11, 16, 18.

Just wondering if that's typical for American & Japanese vehicles, or is it more specific to the make/models that I own. Thanks.

 

[teal95]

Many of the suspension bolts on fox body Mustangs are 18 mm.

 

[m6z]

I'm firmly in the "all the sizes" camp and make my purchases accordingly.

I've worked on quite an assortment of stuff over the years though.

 

[bushmechanic]

Even 20, 23, and 26mm?

I use a 27mm quite frequently.

 

[snickers muncher]

I just did the brakes on the wife's Dodge Caliber. 19mm for the lug nuts and then 18mm for the caliper bracket bolts. Who the heck made that decision?

Try working on a late model domestic vehicle without a 15 mm

My 86 camaro has 15mm, so it's not just late models.

 

[bwringer]

I own two Toyotas and a Ford truck: 2002 Camry, 2010 Corolla, 2009 Ranger.

Sizes I use (in mm): 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 17, 19 and 20-21 for lugnuts.
Sizes never used: 9, 11, 16, 18.

Just wondering if that's typical for American & Japanese vehicles, or is it more specific to the make/models that I own. Thanks.

16 & 18mm do pop up in a lot of American brand vehicles.


I'm a "completionist", but since all the stuff I work on most frequently is Asian brands, I keep the sizes I'll need for those on a separate rack in the front, and the rest goes in the back for the rare occasions I need it. It's faster and less confuzzling.

So, for example, in the front of my toolbox is a 3/8" socket rail with:
8, 10, 12, 14, 17, 19, 21 shallow and deeo sockets.

I have all the other sizes, of course, but they're in the back on a different socket rail.

 

[ssdave]

....

 

[GrantCee]

Must be a difference between vehicle specific mechanics and more universal use. I run into 8mm and 16mm a lot on non-vehicle imported equipment. Same with a lot of the other sizes that people say are unused. I have personal Ford and Toyota vehicles, but do a lot of varied work on equipment. Used 8mm this week on a motor I was disassembling, that was metric, so it wasn't the 5/16" size. Used 16 on something else, don't remember what, and it was a metric threaded bolt, so wasn't 5/8".

Between industrial and vehicle use, I find that nearly all the sizes are used frequently, except for some of them around the 30mm size that never see use.

My wife's Saab has a bunch of 8mm fasteners. Replacing the A/C compressor and condenser this week, and I've used the 8mm socket more than any other.

 

[Downwindtracker 2]

Certainly Not a stubby wrench, but 30mm is super common on machinery, it's the head size for 20mm bolts and nuts. Though guys on this site say they have found 32mm, I haven't.

 

[Wrench97]

8mm is common size on many Fords also.

 

[GrantCee]

Certainly Not a stubby wrench, but 30mm is super common on machinery, it's the head size for 20mm bolts and nuts. Though guys on this site say they have found 32mm, I haven't.

I've definitely used my 32mm standard length, but for what I can't recall. Probably something on a tractor or one of the implements.

My 30mm sockets, on the other hand, are still clean!

 

[M6erfan]

Though guys on this site say they have found 32mm, I haven't.

BMW fan clutch nut

 

[Downwindtracker 2]

On industrial machinery that is. On older machinery they would have used a 3/4" bolt, with it's 1 1/16" for nyloc. 1 1/8" standard and 1 1/4" structural sizes. And I forgot what size heavy took. 1 5/16" ???

When started working on my Fiat, I started coming across 8mm head sizes , And "They expect this, to work."

 

[bushmechanic]

I think the lesson here is that people use all the sizes, and the marketing teams for these manufacturers are out of date idiots.

This is no different than lug nuts being sold in packs of four, or screws being sold in packs of precisely one less than you need. Someone ought to beat the snot out of those people and send them back to school.

It's extra **** in the landfill or clogging up a garage, being bought when it's not needed, because someone couldn't figure out how to make a buck properly.

 

[n8n]

Try working on a late model domestic vehicle without a 15 mm

I try not to work on late model domestic vehicles, so I'll take your word for it [emoji14]

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[BrandoJames]

the only truly useless sizes appear to be 9, 15, 20, 23 out of a common set by 1mm

I use 15mm quite a bit on my John Deere riding mower--all the mower pulleys have a 15mm nut. During mowing season, I just leave a 15mm socket on my long-handled Titan 3/8" flex ratchet. Whenever the Deere throws or breaks a mower belt, out comes the Titan with a 15mm Blue Point socket.

 

[Ton ton]

I think the lesson here is that people use all the sizes, and the marketing teams for these manufacturers are out of date idiots.

This is no different than lug nuts being sold in packs of four, or screws being sold in packs of precisely one less than you need. Someone ought to beat the snot out of those people and send them back to school.

It's extra **** in the landfill or clogging up a garage, being bought when it's not needed, because someone couldn't figure out how to make a buck properly.

I agree with you.

 

[Ign]

One super power worth having is not giving a damn if one or more of your sockets are not the same brand as the rest of your set. I have both mm and SAE on both 6 and 12 point sockets. If you look at my sets you may notice that some are slightly different in size, because the original got misplaced and eventually got replaced with whatever (quality) socket I was able to source.

On the big sizes I only have what I actually needed from whatever (quality) brand was available. For instance on the large sizes of mm I have/needed 27mm, 36mm, and 42mm. No point getting the in-between sizes I'm not likely to ever need.

Combine that super power with trolling AWD for wrenches, ratcheting wrenches or sockets and you can fill skips cheap. Not sure if this would work for OP in Canaduh though

 

[Downwindtracker 2]

It's spelled Canada, eh. My inlaws on the prairies use eh a lot. I grew up on the coast where it was almost never used.